Could the antichrist be a Muslim

[iamlamad]

5 hours ago, Diaste said:

How then would you find a mountain that was moved from it's place? It's not there. You look around, can't find it. Not found. Same concept as moved out of place.

I suppose then you think that Everest would just be moved over to the Congo? So then I suppose it would still be 'found'.

 Islands moved out of their places. You sail to Hawaii. Right coordinates. No island. Huh? Gone I guess. Must have ran off. Sank. On vacation. Gone.  Same concept as moved out of place.  Moved out of their place, fled away, still gone and that's the concept; gone, gone, gone.

Your opinion means little when no scripture advances your arguments.

 

"Friday's powerful earthquake appears to have moved the main island of Japan by 8 feet
Report: The 8.9-magnitude earthquake shifted the Earth on its axis by 4 inches"

This is the earthquake that caused the big tsunami in Japan.

Every mountain on the planet was MOVED out of its previous place by this earthquake that hit Japan. Yet, all these mountains can be found. Your theory here does not hold water.

As for Hawaii? I guess a mathematician could calculate how far it moved. I cannot.

Just read what is written and BELIEVE IT! It is not that difficult. At the 6th seal, the earthquake will be strong enough to move the mountains (probably just a little). But at the 7th vial earthquake, the earth will shake so violently that the mountains shake down into the earth.  In other words, they will disappear. The same will happen with the islands.

So what part of these scriptures do you not believe?

[iamlamad]

5 hours ago, Diaste said:

I knew you were going to say that. The concept is more important that the terms or usage. The end result is the mountains and islands are GONE. I don't care if it was said the islands  and mountains took a long leisurely stroll to the 15th dimension, they are gone! 

Guess what? Things that appear similar, are similar. It's not just the earthquakes you fixate upon. All the other similarities must be considered as well: voices, thunders, lightning, earthquake, hail. Taken together these are the same events. I don't need this much evidence in court to prove my case.

Add to this the immutable fact that the wrath of God comes with the 6th seal and the 7th trump and no other conclusion is possible. 

But again, feel free to engage in rhetoric instead of posting scriptures of proof.

 

It will be exceedingly difficult for people to climb up into the mountains and find caves and cry for the mountains to fall on them, when the mountains have disappeared.  All together they are NOT the same event: one takes place at the start of the Day of the Lord, and before the start of the 70th week, while the other will take place after the 70th week has finished.

Perhaps you need to do some study on Greek Aorist tense verbs.

[iamlamad]

5 hours ago, Diaste said:

Diaste wrote:

There are different people groups being mentioned. It is the CHURCH that is gathered, but it is the Jews (Hebrews) that are sealed for their protection.

Post scripture proving this, if you can. The NT disputes you claim.

In Rev. 7, the intermission between the 6th and 7th seals, we see two events taking place or having taken place. Picture this intermission as the closing of the curtains on one act of a play. What goes on behind the curtain? They are rearranging the set for the next act. That is what John is doing here: the set must be ready for the next act, which is the start of the 70th week of Daniel at the 7th seal.  So two events MUST TAKE PLACE (the setting made ready) before the 7th seal.

More wishful thinking. John isn't doing anything but writing. These visions and truth come from God. God is doing everything, not John.

1. The 144,000 must be sealed for their protection

2. The Bride of Christ must be transported into heaven for safety.

In Revelation 7 we see both of these accomplished.

And finally ignoring he wealth of scripture I posted.

Did you just overlook the 12,000 from each tribe? No need to post it: you already know this. You should believe it. They are not the church, or is the church or the Bride of Christ them. John is showing us two separate groups in the same chapter (7).

I agree it is God giving John the visions, but it is John writing. I am sorry you have missed John's (and the Holy Spirit behind him) intermissions and why he wrote in this fashion. There was good reason why the Holy Spirit had John insert chapter 7 between chapters 6 & 8.

Perhaps your "wealth of scripture" was just not the right scripture for the discussion. It may be we agree on some prophetic points. That remains to be seen.

Do you DOUBT that the sealing of the 144,000 was for their protection?

Do you DOUBT that the bride of Christ will be removed to heaven for safety?

If you doubt these things, then show scripture to prove them wrong.

[iamlamad]

5 hours ago, Diaste said:

I have heard people say just about anything to justify their actions and ideas. You can make any claim you want but mean spirited words and behaviors toward those who disagree with you is unloving. 

The fact is you are insulting, not frank, with your comments, " No logical person..." "No thinking person...", etc. You have said as much to me several times. But your pride won't allow you deal with it. 

You have turned yourself into a victim in this just like so many. Cannot deal with being confronted about your behavior so you turn it around and become the victim. You have enormous issues with anyone that disagrees with you and your strategy is to engage in shaming by using comments like the above. You have repeatedly told me from the beginning I lack understanding, insight, intelligence, wisdom and knowledge. This is bullying behavior and not openness or honesty. 

