sabbath day

[Guest BacKaran]

i agree with  Ezra because Jesus fulfilled the law of Moses perfectly which is why we can totally rest in Him and worship whatever day you choose, because of what Christ did, not because man claims the Sabbath is a certain day of the week. 

Many people do not understand that we are no longer under the OT law per se as we are living our lives for Christ. Yes, we still abide by the ten commandments but we realize we still sin here and confess those sins but our fallen nature has been perfected for eternity by Christ birth, death and resurrection.

[Remnantrob]

On 10/9/2016 at 0:39 PM, Ezra said:

God would say that the sabbath is the last day of the week, but the Lord's Day is the first day of the week, and the Lord's Day therefore supersedes the sabbath. Revelation 1:10,11 is important.

10I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,

11Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

Where is "the Lord's day" described as "the 8th day" or sunday in the bible? 

[Remnantrob]

On 10/9/2016 at 0:39 PM, Ezra said:

God would say that the sabbath is the last day of the week, but the Lord's Day is the first day of the week, and the Lord's Day therefore supersedes the sabbath. Revelation 1:10,11 is important.

10I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,

11Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

Where is "the Lord's day" described as "the 8th day" or sunday in the bible? 

[Remnantrob]

On 10/9/2016 at 9:27 PM, ayin jade said:

The sabbath is and has always been friday sunset to saturday sunset. But in the book of acts, the early apostles and Christians met on the first day of the week. Nowhere was this condemned. So worship on saturday. Or worship on sunday. The important point is to worship our Lord, not which day you worship Him. 

I'm sure you've heard this rebuttal before, but for the sake of newbies that may be reading, When you say that the early apostles and Christians met on the first day of the week, are you referring to Acts 20:7?

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⁷ And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

If so could breaking bread just be referring to getting together to share a meal in fellowship?  I'm asking this based on vs 11 of the same chapter
 

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ESV

¹¹ And when Paul had gone up and had broken bread and eaten, he conversed with them a long while, until daybreak, and so departed.

 

and also Acts 2:42-47

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⁴² And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

⁴³ And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.

⁴⁴ And all that believed were together, and had all things common;

⁴⁵ And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.

⁴⁶ And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,

⁴⁷ Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

 

 

[Remnantrob]

On 10/10/2016 at 7:28 PM, PatrolMan said:

How about Romans 14:5 ?  Is the fourth commandment in the New Testament ? Are we under the law or under Grace? Good topic to say the least. Have a good one.

Notice that the whole chapter is about judging.

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⁴ Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

¹⁰ But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

¹³ Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.

 

I don't think the issue is over the 7th day Sabbath of the Moral law but over the yearly feast days of the ceremonial law. Jewish Christians were judging Gentile Christians for not observing them even though the ceremonial laws were no longer binding.

[Remnantrob]

On 10/9/2016 at 1:23 PM, RustyAngeL said:

Many people criticize people for going to worship on Sunday.  However read Colossians 4:14-17.  It makes it very clear we are not to be judged by what day you worship.  I believe we are  worship everyday. So don't worry.

Blessings, RustyAngeL

I think you meant Colossians 2:14-17

 

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¹⁴ Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

¹⁵ And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

¹⁶ Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

¹⁷ Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

 

Let's sum up what we've read here:

1) The laws he was talking about is the "ordinances" which are carnal, not the moral law of the 10 Commandments which are spiritual.

2) The laws he mentioned were written by hand, but the moral law of the 10 Commandments were not written by hand but by the finger of God. (Ex. 31:18)
 

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And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

 

 

3) The laws he is referring to were always "against" the people.  Compared to Deut. 31:26 we see that it was the book of the law that contained curses and ordinances that was against the people.

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²⁶ Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

 

Also notice that vs 16 spoke of meat or drink or in respect of an holy day or of the new moon.  If you look at the sabbath commandment in Exodus 20 it mentions nothing of meat, drink, or new moons.  Therefore one can see that there has to be more it this judging than the weekly. Sabbath.  Notice in Leviticus 23:37,38 it mentions those characteristics.

