Montana Marv Posted February 5, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 3,135 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 1,091 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted February 5, 2014 Is the rapture really going to take place or do all saints expect to enter the tribulation? There are so many saints already in tribulation in Africa, the Middle East and elsewhere in the world that the question is almost moot. Well said i wonder why are they not raptured away Because the Church/Bride has not been completed. There are still individuals who must come into the family. When the Bride is complete, the Bride will go into the Rapture. In Christ Montana Marv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENOCH2010 Posted February 6, 2014 Group: Senior Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 907 Content Per Day: 0.20 Reputation: 382 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/07/1866 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Is the rapture really going to take place or do all saints expect to enter the tribulation? There are so many saints already in tribulation in Africa, the Middle East and elsewhere in the world that the question is almost moot. Well said i wonder why are they not raptured away Because the Church/Bride has not been completed. There are still individuals who must come into the family. When the Bride is complete, the Bride will go into the Rapture. In Christ Montana Marv Marv that happens after the all the ones beheaded for not taking the mark are added, or do you think they aren't going to be part of the family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzel Posted February 6, 2014 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 514 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 62 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1989 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I'm ignorant about the rapture, it baffles me, so I take no sides on the matter, but I can't help wondering how a pre-Trib could occur without people noticing. One day somebody is at work and his Christian friend magically disappears. Cars are suddenly left with no drivers and what.... crash? Atheists are always mocking Christians about the rapture. Even they will be able to put two and two together and realise that all the people who disappeared were Christians, they they'll realise that the Christians were right. They'll all start reading Bibles and there'll be no need for a Tribulation because everybody will be on the look out for the Beast. Plus, the chaos caused by a billion or so disappearing Christians would be a tribulation in itself. All those crashed cars, crashed planes, companies with half their work force missing, families with missing relatives, patients dying on the operating table because the surgeon and the anaesthetist vanished into thin air... and so on. I'd like to believe in the pre-Trib rapture but logistically, it doesn't make sense for what will come afterwards. The question is what will happen to the christians that believe there is a rapture and there was none and they are faced with the great tribulation they will take the mark because they were not prepared mentally and spiritually Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzel Posted February 6, 2014 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 514 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 62 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1989 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Is the rapture really going to take place or do all saints expect to enter the tribulation? There are so many saints already in tribulation in Africa, the Middle East and elsewhere in the world that the question is almost moot. Well said i wonder why are they not raptured away Because the Church/Bride has not been completed. There are still individuals who must come into the family. When the Bride is complete, the Bride will go into the Rapture. In Christ Montana Marv the church is taken at the last trump not before the 1st trump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Marv Posted February 6, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 3,135 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 1,091 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted February 6, 2014 Is the rapture really going to take place or do all saints expect to enter the tribulation? There are so many saints already in tribulation in Africa, the Middle East and elsewhere in the world that the question is almost moot. Well said i wonder why are they not raptured away Because the Church/Bride has not been completed. There are still individuals who must come into the family. When the Bride is complete, the Bride will go into the Rapture. In Christ Montana Marv Marv that happens after the all the ones beheaded for not taking the mark are added, or do you think they aren't going to be part of the family. Enoch They are not part of the Bride. Those of the Bride are to ask for forgiveness for those who harm us. These who are beheaded are asking to be avenged. Christ told us to forgive, forgive, forgive. Taking vengeance or asking for it is not in our vocabulary. In Christ Montana Marv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Marv Posted February 6, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 3,135 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 1,091 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted February 6, 2014 Is the rapture really going to take place or do all saints expect to enter the tribulation? There are so many saints already in tribulation in Africa, the Middle East and elsewhere in the world that the question is almost moot. Well said i wonder why are they not raptured away Because the Church/Bride has not been completed. There are still individuals who must come into the family. When the Bride is complete, the Bride will go into the Rapture. In Christ Montana Marv the church is taken at the last trump not before the 1st trump The Last Trump and the 7 Trumpet judgments are not the same. In Christ Montana Marv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted February 6, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,247 Content Per Day: 3.32 Reputation: 16,659 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted February 6, 2014 Rev. 1:5-6 To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood, and has made us kings and priests to His God and Father--- Rev. 4:4 Around the throne were 24 thrones, and on the thrones I saw 24 elders sitting, clothed in white robes; and they had crowns of gold on their heads. Rev. 5:9b-10 For You were slain and have redeemed us to God by your blood out of every tribe and nation, and have made us kings and priests to our God; And we shall reign on earth. NKJV The 24 elders were Christians--only Christians, saved by the blood of Christ, were made both kings and priests to serve the Father. I believe that the seals then began the great tribulation and the one on the white horse was a false Christ or antichrist. Under the fifth seal was the SOULS of the martyrs. 5:11 then white robes were given to them and they were told to wait a little longer till the number of their brethern, who would be killed as they were, was completed. The sixth seal starts THE WRATH OF GOD Rev.6:12--the earthquakes, the sun became black, the moon as blood, the stars fell to the earth. v.15b fall on us and hide us from Him that sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! Christians were to pray that they be counted worthy to escape the wrath of God. Luke 21: 25-27 recounts the same signs in the sun moon and stars and states v28 Now when these things BEGIN to happen, look up and lift us your heads, because your redemption draws near. V.36 watch therefore, and pray always that you may be COUNTED WORTHY TO ESCAPE ALL THESE THINGS THAT WILL COME TO PASS, AND TO STAND BEFORE THE SON OF MAN. 1 Thess 1:10 and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, even JESUS WHO DELIVERS US FROM THE WRATH TO COME. 1 Thess 5:9-10 For GOD DID NOT APPOINT US TO WRATH, BUT TO OBTAIN SALVATION THROUGH OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST, who died for us that whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with Him. NKJV 2 Thess 2:1 NASV with regard to 1. the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and 2. our gathering together to Him, 3b it will not come unless the APOSTASY come first, and the MAN OF LAWLESSNESS IS REVEALED. NASV (---v.4 who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God. v.9 That is the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders, and with all deception of wickedness FOR THOSE WHO PERISH, because THEY DID NOT RECEIVE THE LOVE OF THE TRUTH SO AS TO BE SAVED.) From this point on the 144,000 Jews are sealed of the 12 tribes of Israel. They must go through the trib but are sealed and protected by God.--probably sealed as we are with the seal of the Holy Spirit. But seen in heaven are 7:9 a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the Throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes with palm branches in their hands, THIS IS THE CHURCH IN HEAVEN. 7:14 THESE ARE ONES WHO COME OUT OF GREAT TRIBULATION AND HAVE WASHED THEIR ROBES AND MADE THEM WHITE IN THE BLOOD OF THE LAMB.. NASV. So in Rev. 4 we see the 24 elders who are Christians in heaven prior to the tribulation. But we don't see the greatest part of the church already in heaven till the very beginning of the wrath. They came OUT OF THE GREAT TRIB. We are preserved from the wrath for sure, A portion of the Jews will be preserved while going through the wrath. The letters to the churches promises to those who overcome: Some will overcome and eat of the tree of life. Some will have trib for 10 days but will receive the crown of life. Some will be given hidden manna, a white stone and a new name. Some will receive authority over the nations. Some He will confess before His Father Some He will keep from the hour of testing which will come on the whole earth and will be made a piller in the temple of God in the new Jeruselem. Some will be granted to sit with Christ on His throne. My churches have taught pre-trib. I see only a promise that the faithful will not endure the wrath. But we are to pray that we are counted worthy to escape ALL THESE THINGS, which probably includes the first part of the great trib as well. Perhaps some will be caught up pre-trib as in the 24 elders and the church at Philadelphia. But many Christians have been martyred and many more shall be during the great trib. The wrath was not intended for faithful Christians. It was intended for those who have rejected Christ and the truth. At the end of the wrath Christ shall return with His Saints, the church, to fight the antichrist with the sword of His mouth. Rev. 19:14 1 Thess 3:13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzel Posted February 6, 2014 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 514 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 62 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1989 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Rev. 1:5-6 To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood, and has made us kings and priests to His God and Father--- Rev. 4:4 Around the throne were 24 thrones, and on the thrones I saw 24 elders sitting, clothed in white robes; and they had crowns of gold on their heads. Rev. 5:9b-10 For You were slain and have redeemed us to God by your blood out of every tribe and nation, and have made us kings and priests to our God; And we shall reign on earth. NKJV The 24 elders were Christians--only Christians, saved by the blood of Christ, were made both kings and priests to serve the Father. I believe that the seals then began the great tribulation and the one on the white horse was a false Christ or antichrist. Under the fifth seal was the SOULS of the martyrs. 