Determining the Dates for Easter and Passover

[Ezra]

34 minutes ago, Paradigm said:

Where does scripture say that we should call the first day of the week "the Lord's Day?" I already quoted the only verse where that phrase appears.

And that should suffice. Why does Scripture have to say that explicitly? The very fact that the apostolic churches met on the first day of the week is sufficient proof.

36 minutes ago, Paradigm said:

Yes, at times they did meet on the first day of the week. They also continued to keep the Sabbath.

Not at all. Please note (Col 2:16,17): Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

What is Paul teaching here?  That the observance of holy days from the Old Covenant is NOT necessary for Christians.

42 minutes ago, Paradigm said:

I have already quoted scripture where Paul tells us to keep Passover and that YHVH says that it is to be done forever.

Well let's look at passage (1 Cor 5:7,8), and see if it is not to the whole Christian life: Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

 

The time however, of keeping feast (metaphorical; that is, leading the Christian life of joy in Christ's finished work, compare Proverbs 15:15 ) among us Christians, corresponding to the Jewish Passover, is not limited, as the latter, to one season, but is ALL our time; for the transcendent benefits of the once-for-all completed sacrifice of our Passover Lamb extends to all the time of our lives and of this Christian dispensation; in no part of our time is the leaven of evil to be admitted. 

Jamieson, Fausset, Brown

[Qnts2]

7 hours ago, OldSchool2 said:

from RayFowler.org:

"Determining the date for Passover: The Jewish calendar year begins in late September or early October with the celebration of Rosh Hashana. Unlike our calendar which is based on the solar year, the Jewish calendar uses twelve lunar months of 29 to 30 days in length. The new moon marks the beginning of each month with the full moon occurring halfway through the month. The seventh month in a normal Jewish calendar year is the month of Nisan (also called Abib in the Old Testament). Passover is celebrated on the 14th day of Nisan at the time of the full moon.

"Determining the date for Easter (*Western Church): Easter is observed on the first Sunday following the full moon that comes on or after the vernal equinox (March 21). Thus Easter can take place as early as March 22 but no later than April 25. This full moon is normally the full moon which takes place on the 14th day of Nisan. Thus in most years Easter is celebrated on the Sunday following Passover.

"Why don’t Easter and Passover always fall together on the calendar? Every two or three years the Jewish calendar requires the adjustment of a leap year. During a Jewish leap year an additional month of 29 days is inserted before the month of Nisan. The additional month is needed because the Jewish calendar year has less days than the solar year and begins to slip out of gear with the seasons. The extra month thus realigns the Jewish calendar year with the seasons of the solar year. This is important because the Jewish holidays are closely related to the seasons. For example, the Torah commands that Passover be celebrated in the spring. Every so often the Jewish leap year will push Passover so far into April that a second full moon following the vernal equinox would appear before the Sunday following Passover. This happens anytime the Sunday following Passover falls later than April 25th on our calendar. On those rare occasions Easter is celebrated the month before Passover rather than the Sunday following Passover...."

http://www.rayfowler.org/writings/articles/determining-the-dates-for-easter-and-passover/#sthash.eI6eftxT.dpuf

So, is that what happened this Easter?

In the Council of Nicea, Constantine asked the council to change the date so that Christians would not have anything in common with the Jewish people.

The following is the first part of the letter written to inform those who did not attend the council, translated into English:

http://legacy.fordham.edu/halsall/basis/nicea1.txt

ON THE KEEPING OF EASTER.
From the Letter of the Emperor to all those not present at the Council.
(Found in Eusebius, Vita Const., Lib. iii., 18-20.)

When the question relative to the sacred festival of Easter arose, it was 
universally thought that it would be convenient that all should keep the 
feast on one day; for what could be more beautiful and more desirable, 
than to see this festival, through which we receive the hope of 
immortality, celebrated by all with one accord, and in the same 
manner? It was declared to be particularly unworthy for this, the 
holiest of all festivals, to follow the custom[the calculation] of the 
Jews, who had soiled their hands with the most fearful of crimes, and 
whose minds were blinded. In rejecting their custom,(1) we may 
transmit to our descendants the legitimate mode of celebrating Easter, 
which we have observed from the time of the Saviour's Passion to the 
present day[according to the day of the week]. We ought not, 
therefore, to have anything in common with the Jews, for the Saviour 
has shown us another way; our worship follows a more legitimate and 
more convenient course(the order of the days of the week); and 
consequently, in unanimously adopting this mode, we desire, dearest 
brethren, to separate ourselves from the detestable company of the 
Jews, for it is truly shameful for us to hear them boast that without 
their direction we could not keep this feast. How can they be in the 
right, they who, after the death of the Saviour, have no longer been led 
by reason but by wild violence, as their delusion may urge them? They 
do not possess the truth in this Easter question; for, in their blindness 
and repugnance to all improvements, they frequently celebrate two 
passovers in the same year. We could not imitate those who are openly 
in error. How, then, could we follow these Jews, who are most 
certainly blinded by error? for to celebrate the passover twice in one 
year is totally inadmissible. But even if this were not so, it would still 
be your duty not to tarnish your soul by communications with such 
wicked people[the Jews]. 