 

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³⁷ These are the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord, a burnt offering, and a meat offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, every thing upon his day:

³⁸ Beside the sabbaths of the Lord, and beside your gifts, and beside all your vows, and beside all your freewill offerings, which ye give unto theLord.

 

[Remnantrob]

38 minutes ago, Yowm said:

How would you handle this passage?...

Romans 14:5-6 KJVS
[5] One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike . Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. [6] He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it . etc.

 

Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it . etc.

 

the quote button seems to be acting up a bit so bear with me.  Paul was, from the very beginning speaking about Christians in the faith and the beliefs with respect for foods.  Do we think he would all of a sudden drift off to another topic all together and speak about the Sabbath day?  The way most Christians interpret this verse would make it seem like Paul was doing just that, but if we consider both the immediate context along with the very next verse(6), we will learn that there is a specific issue Paul was trying to zero in on.

 

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⁶ He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

Note carefully that the same logic used for the day is used also for the eating! Just as one can esteem a day for the Lord, one can eat for the Lord.  Or, just as one can esteem a day not for the Lord, one can not eat for the Lord. There is a parallel.

In other words however you interpret the "day" you will also need to use the same logic to interpret the "eating" for both are being treated the same way. Now, let's for a moment interpret the words "esteemeth a day" the way most Christians do.  This would mean that if we can esteem any day to be our Sabbath, then we can eat anything we'd like as well.  This is not a problem for many Christians because they feel the bible supports eating whatever you want.  But that's another topic.  Lets look at it from another angle.  If we say he's telling us we can choose not to esteem any day then that means we can likewise choose not to eat anything.  Is starvation the will of God?  Of course not.  Paul is speaking (Rom. 14) eating foods in connection with days.  To be more specific fasting on certain days.  Apparently, some (weak in the faith) feel they should eat on certain days, but not on other days.  Others must have disagreed with them.  Paul settles the dispute, telling the mature Christians to receive these who feel they should fast in this manner and not to dispute, or debate with them on that issue.  Why?  Because nevertheless..."We shall all stand before the judgement seat of Christ.

Apparently, the issue over when to fast did not cease with the Romans:

Didache 8:1-2

(1)And let not your fastings be with the hypocrites, for they fast on the second and fifth day of the week;

(2) but do ye keep your fast on the fourth and on the preparation(the sixth) day.

Although the Didache is not part of the canon (and for good reasons) we find it noticeable that the issue over "when" to fast was still present at least a century after Paul wrote those words in Romans 14.  It's also hinted in Luke 18:12 that the idea on when to fast, or at least how many times in a week to fast, was present even before the epistle to the Romans was written.  There's more that Paul is telling in this chapter of course, but we can at least see for now that he is not dealing with the Sabbath issue at all.  His concern was rather on how the Christian Romans were dealing with the weaker Christians and their new found faith.

 

[Remnantrob]

6 minutes ago, Giller said:

Now the Lord's day is referring to the first day of the week , but there is a debate whether it should be from even to even , that is even saturday to even sunday , or if it should be according to our roman calender.

Scriptures to support that? 

[Remnantrob]

Just now, Giller said:

I will get back to you on that but yes there is.

thanks bro.

[Remnantrob]

3 minutes ago, Yowm said:

I don't see the issue of food being the primary context but not stumbling the weak brother...

Romans 14:1 KJVS
[1] Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.

The food issue had to do with eating meat oR herbs and not let that be a means of causing the weaker brother. In the same vein, one honors a certain day, another esteems all days alike...and that also is not to be a point of stumbling the weaker brother.

Paul goes on to say...

Romans 14:13 KJVS
[13] Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.

 

 

Notice that Paul speaks about foods(or abstaining from foods) and then he speaks about days. Where else in the bible have we seen these two things connected(foods and days)? Isaiah 58:5

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⁵ Is it such a fast that I have chosen? a day for a man to afflict his soul? is it to bow down his head as a bulrush, and to spread sackcloth and ashes under him? wilt thou call this a fast, and an acceptable day to theLord?