ZacharyB Posted June 19, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 49 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 410 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 175 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/20/2015 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 19, 2016 (edited) 20 hours ago, SIC said: ,Agree with you a 100%. Yes, but you are from Singapore! America has been attacked big-time by Satan through the churches (and many other ways), but this is way beyond western believers to comprehend (so why even say it?). North America WAS God's model for the world to follow: Christianity and democracy. Both today are total and complete history in North America Edited June 19, 2016 by ZacharyB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
post Posted June 19, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,045 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 615 Days Won: 2 Joined: 12/09/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/03/1976 Share Posted June 19, 2016 21 minutes ago, ZacharyB said: Post ... Evidently, you haven't read all of those passages where God tells believers to CHOOSE. CHOOSE life, or death. CHOOSE to be slaves to sin, or slaves to obedience-righteousness-God. The NT teaches us that true saving faith leads one to obedience, which you probably consider to be works! But, obedience is considered to be a natural result of true belief-faith. So, when you read "believe", remember that word includes faith-trust-obedience. E.G. Several times, Jesus says, "If you love Me, obey My commands." Does anyone get to heaven who does not love Jesus? And thus, obey His commands? So again, is God bluffing, exaggerating, or lying? ... You choose. well as much as you're showing me now, "all those passages" amounts to exactly two: Joshua saying 'choose this day' to those who are under Moses -- which is utterly rhetorical. & Paul does not say "choose to be a slave to sin or to righteousness" -- he says "sin will no longer be your master" and goes to great length to explain to us that we are utterly and completely dead as far as sin and the law is concerned, so we need to realize this and act and live that way, so that our actions catch up to and match reality. the reality is that we are unleavened, even though we may fiddle with leaven, because what Christ has done for us is not worthless, but worth everything: Get rid of the old yeast, so that you may be a new unleavened batch -- as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.(1 Corinthians 5:7) what, did Christ die for nothing? but i am still under the curse of the law? come on man -- you are only telling me half of the gospel, and the half that includes neither peace nor joy nor thankfulness, nor the faithfulness of God. and have you read "all those passages" which inform us that it is not us who have chosen God, but God who has chosen us? He tells this even to Israel of old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
post Posted June 19, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,045 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 615 Days Won: 2 Joined: 12/09/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/03/1976 Share Posted June 19, 2016 17 minutes ago, ZacharyB said: The NT teaches us that true saving faith leads one to obedience, which you probably consider to be works! But, obedience is considered to be a natural result of true belief-faith. that is what i am telling you, which is why your accusation is an utter mischaracterization. the very same Spirit that gives me full assurance of my salvation, that no matter what i do, God is faithful to keep His promise to me, because He cannot deny Himself, is the very same Spirit by which i am being transformed into a creature that has a heart toward God and is ready for every good work that was prepared for me beforehand, being chosen by Him before the world was formed. so your accusation is without basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
post Posted June 19, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,045 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 615 Days Won: 2 Joined: 12/09/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/03/1976 Share Posted June 19, 2016 27 minutes ago, ZacharyB said: North America WAS God's model for the world to follow: Christianity and democracy. LOL really? look - if you have eyes to see - this is "democracy" in the Bible:Pilate then called together the chief priests and the rulers and the people, and said to them, “You brought me this man as one who was misleading the people. And after examining him before you, behold, I did not find this man guilty of any of your charges against him. Neither did Herod, for he sent him back to us. Look, nothing deserving death has been done by him. I will therefore punish and release him.” But they all cried out together, “Away with this man, and release to us Barabbas” — a man who had been thrown into prison for an insurrection started in the city and for murder. Pilate addressed them once more, desiring to release Jesus, but they kept shouting, “Crucify, crucify him!” A third time he said to them, “Why, what evil has he done? I have found in him no guilt deserving death. I will therefore punish and release him.” But they were urgent, demanding with loud cries that he should be crucified. And their voices prevailed. So Pilate decided that their demand should be granted. He released the man who had been thrown into prison for insurrection and murder, for whom they asked, but he delivered Jesus over to their will.