To Cover or Not to Cover ?

[JohnD]

The more I simply do what the Bible says...

[GoldenEagle]

 

 

One of the problems in biblical exegesis that we face today is that we fail to understand that in Paul's epistles, some of what we see written on a practical level was written to the particular audience to which it was addressed and is not necessarily applicable for all people for all time.

 

There may be spiritual lessons we can glean from what we read, but we need to be able to separate what was written a advice meant to meet the needs of a given congregation and the time truths it conveys for all people.

 

Corinth was a city plagued by immorality.  It was the most immoral city in the known world in Paul's day.  One aspect of that culture that was very prevalent was male prostitution.  Corinth was a port city and for that reason, male prostitution prospered.  Sex-starved sailors made Corinth's male and female prostitution lucrative industries. 

 

Male prostitutes would wear their hair long and effeminate in order to attract clients.  They would hang out at the piers when sailors would disembark.    So when Paul is talking about long hair being a shame.  That is what the Corinthians would have naturally thought of.  The Corinthians were believers who were saved out of that sex-drenched, immoral culture.  

 

Paul was instructing the men to keep their short.  Obviously, there needed to be a separation of the believers from the prevailing culture and so men were instructed by Paul to cut their hair.  This would also keep them from tempting one another to fall back into the sin of that culture. 

 

As for the women, it was common for the women who were priestesses for the famous oracles of Delphi not far from Corinth and other aspects of the pagan culture, who were coming to faith, to shave their heads and Paul is instructing them to keep their heads covered, likely until their hair can grow back.

 

We tend to forget or in some cases, ignore the fact that these are real letters written to real people in history.  These letters contain personal instructions aimed at specific audience and we need to be able to separate the eternal truths from the vehicle used to communicate them.

 

I never really put that all together before Shiloh...    Thank you.  It's interesting how one can have tidbits of things floating around and never really find the need to make a picture out of them...

 

 

 

 

One of the problems in biblical exegesis that we face today is that we fail to understand that in Paul's epistles, some of what we see written on a practical level was written to the particular audience to which it was addressed and is not necessarily applicable for all people for all time.

 

There may be spiritual lessons we can glean from what we read, but we need to be able to separate what was written a advice meant to meet the needs of a given congregation and the time truths it conveys for all people.

 

Corinth was a city plagued by immorality.  It was the most immoral city in the known world in Paul's day.  One aspect of that culture that was very prevalent was male prostitution.  Corinth was a port city and for that reason, male prostitution prospered.  Sex-starved sailors made Corinth's male and female prostitution lucrative industries. 

 

Male prostitutes would wear their hair long and effeminate in order to attract clients.  They would hang out at the piers when sailors would disembark.    So when Paul is talking about long hair being a shame.  That is what the Corinthians would have naturally thought of.  The Corinthians were believers who were saved out of that sex-drenched, immoral culture.  

 

Paul was instructing the men to keep their short.  Obviously, there needed to be a separation of the believers from the prevailing culture and so men were instructed by Paul to cut their hair.  This would also keep them from tempting one another to fall back into the sin of that culture. 

 

As for the women, it was common for the women who were priestesses for the famous oracles of Delphi not far from Corinth and other aspects of the pagan culture, who were coming to faith, to shave their heads and Paul is instructing them to keep their heads covered, likely until their hair can grow back.

 

We tend to forget or in some cases, ignore the fact that these are real letters written to real people in history.  These letters contain personal instructions aimed at specific audience and we need to be able to separate the eternal truths from the vehicle used to communicate them.

 

I never really put that all together before Shiloh...    Thank you.  It's interesting how one can have tidbits of things floating around and never really find the need to make a picture out of them...

 

 

So just like men would have possibly been a temptation with long hair the women would've been a temptation with shaved hair.

 

So the calling was to be set apart from the culture. I agree we need to remember these are real letters written to real people in history.

 

[GoldenEagle]

 

The Bible is the Word of God, not just letters to churches.  If I take the position Shiloh does, then I reduce the epistles to nothing more than letters, not eternal truth, and I don't accept that.  I would also point out that in Shiloh's post, he is saying that long hair equals femininity, which is why homosexual men would keep their hair long, and short hair would therefore equal masculinity.  We have homosexuals today, so it would seem to me that this is an eternal truth, not just something to the church at Corinth. 

