Hell

[7thseal]

 

11 "And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."

12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus. (Rev 14:11-12 NKJ)

The Greek word translated "here" means in the same place. This obviously isn't the Lake of Fire if the saints are there.

 

Another point is that "forever and ever" is not the proper translation. The Greek phrase actually means, ages of ages, it's not the modern idea of eternity.

 

 

So your saying saints recieve the same of those who chose to worship the beast?

What is the patience of the Saints? Look closely at the last of that verse you quoted.

 

 

Again the lake of fire is forever and those lost will be there seperated from God for eterinity.

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

 

According to your veiw even satan will be with the saints.

[Tiger Eye]

 

 

11 "And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."

12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus. (Rev 14:11-12 NKJ)

The Greek word translated "here" means in the same place. This obviously isn't the Lake of Fire if the saints are there.

 

Another point is that "forever and ever" is not the proper translation. The Greek phrase actually means, ages of ages, it's not the modern idea of eternity.

 

 

So your saying saints recieve the same of those who chose to worship the beast?

What is the patience of the Saints? Look closely at the last of that verse you quoted.

 

 

Again the lake of fire is forever and those lost will be there seperated from God for eterinity.

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

 

According to your veiw even satan will be with the saints.

 

Psalm 139 :8

If you make your bed in heaven, he's there. If you make your bed in hell, he's there. He's everywhere!

 

Matthew 26:24;

But woe to that man who betrays the Son of Man! It would be better for him had he not been born.

 

Question;

What is the difference between never being born at all and eternal damnation?

[JohnD]

 

The center of a super black hole? Unlikely...

 

Several places in scripture refer to the present heavens and earth perishing and a New Heaven / New Earth (or New Heaven-Earth) in its place... some have speculated (and that's all it is) that the molten core of that New Heaven-Earth (which will be large enough that the New Jerusalem a 1500 mile cube or pyramid depending on how you interpret the dimensions can rest) will be that lake of fire / bottomless pit where floating in that inferno will be as falling forever...

 

The final hell / lake of fire is not to be confused with the present sheol / hell...

 

 

Abraham's Bosom has been empty since the Lord Jesus led the captivity there captive to heaven where all disembodied spirits of believers go directly to in death...

 

Luke 23:43

Ephesians 4:8-10

2 Corinthians 5:1-9

[Butch5]

 

 

11 "And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."

12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus. (Rev 14:11-12 NKJ)

The Greek word translated "here" means in the same place. This obviously isn't the Lake of Fire if the saints are there.

 

Another point is that "forever and ever" is not the proper translation. The Greek phrase actually means, ages of ages, it's not the modern idea of eternity.

 

 

So your saying saints recieve the same of those who chose to worship the beast?

What is the patience of the Saints? Look closely at the last of that verse you quoted.

 

 

Again the lake of fire is forever and those lost will be there seperated from God for eterinity.

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

 

According to your veiw even satan will be with the saints.

 

I said in my post, this obviously isn't the Lake of Fire. Those in Rev. 14:11 are alive, not dead, they are on the earth, not in the Lake of Fire, they are worshiping the beast.  The Lake of Fire, Gehenna does not burn eternally. The phrase, ages of ages is not eternal. The Greek word "aionios" cannot mean eternal because it is used to describe periods of time that end. The wicked will be cast into the Lake of Fire and burned up, they won't be there forever. Scripture tells us that Gehenna will one day be made holy to the Lord.

 

Here's something else to consider, Scripture says that the gift of God is eternal life and it's promised to believers. If people burn forever in the Lake of Fire then they have to live forever, thus the wick would have to receive eternal life also, but, that's not what the Scriptures say. Nowhere in Scripture is eternal life promised to the wicked.

[JohnD]

You are mixing things together, I'm afraid.

 

The flesh is burned up in the fire. But we are not only flesh are we? We are spirit as well. The worm (human spirit) does not die and is in agony.

 

And Gehenna (the valley of Hinnom where the refuse was burned is likened to sheol not the lake of fire),

 

Folks try explaining away truth with arguments and endless trails of thought / reason.