So, the new date was set so that Easter would not be set by the Jewish (OT) calendar.

Just a bit more as I see it. Jesus death was on Passover. But the resurrection was a few days later. In the OT, on the day after the Sabbath during Passover week was the first fruit wave offering. Also on the day of the wave offering, a count starts for 7 Sabbaths or 49 days. On the next day, which is the 50th day is Shavuot which is called Pentacost.

Now back to the first fruit wave offering, which would be the day of the resurrection. There was a dispute in Judaism between the Saducees and Pharisees as to which Sabbath was being referenced when the OT says the first fruit wave offering is on the day after the Sabbath. The Pharisees believed the Sabbath was the first day of the Passover, and the Saducees said it was the 7th day Sabbath during Passover. I believe the Sadducees were correct for several reason I won't go into hear. But, assuming the day of the resurrection is the day after the 7th day Sabbath, that make it on the 1st day of the week. Easter is a celebration of the resurrection and not the death of Jesus. Easter therefore would actually be the first fruits wave offering and would always be on Sunday, during the week of Passover.

[SINNERSAVED]

1 hour ago, Ezra said:

And that should suffice. Why does Scripture have to say that explicitly? The very fact that the apostolic churches met on the first day of the week is sufficient proof.

Not at all. Please note (Col 2:16,17): Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

 

 

What is Paul teaching here?  That the observance of holy days from the Old Covenant is NOT necessary for Christians.

Well let's look at passage (1 Cor 5:7,8), and see if it is not to the whole Christian life: Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

 

Jamieson, Fausset, Brown

 

 

 

I have to disagree with you Ezra , big time, you have taken this scriptures out of context and turned them around, it is, do not let any one judge you and me for what we do , in Christ Jesus to the holy day  and meat, it is reversed, , so you cannot say that all that God has established is abolished, you are wiping the words of God right out of existence , do you not see what you are saying !!!

 please if you are going to consider your self skilled in scripture , you need not twist it to mean what you want it to mean , but what the spirit says it is, you need to look at it again to what I have said, and check it again, you cannot play with the words of God ..???

Not at all. Please note (Col 2:16,17): Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ

[SINNERSAVED]

it does not nor ever take away what is appointed to us to be watching and observing as believers, , are you throwing the O.T out ?

[Ezra]

15 minutes ago, SINNERSAVED said:

please if you are going to consider your self skilled in scripture , you need not twist it to mean what you want it to mean ,

You are again making false accusations.  Prove that I am twisting the Scriptures, or retract you statements and apologize.  It is clear that you really have no clue about the difference between the Old and New Testaments, so now you will have to prove what has been *twisted*, or stop making these accusations.  Simple Jeff accused me just like you, and I am still waiting for his retractions and his apologies.

[SINNERSAVED]

17 minutes ago, Ezra said:

You are again making false accusations.  Prove that I am twisting the Scriptures, or retract you statements and apologize.  It is clear that you really have no clue about the difference between the Old and New Testaments, so now you will have to prove what has been *twisted*, or stop making these accusations.  Simple Jeff accused me just like you, and I am still waiting for his retractions and his apologies.

very well , here you are ,

Not at all. Please note (Col 2:16,17): Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.What is Paul teaching here?  That the observance of holy days from the Old Covenant is NOT necessary for Christians.

 is that really what paul, is teaching ? no this is incorrect , !

next

And that should suffice. Why does Scripture have to say that explicitly? The very fact that the apostolic churches met on the first day of the week is sufficient proof.

they continued  daily house to house breaking bread,

 Acts 2:46   And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,

next

Not at all. Please note (Col 2:16,17): Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

we are to keep the Sabbath holy , we are to watch and be alert of the changes of the sun and the moons, for we see that the son coming the sun will be dark and the  stars will fall,

this is to be observed ,. along with the feast days, as Christian, jews aliens ,gentiles  strangers, believers, children of God .

when Jesus said watch , for the thief come in the night to those not watching, what did you think He meant ? those that are not watching and not following the instructions and the lords appointed times are not walking in the spirit and are not concern of the days that ar4e drawing in ?

 you cannot take away what is given to seek and to honor oue God, this is truth , and a fact by scripture ,

 

[MorningGlory]

 

 

34 minutes ago, SINNERSAVED said:

I have to disagree with you Ezra , big time, you have taken this scriptures out of context and turned them around, it is, do not let any one judge you and me for what we do , in Christ Jesus to the holy day  and meat, it is reversed, , so you cannot say that all that God has established is abolished, you are wiping the words of God right out of existence , do you not see what you are saying !!!

 please if you are going to consider your self skilled in scripture , you need not twist it to mean what you want it to mean , but what the spirit says it is, you need to look at it again to what I have said, and check it again, you cannot play with the words of God ..???

Not at all. Please note (Col 2:16,17): Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ

I'm posting that chapter to put the verse Ezra quoted in context.  He didn't reverse it or twist it. It tells us clearly what we are no longer subject to. Special attention to the bolded part.  It's right here:

Colossians 2King James Version (KJV)

2 For I would that ye knew what great conflict I have for you, and for them at Laodicea, and for as many as have not seen my face in the flesh;

2 That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ;

3 In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.

4 And this I say, lest any man should beguile you with enticing words.

5 For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in Christ.

6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

7 Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.

8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,

19 And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God.

20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,

21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;

22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men?

 

 

[SINNERSAVED]

2 minutes ago, MorningGlory said:

 

 

I'm posting that chapter to put the verse Ezra quoted in context.  He didn't reverse it or twist it. It tells us clearly what we are no longer subject to. Special attention to the bolded part.  It's right here:

Colossians 2King James Version (KJV)

2 For I would that ye knew what great conflict I have for you, and for them at Laodicea, and for as many as have not seen my face in the flesh;

2 That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ;

3 In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.

4 And this I say, lest any man should beguile you with enticing words.

5 For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in Christ.

6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

7 Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.

8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,

19 And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God.

20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,

21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;

22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men?

 

 

thank you  in fact you have strengthen my case even more, have you really read it for what it is saying to us, and what is blotted out ? think about this , and read it carefully , I am not here to make a point , but to have the scripture interpret correctly , for it is not taking away , it is confirming , for the good of the believer, ? and against the doctrines of men ? thank you

[MorningGlory]

9 minutes ago, SINNERSAVED said:

thank you  in fact you have strengthen my case even more, have you really read it for what it is saying to us, and what is blotted out ? think about this , and read it carefully , I am not here to make a point , but to have the scripture interpret correctly , for it is not taking away , it is confirming , for the good of the believer, ? and against the doctrines of men ? thank you

My post didn't strengthen anything you stated.  I've read the whole chapter through several times.    Especially this part:

20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,

21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;

22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men?

[SINNERSAVED]

what , we are no longer subjected to , is not what you are getting out of this scripture, and it is not to have God be called a liar, and for Gods word is holy and truth , you cannot make it to be against what He has declared to the righteous,

 this goes hand and hand with , other scriptures that are taken out and added in by words of assumption to justify the end means

 we have as traditions followed what ever we wanted and rejected God to His face every time, if I told you as a example, God told the people in the old testament to sleep on your head upside, down , and it is to be observed until I get back or forever, and we come about two thousand years later and we say we follow God and the bible for it is truth and tells us what we must believe, and you say I am not sleeping on my head, I like sleeping on my feet, . are you really following and obeying God ? because you decide to sleep on your feet , and its uncomfortable , and you will do it your way ?

my real question is this, ,,, and its a honest , one,  WHEN,,,, WHEN are people going to start to sacrifice them selves as real believers and follow what God has told us, to stop what He hates and to do what He ask,  I see that because its over four thousand years old, it does not pertain to any one in the 2016 believers group , for it was for the people in the past , and that's history ?

is any one getting it, ? we are in the last days, and we get hung up on , attitude of the I don't feel comfortable, and so where is the HOLY GOD we serve ? just asking and its a general  statement,. we need to have some type of discipline ? don't we, so where do we start , ?

 if we believe , we cannot say we do , and do not do ?

 thank you and blessings......