 

The Bible does not specify that a man has to shave his head to be considered uncovered.  To Golden Eagle and Just Faith, here is the clarification that was requested from that passage.  The passage is stating that hair is a covering as I have already shown.  Lets go back to 1 Corinthians 11:3-5

 

But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ;  and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.  Every man praying or prophesying, having his head uncovered, dishonoureth his head.  But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth here head:  for that is even all one as if she were shaven. 

 

Verse 3 tells us who the head of the man is and who the head of the woman is.  It then says that if a man prays or prophesies with his head covered, he dishonors Christ, and if the woman prays or prophesies with her head uncovered, she dishonors the man.  What does it mean to be covered?  Lets move down to verses 14 and 15.

 

Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?  But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her:  for her hair is given her for a covering.

 

It doesn't say the man must go bald.  It says he is not to have long hair, as that is a shame to him.  It then states that the woman's long hair, not just any hair, is given her for a covering.  I hope that is clear enough for you Golden Eagle. 

 

Thanks for the clarification brother and further sharing your perspective.

I think what Shiloh had to say is pertinent to the conversation. It's obvious to me when looking at the entire book of 1 Cor. (and even later in 2 Cor.) that there was an issue of spiritual maturity in Corinth. And we must remember that these were real issues to real people. Take the issue of saying they were followers or disciples of Paul, Apollos, etc.? Take 1 Cor. 3:1-9 for example...
 

1 Cor 3:1-9

But I, brothers, could not address you as spiritual people, but as people of the flesh, as infants in Christ. ² I fed you with milk, not solid food, for you were not ready for it. And even now you are not yet ready, ³ for you are still of the flesh. For while there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not of the flesh and behaving only in a human way? ⁴ For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not being merely human?

 

⁵ What then is Apollos? What is Paul? Servants through whom you believed, as the Lord assigned to each. ⁶ I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the growth. ⁷ So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God who gives the growth. ⁸ He who plants and he who waters are one, and each will receive his wages according to his labor. ⁹ For we are God's fellow workers. You are God's field, God's building.

Are you still insisting that the issues Paul was addressing weren't specifically pertinent to the audience it was written to? Also that we need to understand the context of how and when the passage was written? Surely we can agree on that.

God bless,

GE

 

[justfaith]

V.5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoreth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven. 6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.

 

We see that for a woman to leave her head uncovered while praying or prophesying is a dishonor to her spiritual head (her husband, according to verse 3). Why? She dishonors her husband to God, because that which is a glory to man needs to be covered in God's presence so that God receives all the glory.

 

Verse 6 explains that if a woman takes off one covering (the cloth one), her natural covering of hair should also be taken away. However, says God, if it is shameful for a woman to have her hair shorn (this is talking about cutting the hair very close, in the same way that a sheep is shorn), then she should cover her head. So this leaves us with two options: either a woman cover her head, or have nothing but very short stubble on her head.

[justfaith]

 

 

The Bible is the Word of God, not just letters to churches.  If I take the position Shiloh does, then I reduce the epistles to nothing more than letters, not eternal truth, and I don't accept that.  I would also point out that in Shiloh's post, he is saying that long hair equals femininity, which is why homosexual men would keep their hair long, and short hair would therefore equal masculinity.  We have homosexuals today, so it would seem to me that this is an eternal truth, not just something to the church at Corinth. 

 

The Bible does not specify that a man has to shave his head to be considered uncovered.  To Golden Eagle and Just Faith, here is the clarification that was requested from that passage.  The passage is stating that hair is a covering as I have already shown.  Lets go back to 1 Corinthians 11:3-5

 

But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ;  and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.  Every man praying or prophesying, having his head uncovered, dishonoureth his head.  But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth here head:  for that is even all one as if she were shaven. 

 

Verse 3 tells us who the head of the man is and who the head of the woman is.  It then says that if a man prays or prophesies with his head covered, he dishonors Christ, and if the woman prays or prophesies with her head uncovered, she dishonors the man.  What does it mean to be covered?  Lets move down to verses 14 and 15.