(Luke 23:13-25) the result of popular will. Christ will return and sit enthroned -- not by election of popular vote, but by divine birthright. Christianity is not democracy; it is monarchy. only Americans think this way, that America is some kind of divine pattern for the entire world, in our vanity. Israel's kings were anointed by prophets by the will and word of God, not by a voting majority. the majority of America is lost and blinded by the god of this age and conformed to the spirit of this age -- isn't that what you yourself are contending too? but you think to put authority in their wicked hands is the pure and holy will of God as a pattern for all the world? LOL, sir, ROFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZacharyB Posted June 20, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 49 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 410 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 175 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/20/2015 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 20, 2016 22 hours ago, post said: LOL really? look - if you have eyes to see - this is "democracy" in the Bible:Pilate then called together the chief priests and the rulers and the people, and said to them, “You brought me this man as one who was misleading the people. And after examining him before you, behold, I did not find this man guilty of any of your charges against him. Neither did Herod, for he sent him back to us. Look, nothing deserving death has been done by him. I will therefore punish and release him.” But they all cried out together, “Away with this man, and release to us Barabbas” — a man who had been thrown into prison for an insurrection started in the city and for murder. Pilate addressed them once more, desiring to release Jesus, but they kept shouting, “Crucify, crucify him!” A third time he said to them, “Why, what evil has he done? I have found in him no guilt deserving death. I will therefore punish and release him.” But they were urgent, demanding with loud cries that he should be crucified. And their voices prevailed. So Pilate decided that their demand should be granted. He released the man who had been thrown into prison for insurrection and murder, for whom they asked, but he delivered Jesus over to their will.(Luke 23:13-25) the result of popular will. Christ will return and sit enthroned -- not by election of popular vote, but by divine birthright. Christianity is not democracy; it is monarchy. only Americans think this way, that America is some kind of divine pattern for the entire world, in our vanity. Israel's kings were anointed by prophets by the will and word of God, not by a voting majority. the majority of America is lost and blinded by the god of this age and conformed to the spirit of this age -- isn't that what you yourself are contending too? but you think to put authority in their wicked hands is the pure and holy will of God as a pattern for all the world? LOL, sir, ROFL. You're gonna have to read more carefully. I said North America. I did not say Christianity was democracy. And I'm not talking about 2000 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted June 20, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.35 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted June 20, 2016 On 6/17/2016 at 7:40 AM, ZacharyB said: Ultimately, man has free will to refuse to co-operate to be fully sanctified. There are severe consequences for this, including untimely death. On 6/17/2016 at 7:40 AM, ZacharyB said: Simply stated, born-again believers have no excuse for not overcoming their sins, Correct. But those who are truly born again will not be turning back to keep on sinning. On 6/17/2016 at 7:40 AM, ZacharyB said: especially since there are dozens of warnings about being habitual sinners, and the Holy Spirit has been trying to convince them to stop this! These would be those are not really saved. On 6/17/2016 at 7:40 AM, ZacharyB said: Jesus repeatedly said the one who loves Him will obey Him. Correct. So obedience would be proof of genuine salvation, and habitual sinning would be proof of no salvation. On 6/17/2016 at 7:40 AM, ZacharyB said: Practicing righteousness makes one righteous in God’s eyes. False. Believing on Christ and His finished work of redemption makes one righteous in God's eyes. Following that, God commands practical righteousness, which will be the way of those who are saved. Those who do not believe in the eternal security of the believer do not really understand (1) justification and the New Birth and (2) sanctification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
post Posted June 20, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,045 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 615 Days Won: 2 Joined: 12/09/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/03/1976 Share Posted June 20, 2016 8 hours ago, ZacharyB said: I'm not talking about 2000 years ago. oh so you are writing a 'current, updated' gospel of your own? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 On 6/18/2016 at 6:41 AM, ZacharyB said: I understand your position, but here's mine: Whether or not OSAS is true ... God has called me to point out the many NT passages which WARN: Salvation can be lost. So, is God bluffing, exaggerating, or lying? ... You choose. there are no places in the Bible where it says our salvation can be lost. We can lose rewards, but not salvation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 On 6/18/2016 at 11:11 AM, SIC said: Agree with you a 100%. If OSAS is true then why go to church? So the only reason to go to church is to stay saved? The reason a saved person goes to church is worship the Lord and fellowship with likeminded believers. If your motive for going to church is to stay saved, then your faith is your works and not in Christ's finished work on the cross. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted June 20, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,242 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 16,653 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted June 20, 2016 On June 18, 2016 at 4:41 AM, ZacharyB said: I understand your position, but here's mine: Whether or not OSAS is true ... God has called me to point out the many NT passages which WARN: Salvation can be lost. So, is God bluffing, exaggerating, or lying? ... You choose. I saw only one Scripture in your OP--John 3:16. You will have to give me more than that if you want to convince me of your position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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