lovetruth Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 45 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 55 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/24/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted June 27, 2015 (edited) The error of the one man pastor ministry. Another main hinderance to the function of God’s order in the church, is this one man “Pastor ministry” that has dominated Christendom for a long time. This traditon of men is contrary to God’s order of plurality of ministering elders in every church and various giftings to the body of Christ. We read in Ephesians 4:11 that God gave ”gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:”, and when “they had ordained them elders in every church”(Acts 14:23). In God’s order there are more giftings than just pastors, and we never read of a one man pastor over a church in the New Testament always a plurality of elders! Yet unfortunately today this one man dominates Christendon everywhere! The one man pastor ministry tradition quenches the spirit in others and hinders the body from edifying itself under Christ headship in the gatherings and the mutual edification where all can use their gifts in God’s order (Ephesians 4:15,16, 1 Corinthians 12:7-25, 1 Peter 4:10,11, 1 Corinthians 14:26-37, 1 Thessalonians 5:11, Romans 12etc). How can the order of God be seen when the entire gathering is dominated by one man and body life is hindered? At best these large meetings are similar to evangelistic meetings or a big bible study as I said before. But this tradition has hindered church meetings and the order of God among us and the body life greatly. How can “every one have”, when only the Pastor is allowed to speak and minister? This man made tradition also draws many to gather around men and certain ministries of these men rather than gathering around Christ and the various “programs” they develop. How many today gather around these men and certain doctrines and denominations instead of Christ and His working in every part of the body of Christ In these traditions, there has been a massive schism in the body of Christ, between the so called, “Clergy”, and the “Laity”. This is a false traition and not based on the scritpures of truth. The word “clergy”, comes from the Greek word “kleros”, meaning “heritage, inhertitance or lot”, showing that believers are the inheritance, or heritage of God and it is used that way in scripture as we read , “ Neither as being lords over God’s heritage [Kleros], but being examples to the flock.” (1 Peter 5:3). The word “laity” means comes from the word “laos”, meaning, “a people”, and it is used that way in scripture. “And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people [laos].” ( 2 Corinthians 6:16) There is no such thing as a clergy and latiy division as we see today and from way back in history. The “kleros:, and the “laity” both refer to the body of Christ. We are the inheritance of God and the people of God. Again we see that mans traditions and order has caused a schism in the body. This schism is mentioned in in 1 Cor 12 and other places, this verse is in reference to men not allowing the body to function as it should, and by causing sich a divide between the body and the man at the front called the “pastor”, or the head pastor, senior elder pastor etc. This creates a dysfunction and error in their order. It hinders Christ from working and moving in all the offices in the gatherings. All the body should have the same care one for another ( verse) and we are all brothers and sister (verse). This very unity of the body in the Spirit is part of the goal for ministry ( Ephesians 4:?). But putting one gifting above others hinders this. 1. Mutual edification, not just a pastor gifting Clearly in scripture we see the exact oppostie of a one man pastor ministry, as we have already pointed out. Here are just a few of the verses that show mutual edification of the body and not a just one man pastor ministry. “And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:” (Ephesians 4:11, 12) Clearly, there are more than pastors alone for the work mentioned here, yet somehow this one man padtor gift has dominated Christendom for a long time. “But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: 16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.” (Ephesians 4:15, 16) As this verse has already been mentioned it is seen agin in this context, showing clearly that this work of Christ as the head is not dependant on a one man pastor ministry or any man for that matter. Christ is the one who works “effectually”, in the measure of “every part”. Not just in a one man pastor ministry or selective elders alone. “How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.” (1 Corinthians 14;26) “every one of you hath”, this is so clear here in showing that the ministry of the body in edifying itself was not by just one man called the “pastor”. This section deos not read, “if the pastor hath”. To have something from God is the true way to edify eachother, and this section would connect with Pauls words to the Ehpesians 4 when he said that Christ works in every part of the body. . When God gives, then we have, and so it is Christ that leads the meetings in the truest sense, as the head of the church. This is the commandment of God (1 Corinthians 14:26- 37, 38) “But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:” ( 1 Corinthians 14:24) Here again we see that all can prophesy, this is also related to God's working to convict and judge sin in the camp. and in unbelievers among us. many times a man may even be sharing a word or a teaching and his words may come forth that will convict the hearers to such a degree that they will wonder how the person speaking knew these things about them. When God is moving and working all things are possible. This again is the commandment of God (1 Corinthians 14:24- 37, 38) “If any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace. 31 For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.” (1 Corintians 14:30, 31) Notice that this passage does not say “if anything be revealed to the pastor alone”. No, all may have a revelation and prophesy. Prophecy is to “forthtell, and fortell, and to speak under unction”. Prophesy is connected to “anything” that is revealed. It is also as Paul said “...he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.” ( 1 Corinthians 14:3). It is also for convincing and judging as we have discussed (1 Cor. 14:24). “But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.” ( 1 Corinthians 12:7). God would not gives this manifestation to “every man”, if he did not expect every man to function in the body somehow. Again, we do not read “ the manifestation of the Spirit is given to the pastor only”. “But now are they many members, yet but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you....25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.” ( 1 Corinthians 12:20, 21,25) But a schism is created by dividing the pastor gifting from the other gifts and functions of the body as we gather. Some may say this is not specifically speaking of a gathering of believers, but yes, it can extend to all aspects of the body. We read in verses 12:8-10, of wisdom, knowledge, prophecy and tongues etc. These manifestations of the Spirit can be seen in the meetings also. It is ot men that can order this, Gods order is the only way for such a manifestation of the Spirit as Paul said, “But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.” ( 1 Corinthians 12:11). “Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.” ( 1 Thessalonians 5:11) The “one anothering” is part of God’s order for the mutual edification of eachother in Christ. Without this one anothering, we would not have proper growth and building up of the body thus creating a weak and dysfunctional body. The pastor cannot do all this, and was never intended to. To even try to will leand them to be overwhelmed and over burdened. There are many “one another” verses in the New Testament, here are just a few, (1 Thessalonians 4:18, Hebrews 10:25, James 5:16, Ephesians 5:12, Romans 14:19, Romans 15:14, 1 Corinthians 11:33, 1 Corinthians 16:20) “Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.” (Colossians 3:16) Where in this verse do we see a one man pastor