 

Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?  But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her:  for her hair is given her for a covering.

 

It doesn't say the man must go bald.  It says he is not to have long hair, as that is a shame to him.  It then states that the woman's long hair, not just any hair, is given her for a covering.  I hope that is clear enough for you Golden Eagle. 

 

Thanks for the clarification brother and further sharing your perspective.

I think what Shiloh had to say is pertinent to the conversation. It's obvious to me when looking at the entire book of 1 Cor. (and even later in 2 Cor.) that there was an issue of spiritual maturity in Corinth. And we must remember that these were real issues to real people. Take the issue of saying they were followers or disciples of Paul, Apollos, etc.? Take 1 Cor. 3:1-9 for example...

 

1 Cor 3:1-9

But I, brothers, could not address you as spiritual people, but as people of the flesh, as infants in Christ. ² I fed you with milk, not solid food, for you were not ready for it. And even now you are not yet ready, ³ for you are still of the flesh. For while there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not of the flesh and behaving only in a human way? ⁴ For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not being merely human?

 

⁵ What then is Apollos? What is Paul? Servants through whom you believed, as the Lord assigned to each. ⁶ I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the growth. ⁷ So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God who gives the growth. ⁸ He who plants and he who waters are one, and each will receive his wages according to his labor. ⁹ For we are God's fellow workers. You are God's field, God's building.

Are you still insisting that the issues Paul was addressing weren't specifically pertinent to the audience it was written to? Also that we need to understand the context of how and when the passage was written? Surely we can agree on that.

God bless,

GE

 

 

The book of 1 Corinthians was written for all Christians:

 

1 Corinthians 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours: (emphasis mine)

 

This passage clearly shows that God intended the book for those outside the Corinthian church addressed to all Christians.

 

are you saying we shall not judge angels but only those at corith at that time will

[justfaith]

It's more of a cultural thing in the time of the apostles.  It isn't relevant for us today

Long hair is the covering."

 

Verse fifteen does not say that long hair is given for a covering; it says that her hair (long or not) is given to her for a covering and because of that, long hair is a glory to her. Read that again.

[justfaith]

We know what the scriptures say.  It is a shame for a man to have his head covered (long hair) when he prays, and it is equally wrong for a woman not to have her head covered (long hair) when she prays.  You either believe and follow the scriptures or you don't.  I don't accept the cultural argument, because if that were the case, then what we read in the Bible isn't the inerrant Word of God.  It is not eternal truth.  It is just a bunch of people writing advise to the church that existed at the time.  I go by what it says, so I believe it is a shame for me to pray or prophesy with my head covered, and that it is wrong for a woman to pray or prophesy with her head uncovered.  I take it at face value. 

 Suppose we change the passage to talk about hair instead of a covering:

 

4 Every man praying or prophesying, having hair on his head, dishonoreth his head. 5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth without hair on her head dishonoreth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven [had no hair]. 6 For if the woman have not hair, let her hair be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her have hair. 7 For a man indeed ought not to have hair on his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.

 

How ridiculous! How do you shear the hair off a woman who has none? 

[Littlelambseativy]

I thought God looked on the heart. I would imagine very few women cover their heads when in prayer. I would rather God loook at my heart and listened to my prayer with or without a head covering.

[justfaith]

I thought God looked on the heart. I would imagine very few women cover their heads when in prayer. I would rather God loook at my heart and listened to my prayer with or without a head covering.

if the High Priest did not wear appropriate clothes what would have happen ?

[kwikphilly]

Blessings Everyone...

    I wear long hair because God has given me this covering & I glorify Him ........I agree with Butero and I take what is Written literally,my hair is my glory........I was shown this by my elders since I was a child,I was told by my dad(earthy father) that women should look like women & men should look like men and also act & behave accordingly.........it is not a tradition I was taught but Gods Timeless Truth

    Perhaps there would not be so much gender confusion if parents taught their children how to be what God made them & look the part,,,,,I don't know ,just my little 2 cents                                                                                With love-in Christ,Kwik