 

Try just taking God at his word and avoid hell at all costs.

[Butch5]

You are mixing things together, I'm afraid.

 

The flesh is burned up in the fire. But we are not only flesh are we? We are spirit as well. The worm (human spirit) does not die and is in agony.

 

And Gehenna (the valley of Hinnom where the refuse was burned is likened to sheol not the lake of fire),

 

Folks try explaining away truth with arguments and endless trails of thought / reason.

 

Try just taking God at his word and avoid hell at all costs.

Who's mixing things up?

[7thseal]

I see you refer to the old testament Greek translation of "aionios". Even though ages also refers to Jesus and God in the new testaments whom speak of for ever and ever and are eternity. Lake of Fire is after judgment and those alive (on earth) during the return of the Lord aswell as those in hell and death face up to it.

 

Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

Now you're seperated satan's lake of fire from those judged by God.

[zhavoney]

Where is Hell or the lake of fire ?

 

Will people actually be burning forever ?

 

Hell was translated from four different words. 1. Sheol = Ancient Hebrew word for "the dug out place below the surface of the earth. The Grave.

2. Hades = The Greek word for Sheol.

3. Tartaroo = The bottomless Pit. The abyss.

4 Gehenna = The Valley of the Son of Hinnom. According to Jerremiah 7:32 = "The valley of slaughter". This is the one that Christ referred to regularly.

[zhavoney]

You are mixing things together, I'm afraid.

 

The flesh is burned up in the fire. But we are not only flesh are we? We are spirit as well. The worm (human spirit) does not die and is in agony.

 

And Gehenna (the valley of Hinnom where the refuse was burned is likened to sheol not the lake of fire),

 

Folks try explaining away truth with arguments and endless trails of thought / reason.

 

Try just taking God at his word and avoid hell at all costs.

 

 

Nope! Man without the Spirit of God is fully flesh.   3 And the Lord said, "My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years."

[Butch5]

I see you refer to the old testament Greek translation of "aionios". Even though ages also refers to Jesus and God in the new testaments whom speak of for ever and ever and are eternity. Lake of Fire is after judgment and those alive (on earth) during the return of the Lord aswell as those in hell and death face up to it.

 

Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

Now you're seperated satan's lake of fire from those judged by God.

Are you following my posts? The Greek word "aionios" cannot mean eternity, it's used of things that end. Something that ends is not eternal. Jude said that the burning of Sodom and Gommorah are an example of "aionios" fire, the translators translate it as "eternal fire." It's pretty clear that Sodom and Gommorah are not still burning today, yet they are an example of "aionios fire". This shows that "aionios" doesn't mean eternal. Likewise the Lake of Fire, Gehenna will not burn forever.

 

23 And it shall come to pass That from one New Moon to another, And from one Sabbath to another, All flesh shall come to worship before Me," says the LORD.

24 "And they shall go forth and look Upon the corpses of the men Who have transgressed against Me. For their worm does not die, And their fire is not quenched. They shall be an abhorrence to all flesh."

(Isa 66:23-1 NKJ)

 

Jesus quoted the underlined section of this verse and calls it Gehenna. He inidcates that this is where the wicked will be burned. John says that the wicked will be burned in the Lake of Fire. That shows that the Lake of Fire and Gehenna are the same place. Speaking of Gehenna, Jeremiah prophesied.

 

38 "Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, that the city shall be built for the LORD from the Tower of Hananel to the Corner Gate.

39 "The surveyor's line shall again extend straight forward over the hill Gareb; then it shall turn toward Goath.

40 "And the whole valley of the dead bodies and of the ashes, and all the fields as far as the Brook Kidron, to the corner of the Horse Gate toward the east, shall be holy to the LORD. It shall not be plucked up or thrown down anymore forever."

(Jer 31:38-1 NKJ)

 

The valley of the dead bodies is the valley of the Son of Hinnom or Gehenna. Jeremiah prophesies that Gehenna will be made holy to God and will not be destroyed anymore.