Luke 16:19-31 The Rich Man and Lazarus

[Guest DRS81]

22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains. (Deu 32:18-22 KJV)

 

The word "Hell" here is "Hades"

 

The burning in Hades is not an eternal burning of the lost. It's suffering the anger of God which is what happened to the priesthood, they suffered God's judgment and the kingdom was taken from them and given to the apostles just as Jesus had said.

 

Deu 32:22 is not talking about the afterlife. STOP twisting the word of God. Deu 32 fire and hell has nothing to do with Luke 16. Luke 16 is talking about the afterlife. The angels in Luke 16 are from heaven, and heaven is in the afterlife. PERIOD.

 

Heaven is the opposite of Hell? How's that?

 

Is this a serious question.

[Butch5]

 

22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains. (Deu 32:18-22 KJV)

 

The word "Hell" here is "Hades"

 

The burning in Hades is not an eternal burning of the lost. It's suffering the anger of God which is what happened to the priesthood, they suffered God's judgment and the kingdom was taken from them and given to the apostles just as Jesus had said.

 

Deu 32:22 is not talking about the afterlife. STOP twisting the word of God. Deu 32 fire and hell has nothing to do with Luke 16. Luke 16 is talking about the afterlife. The angels in Luke 16 are from heaven, and heaven is in the afterlife. PERIOD.

 

Heaven is the opposite of Hell? How's that?

 

Is this a serious question.

 

Luke 16 isn't taking about the afterlife either. Jesus simply made up a story to make a point to the priesthood of  Israel. You've not supplied any evidence whatsoever that there is a spirit in man that can exist after death.

 

Additionally, you've not supplied any evidence that Luke 16 is about the afterlife other than your opinion. I've given you multiple reasons how it can be understood differently and within the context of both the historical setting and the surrounding text. To say, it speaks of angles means it's about the afterlife is a non sequitur. The word "Angel" simply means messenger. It could be a being from the spirit world or it could be a person. 

 

 

Yes, it's a serious question. 

[Guest DRS81]

Additionally, you've not supplied any evidence that Luke 16 is about the afterlife other than your opinion. I've given you multiple reasons how it can be understood differently and within the context of both the historical setting and the surrounding text. To say, it speaks of angles means it's about the afterlife is a non sequitur. The word "Angel" simply means messenger. It could be a being from the spirit world or it could be a person. 

 

Luke 16 is talking about the afterlife, the beggar and the rich man died! Angels are not my opinion, ANGELS are in Luke 16:22. Luke 16:22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried.23In hell, where he was in torment.

[Butch5]

 

Additionally, you've not supplied any evidence that Luke 16 is about the afterlife other than your opinion. I've given you multiple reasons how it can be understood differently and within the context of both the historical setting and the surrounding text. To say, it speaks of angles means it's about the afterlife is a non sequitur. The word "Angel" simply means messenger. It could be a being from the spirit world or it could be a person. 

 

Luke 16 is talking about the afterlife, the beggar and the rich man died! Angels are not my opinion, ANGELS are in Luke 16:22. Luke 16:22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried.23In hell, where he was in torment.

 

Just because Jesus made up a story about someone who apparently is alive after death doesn't mean that He's teaching people are alive as a ghost. It's a story to prove a point. If you'd consider some of the issues that have been raised instead of focusing on the word angles I think you'd be able to see the point. Paul also said, "I died" in Romans 7. Would you argue that he was writing Romans as ghost living outside of a body? He said, 'when the Law came I died'. Did the Mosaic Law walk over and visit Paul and then he died and years later wrote Romans as a ghost. Of course not, he's using figurative language just like Jesus did in Luke 16. Jesus said He spoke in parables specifically so the Jews wouldn't understand Him. Notice the Parable of the Rich man and Lazarus was spoken to the Pharisees, not to Christians or believers.

 

14 And the Pharisees also, who were covetous, heard all these things: and they derided him.

15 And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.

16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.

19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:

20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,

21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.

22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:

28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. (Luk 16:14-31 KJV)

 

It makes no sense for Jesus, right in the middle of Chastising the Pharisees to say, oh, by the way, let me teach you about the afterlife. He chastising them and Lazarus and the Rich man is part of it.

[enoob57]

The Lord came into the world to provide life to the dead... both those living and those who have died!

Not all dead but those believing in Him to be able to accomplish this! Thus why this could not be parable

as parables take what people know in created living experience to testify of Spiritual truths not yet

sensually experienced in fullness...

This account of Lazarus however answers many needful contextual realties of God's Word

Ps 68:18-20

18 You have ascended on high,

You have led captivity captive;

You have received gifts among men,

Even from the rebellious,

That the Lord God might dwell there.

19 Blessed be the Lord,

Who daily loads us with benefits,

The God of our salvation!

Selah

20 Our God is the God of salvation;

And to God the Lord belong escapes from death.

NKJV

Eph 4:7-10

7 But to each one of us grace was given according to

the measure of Christ's gift. 8 Therefore He says:

"When He ascended on high,

He led captivity captive,

And gave gifts to men."

9 (Now this, "He ascended" — what does it mean but that

He also first descended into the lower parts of the earth?

10 He who descended is also the One who ascended far above

all the heavens, that He might fill all things.)

NKJV

by these Scriptures we see that had not Lazarus been a factual account

we could not decipher this descending into the lower parts of the earth

properly! But fulfilling His Word to us has revealed by that very same Word

where in fact He went and to whom He lead out  fulfilling yet another promise

He has made to us by His Word

John 17:6-8

6 "I have manifested Your name to the men whom You have given

Me out of the world. They were Yours, You gave them to Me, and

they have kept Your word. 7 Now they have known that all things

which You have given Me are from You. 8 For I have given to them

the words which You have given Me; and they have received them,

and have known surely that I came forth from You; and they have

believed that You sent Me.

NKJV

 

Love, Steven

[Izzel]

When Jesus was on the Cross their were two thieves,one on each side of Him.One was repentant and the other thief was not.Jesus said the the thief that was repentant "today you will be with me in Paradise".That indicates that after we die we immediately are in either heaven or hades.

Ecclesiastes 3:19-21

King James Version (KJV)

19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.

20 All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again.

21 Who knoweth the spirit of man ( both good and wicked ) that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?

[Guest DRS81]

Ecclesiastes 3:21

21 Who knoweth the spirit of man ( both good and wicked ) that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?

 

 

Good job with scripture here. Blessings to you.

 

http://www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/gills-exposition-of-the-bible/ecclesiastes-3-21.html

Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward?

&c.] There is indeed a difference between a man and a beast; though they have one breath, they have not one spirit or soul; man has a rational and immortal soul, which, when he dies, goes upwards to God that gave it; to be judged by him, and disposed of by him, in its proper apartment, until the day of the resurrection of the body; and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?

when the beast dies, its spirit goes down to the earth, from whence it came, and is resolved into it, and is no more. But who is it that sees, or can see and know with the eyes of his body, the difference of these two spirits, or the ascent of the one, and the descent of the other?, Or who knows by the dint of reason, by the strength of his own understanding, without a divine revelation, that man has an immortal soul which goes upwards at death, when that of a beast goes downwards? No man, clearly and fully, as appears from the doubts and half faith of the wisest Heathens concerning it: or rather who knows and considers this difference between the spirit of a man and the spirit of a beast, and thinks within himself what a precious and immortal soul he has, and is concerned for the salvation of it? Very few; and hence it is they live and die like beasts, as they do. The Midrash interprets this of the souls of the righteous that go up to heaven, and of the souls of the wicked that go down to hell.