5:11 then white robes were given to them and they were told to wait a little longer till the number of their brethern, who would be killed as they were, was completed. The sixth seal starts THE WRATH OF GOD Rev.6:12--the earthquakes, the sun became black, the moon as blood, the stars fell to the earth. v.15b fall on us and hide us from Him that sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! Christians were to pray that they be counted worthy to escape the wrath of God. Luke 21: 25-27 recounts the same signs in the sun moon and stars and states v28 Now when these things BEGIN to happen, look up and lift us your heads, because your redemption draws near. V.36 watch therefore, and pray always that you may be COUNTED WORTHY TO ESCAPE ALL THESE THINGS THAT WILL COME TO PASS, AND TO STAND BEFORE THE SON OF MAN. 1 Thess 1:10 and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, even JESUS WHO DELIVERS US FROM THE WRATH TO COME. 1 Thess 5:9-10 For GOD DID NOT APPOINT US TO WRATH, BUT TO OBTAIN SALVATION THROUGH OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST, who died for us that whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with Him. NKJV 2 Thess 2:1 NASV with regard to 1. the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and 2. our gathering together to Him, 3b it will not come unless the APOSTASY come first, and the MAN OF LAWLESSNESS IS REVEALED. NASV (---v.4 who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God. v.9 That is the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders, and with all deception of wickedness FOR THOSE WHO PERISH, because THEY DID NOT RECEIVE THE LOVE OF THE TRUTH SO AS TO BE SAVED.) From this point on the 144,000 Jews are sealed of the 12 tribes of Israel. They must go through the trib but are sealed and protected by God.--probably sealed as we are with the seal of the Holy Spirit. But seen in heaven are 7:9 a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the Throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes with palm branches in their hands, THIS IS THE CHURCH IN HEAVEN. 7:14 THESE ARE ONES WHO COME OUT OF GREAT TRIBULATION AND HAVE WASHED THEIR ROBES AND MADE THEM WHITE IN THE BLOOD OF THE LAMB.. NASV. So in Rev. 4 we see the 24 elders who are Christians in heaven prior to the tribulation. But we don't see the greatest part of the church already in heaven till the very beginning of the wrath. They came OUT OF THE GREAT TRIB. We are preserved from the wrath for sure, A portion of the Jews will be preserved while going through the wrath. The letters to the churches promises to those who overcome: Some will overcome and eat of the tree of life. Some will have trib for 10 days but will receive the crown of life. Some will be given hidden manna, a white stone and a new name. Some will receive authority over the nations. Some He will confess before His Father Some He will keep from the hour of testing which will come on the whole earth and will be made a piller in the temple of God in the new Jeruselem. Some will be granted to sit with Christ on His throne. My churches have taught pre-trib. I see only a promise that the faithful will not endure the wrath. But we are to pray that we are counted worthy to escape ALL THESE THINGS, which probably includes the first part of the great trib as well. Perhaps some will be caught up pre-trib as in the 24 elders and the church at Philadelphia. But many Christians have been martyred and many more shall be during the great trib. The wrath was not intended for faithful Christians. It was intended for those who have rejected Christ and the truth. At the end of the wrath Christ shall return with His Saints, the church, to fight the antichrist with the sword of His mouth. Rev. 19:14 1 Thess 3:13 Who is a saint ? 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other one Posted February 6, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,227 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,950 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted February 6, 2014 I don't think any of us will have to suffer Gods wrath........ I believe the Beasts already have plans to take care of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjp34652 Posted February 7, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 448 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 156 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/19/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted February 7, 2014 I don't think any of us will have to suffer Gods wrath........ I believe the Beasts already have plans to take care of that. Get into sin and you'll find out just how fast you'll suffer wrath. God hates sin. When it happens He tends to lose His cherub like demeanor. Who do you think the Beast takes orders from? Is God - God? Or is the Beast - god? You can't have one without the other. Somebody is on top and that somebody is the One running the show. It is better to fear the Lord of the second death than to fear the Beast who can kill but once. Do not flirt with sin and do not think for a moment that a church membership card will shield you from divine punishment. I have wrestled with the Almighty and lost. Do NOT tease yourself with notions of special treatment. Cross the line and you lose it…so fast it will make your head spin. and that's just me, hollering from the choir loft... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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