gifting doing most if not all the ministry to the body? No, we see that it is the word of Christ dwelling in us that builds us up and we speak forth from this. This is God’s order again, and His leading us and working in us. “Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.” ( Hebrews 10:15) How often have ministers said the first part of this verse about not forsaking the assembly of ourselves, but they do not stress the last part of “exhorting one another”. This “one another” aspect is vital to the assembly of ourselves together. This is not defining a one man pastor ministry, but instead the body ministry to one another as Christ. And this is more needul as we see the day approaching, which we can see that it is. "As every man hath received the gift, even so minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God. 11 If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God; if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen." 1 Peter 4:10,11 Here Peter also spoke of these things and notice he says as EVERY man hath received the gift. Not as every pastor only. He also says that we will be good stewards of the grace of God if we minister in this leading. “For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office: 5 So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another. 6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith; 7 Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching; 8 Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation:” (Romans 12:4-8) Again, as believers we are members one of another and so can edify eachother. To limit this one anothering to a single man called “the pastor” is not sound and can greatly hinder the body of Christ. This aspect of the body spoken here in Romans 12, can extend to the daily lives of believers and not only to the gatherings of the saints into one place, but it also extends to the assemblies of the church in the houses, for we read of the body edification and teaching and prophecy and exhorting etc. Also the way for all this to take place is when we are dead to self and pick up our cross. Paul speaks of this in verse 12:1, and said, “that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.”. When we are dead to self the life of Christ can be manifest in our mortal bodies ( 2 Cor 4:10,11). Paul even said to the Corintians “For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.” (1 Corinthians 2:2). To know Christ crucified and to be crucified with him, is how we are able to walk in God’s order, in the Spirit. This is how the life of Christ may be made manifest in our metings and lives. I want to point out that many of those men who are called the pastor over a church are godly men and truly love God and have spoken in love and truth, and many of them are not true ministers also . But either way even if they are the most benevolent men, in this wrong authority over others and the exalted place they hold they are more like benevolent dictators who do not allow the body to function properly under Christ headship. the history of this stems way back and really became noticed around the Time of Constantine and after wards Edited June 27, 2015 by lovetruth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 267 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,219 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,500 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Hi lovetruth, Does my heart good to see you upholding the truth of God from His word. Also Paul admonishes the Corinthians - `For you put up with it if one brings you into bondage, if one devours you, if one takes from you, if one exalts himself, if one strikes you in the face.` (2 Cor. 11: 20) There has been research done on why people are leaving the organised churches in such large numbers today. Those doing the survey were very surprised to find it was not those lazy, or sinful, or angry but were those who had laboured long & hard to work within the system. They were now `done,` with the system with its power & control & were working with others in the `field.` The Lord is breaking through every barrier of man, so that He will be Head of His Body & the Holy Spirit the one who organises the bodies activities. Blessings, Marilyn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovetruth Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 45 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 55 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/24/2015 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 27, 2015 (edited) Marilyn C..yes another good section. they exalt themsleves and take of you ( money) . Those two marks expose alot of men. Edited June 27, 2015 by lovetruth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted June 27, 2015 The pulpit-centric church we have today is not a model that is based on the New Testament churches, although God does anoint people to be leaders over a local body. This is how the Body of Christ functions. Pastors need to realize that they have a gift of pastoring and it is no more and no less a part of the entire giftng that encompasses an entire congregation, which with all the giftings combined and working together, form a whole Body of Christ! We should be aware that we are working shoulder to shoulder with those among us who are gifted in preaching, teaching, pastoring, and administration, and many other giftings, to present Jesus Christ to our communities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FresnoJoe Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 207 Topic Count: 60 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,651 Content Per Day: 1.17 Reputation: 5,761 Days Won: 4 Joined: 01/31/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/04/1943 Share Posted June 27, 2015 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ, so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning, by craftiness in deceitful schemes. Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ, from whom the whole body, joined and held together by every joint with which it is equipped, when each part is working properly, makes the body grow so that it builds itself up in love. Ephesians 4:12-16 (ESV) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Amen, Joe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 267 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,219 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,500 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted June 27, 2015 And another amen Joe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petula Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,499 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 1,665 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/17/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/31/1955 Share Posted June 27, 2015 And yet another Amen , Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegaman 3.0 Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 57 Topic Count: 1,546 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 10,320 Content Per Day: 1.41 Reputation: 12,323 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/15/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/05/1951 Share Posted June 27, 2015 *Joins the Joe Admiration Society Nice post Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FresnoJoe Posted June 27, 2015 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 207 Topic Count: 60 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,651 Content Per Day: 1.17 Reputation: 5,761 Days Won: 4 Joined: 01/31/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/04/1943 Share Posted June 27, 2015 *Joins the Joe Admiration Society Nice post Joe Really Beloved, Joe Is No Big Deal So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do. Luke 17:10 But You Should See And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ: Ephesians 3:9 My Jesus Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. Revelation 4:11 Wowzers~! Who is this who comes from Edom, from the city of Bozrah, with his clothing stained red? Who is this in royal robes, marching in his great strength? "It is I, the LORD, announcing your salvation! It is I, the LORD, who has the power to save!" Isaiah 63:1 (NIT) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts