tradition vs scripture

[TheMatrixHasU71]

On ‎17‎/‎08‎/‎2016 at 10:12 AM, creativemechanic said:

Catholics ( in some cases justifiably) hold a lot of flak for their holding on to manmade traditions often putting them on par or above the actual word of God. But I've found people of other denominations do this on other- thatnkfully non salvation related incidences. Whats frustrating is how people will cling to belief even tho contrary evidence is shown.

1)the KJV debate. I was raised thinking that the KJV with its 400 year old language is the only version of the bible to use. However rresearch lead me to see that while the KJV is excellent, there are recorded instances when other bibles give better explanations, plus some words have changed meaning since the 1700s so the KJV can give u slightly misleading or confusing messages.

For this reason some pastors who use KJV primarily will actually refer to the other versions with better explanations when the need arises.

But try telling that to people who have beenconditioned to be KJV only. I told a relative abt that and even gave examples (love of money is the root of all evil) . person started talking as if I'm some sorta heretic with  radical ideas.

2 I got a similar response when I pointed out that many instruments that we were brought up to think were inappropriate for service-guitar tambourine etc were actually permitted and encouraged in the bible.

Just amazing

Catholics take passages like...

2 Thessalonians 2:15   Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

 

....and use that to support their man made Catholic traditions. Because they believe that the 'word' differed from the 'epistle'.

 What they refuse to accept however is that the only 'tradition' that Paul was speaking of here was the OLD TESTAMENT or the gospel taught by them directly (as opposed to sending letters to the churches).

There WAS never anything else.

(I am KJV only too....its the only bible that doesn't water down the word of God in any way, destroying prophetic passages about the divinity of Jesus Christ like all other versions do)

 

[Willa]

On August 17, 2016 at 6:12 AM, creativemechanic said:

Catholics ( in some cases justifiably) hold a lot of flak for their holding on to manmade traditions often putting them on par or above the actual word of God. But I've found people of other denominations do this on other- thatnkfully non salvation related incidences. Whats frustrating is how people will cling to belief even tho contrary evidence is shown.

1)the KJV debate. I was raised thinking that the KJV with its 400 year old language is the only version of the bible to use. However rresearch lead me to see that while the KJV is excellent, there are recorded instances when other bibles give better explanations, plus some words have changed meaning since the 1700s so the KJV can give u slightly misleading or confusing messages.

For this reason some pastors who use KJV primarily will actually refer to the other versions with better explanations when the need arises.

But try telling that to people who have beenconditioned to be KJV only. I told a relative abt that and even gave examples (love of money is the root of all evil) . person started talking as if I'm some sorta heretic with  radical ideas.

2 I got a similar response when I pointed out that many instruments that we were brought up to think were inappropriate for service-guitar tambourine etc were actually permitted and encouraged in the bible.

Just amazing

I had a similar conversation with a Lutheran pastor about the use of trumpets during the Alleluia Chorus one Christmas, which caused a church split!  After showing him where trumpets were used in the Bible, he admitted that it may be Biblical but it is not Lutheran!  This, from Lutherans would make Luther turn over in his grave.  Sola Scriptura! 

Where bibles are concerned, I often quote other versions, but have recently been using the WEB version a lot because it uses majority Texts as well as ASV.  Many modern versions also use Young's literal translation.  ALT is built purely on Majority Texts.  I do have respect for ASV and have used  NASB.  I prefer the basic text of the majority texts as well as the phrasing of newer literal translations.  So comparison is good.   The phrasing and language of KJV is simply not easy for me to understand, and the meanings of many English words have changed, so I don't trust it as much as newer versions.  At least they finally got most of the blatant errors out of KJV, like "thou shalt commit adultery".  But it took a couple of hundred years to iron out.  NKJV is excellent.

[Behold]

21 hours ago, Teditis said:

I disagree because the message and the meaning are quite clearly made... that God was manifested in the flesh.

Furthermore, as I understand it, in the Greek originals (according to Strong's) it's a pronoun that's used here...

not the word "god" nor the name of God.

But I can understand that it's important to some... so I leave you to it. Blessings

Well, first of all, you dont read Koine Greek, and there are no "original greek" manuscripts, extant.

All we have are copies of copies with on occasion a piece here or there that is REALLY early..

So, here is a tip for you, ... whenever you hear someone correcting a bible (usually the KJV), as KJV correctors are like black mushrooms growing  in a wet barn floor (everywhere)... and they say... "well, we see that the KVJ says, .....BUT, if we look at the ORIGINAL GREEK..... = ok stop right there, as you are dealing with ither a liar, or an uneducated unethical teacher, who has not studied manuscript evidence, but understands that you can fool the kiddies into thinking you know what you are talking about if you lead them to believe you have some mastery of the "original manuscripts" = horsefeathers on a hayride. = a great pretender = a pride filled fool who thinks he is worthy to sit in judgment of the word of God and correct it before an audience.

The fact is, never pay any attention to dimbolts who talk about the "original manuscripts"  or who have a habit of correcting a bible...  = so, when you come into contact with one of these fakirs, just look the other way, or run the other way... etc.

So, Teditis.... You have to think about things in light of what we all understand and how we come understand things.

For example, most Christians believe in the "Trinity"......but this is not a word found in the bible, yet, most of us know what it is because its a doctrine that is universally taught and understood, worldwide

However, say you were born again for 15 mins, after having heard a street preacher preach the Good News.......and prior to this you have never been in a church, and never read one verse in a bible, and suddenly you are on an Island in the Caribbean all by yourself and you have a KJV.

So, you have no idea ( in that situation), about the Trinity, the Rapture, the Deity of Christ, Justification by Faith, .., and in fact most Christian do not read their bible, much less study it, and yet, they know all about the Trinity, and the Deity of Christ, and other doctrines as this is just mental osmosis, its just a fact of what occurs within the understanding of people when they are around bible teaching..

This is why its so important that the NT Doctrines are presented correctly in a BIBLE, as without this, you have a book full of verses, but you dont have a BIBLE.

[ghtan]

12 hours ago, creativemechanic said:

That verse didnt make sense to me in the KJV.It says the love of money is the root of all evil, but there are many types of evil- rape , abuse, that have no roots in money. Then i learned that other texts  translate it better as- the love of money is the root of all kinds of evil ,which makes moresense

Precisely, but there will probably be some die-hard KJV fans who will try to explain away that logical difficulty.

[Ezra]

3 hours ago, ghtan said:

Precisely, but there will probably be some die-hard KJV fans who will try to explain away that logical difficulty.

What logical difficulty?  "All evil" includes any and every kind of evil, since the word "all" is all-encompassing.  Even the plural of "evils" not really necessary.

Once again the KJV is proven to be a faithful, accurate and reliable translation in spite of all propaganda to the contrary.

[ghtan]

2 hours ago, Ezra said:

What logical difficulty?  "All evil" includes any and every kind of evil, since the word "all" is all-encompassing.  Even the plural of "evils" not really necessary.

Once again the KJV is proven to be a faithful, accurate and reliable translation in spite of all propaganda to the contrary.

It is in the article "the" before root. Compare NKJV with KJV.

[LadyKay]

On 8/17/2016 at 9:12 AM, creativemechanic said:

Catholics ( in some cases justifiably) hold a lot of flak for their holding on to manmade traditions often putting them on par or above the actual word of God. But I've found people of other denominations do this on other- thatnkfully non salvation related incidences. Whats frustrating is how people will cling to belief even tho contrary evidence is shown.

1)the KJV debate. I was raised thinking that the KJV with its 400 year old language is the only version of the bible to use. However rresearch lead me to see that while the KJV is excellent, there are recorded instances when other bibles give better explanations, plus some words have changed meaning since the 1700s so the KJV can give u slightly misleading or confusing messages.

For this reason some pastors who use KJV primarily will actually refer to the other versions with better explanations when the need arises.

But try telling that to people who have beenconditioned to be KJV only. I told a relative abt that and even gave examples (love of money is the root of all evil) . person started talking as if I'm some sorta heretic with  radical ideas.

2 I got a similar response when I pointed out that many instruments that we were brought up to think were inappropriate for service-guitar tambourine etc were actually permitted and encouraged in the bible.

Just amazing

I  just don't don't argue it anymore. Unless I am forced to do so. I know that the study Bible I am using now has open up the Word Of God to me in a way that the KJV did not. Knowing that is good enough for me and if others refuse to believe me, well that is up to them. People get stuck sometimes and refuse to grow. Some people think they are 100% right about everything and refuse to even consider that just maybe they got a few things wrong. I feel this attitude of I'm always right keeps people from growing. There is nothing wrong with being open to what someone else is saying and considering it. But some people become all offended by this and when they can't dispute what you say, they accuse you of not being a Christian.

[PatrolMan]

On 8/17/2016 at 8:12 AM, creativemechanic said:

Catholics ( in some cases justifiably) hold a lot of flak for their holding on to manmade traditions often putting them on par or above the actual word of God. But I've found people of other denominations do this on other- thatnkfully non salvation related incidences. Whats frustrating is how people will cling to belief even tho contrary evidence is shown.

1)the KJV debate. I was raised thinking that the KJV with its 400 year old language is the only version of the bible to use. However rresearch lead me to see that while the KJV is excellent, there are recorded instances when other bibles give better explanations, plus some words have changed meaning since the 1700s so the KJV can give u slightly misleading or confusing messages.

For this reason some pastors who use KJV primarily will actually refer to the other versions with better explanations when the need arises.

But try telling that to people who have beenconditioned to be KJV only. I told a relative abt that and even gave examples (love of money is the root of all evil) . person started talking as if I'm some sorta heretic with  radical ideas.

2 I got a similar response when I pointed out that many instruments that we were brought up to think were inappropriate for service-guitar tambourine etc were actually permitted and encouraged in the bible.

Just amazing

One mistake that Christians make is using the English  dictionary for words in the bible. I use the Hebrew and Greek dictionaries to define the words in the bible. Makes a big difference believe me..Have a good one.