You can understand your calling all you wish, wonder what God actually called you to do?

Ha! Now this post I can agree with! See? I knew there was some points we would agree on!

[Diaste]

I think we all better take a good hard look at what's going on in the world today. 

I know many here believe at the end of the age Rome will be revived and the AC will rise from some political entity representing the RRE.

The problem with this is where do we see evidence of such a revival? Shouldn't we be seeing a Golden Eagle emblazoned on a building in Europe? Or on a flag? Armbands? Anything signifying the desire of a group to reorganize the Roman empire would be helpful. Maybe a political party named Roman Conservative Party, or some such? Do we hear any calls for forming a senate body in the EU to elect a leader based on the Roman model of a republic or dictatorship? And where are the remnants of the Roman political entity? Not the RCC, this is a religious entity, not a political one. I'm not seeing any such thing but if someone has, please let me know.

We do see the reboot of an empire that ruled the known world. An entity that never died out but grew since it's abolition in the early 1900's. Today this group has unsettled the entire world and too many are ignoring this. We are ignoring the evidence that is right before our eyes. Why do we do that? Why are we predisposed to doggedly adhere to our conceptions and ignore reality? Maybe it's because we don't like reality intruding on personal ideals. I hate that myself but I still allow the evidence to engage and refute, if possible, my preconceptions. We all need to change our thinking to fit the facts.

The facts are Radical Islam is on the rise. This theocracy is bent on killing or enslaving everyone refusing to convert. They slaughter men, women and children all over the world by any means necessary. They use vehicles to mow down anyone not them and use beheadings to terrorize everyone, and they increase in number. Their numbers increase in populated areas not just on the battlefield. This is worse and more difficult than fighting against an army in a defined theater. The army of radical Islam is spread far and wide in many western cities and it's much larger than most know. 

We have already been invaded by enormous sleeper cells just waiting for the moment when their leader rises to world prominence. 

That leader is going to be Islamic. They are well prepared and in place to carry out the commands of this coming leader. We all to need to be prepared ourselves.

 

[BobRyan]

10 minutes ago, Diaste said:

I think we all better take a good hard look at what's going on in the world today. 

I know many here believe at the end of the age Rome will be revived and the AC will rise from some political entity representing the RRE.

The problem with this is where do we see evidence of such a revival? Shouldn't we be seeing a Golden Eagle emblazoned on a building in Europe? Or on a flag? Armbands? Anything signifying the desire of a group to reorganize the Roman empire would be helpful. Maybe a political party named Roman Conservative Party, or some such? Do we hear any calls for forming a senate body in the EU to elect a leader based on the Roman model of a republic or dictatorship? And where are the remnants of the Roman political entity? Not the RCC, this is a religious entity, not a political one. I'm not seeing any such thing but if someone has, please let me know.

We do see the reboot of an empire that ruled the known world. An entity that never died out but grew since it's abolition in the early 1900's. Today this group has unsettled the entire world and too many are ignoring this. We are ignoring the evidence that is right before our eyes. Why do we do that? Why are we predisposed to doggedly adhere to our conceptions and ignore reality? Maybe it's because we don't like reality intruding on personal ideals. I hate that myself but I still allow the evidence to engage and refute, if possible, my preconceptions. We all need to change our thinking to fit the facts.

The facts are Radical Islam is on the rise. This theocracy is bent on killing or enslaving everyone refusing to convert. They slaughter men, women and children all over the world by any means necessary. They use vehicles to mow down anyone not them and use beheadings to terrorize everyone, and they increase in number. Their numbers increase in populated areas not just on the battlefield. This is worse and more difficult than fighting against an army in a defined theater. The army of radical Islam is spread far and wide in many western cities and it's much larger than most know. 

We have already been invaded by enormous sleeper cells just waiting for the moment when their leader rises to world prominence. 

That leader is going to be Islamic. They are well prepared and in place to carry out the commands of this coming leader. We all to need to be prepared ourselves.

Certainly it is true that what some call "the king of the south" in Daniel 12 - may well be Islam - (Egypt at one point and then Islam) -- and it fights against Rome the RCC "the king of the North" as Daniel 11 and 12 point out.

But Daniel 7 and Revelation 12 make it clear that it is Rome, the RCC that dominates during the 1260 years of the dark ages.

In Rev 13 -- another beast arises after the end of the dark ages. The papacy receives a deadly wound (1798) after the 1260 years  - and that wound is also later healed after those dark ages.

[iamlamad]

On 6/4/2017 at 7:18 AM, Diaste said:

I think we all better take a good hard look at what's going on in the world today. 

I know many here believe at the end of the age Rome will be revived and the AC will rise from some political entity representing the RRE.

The problem with this is where do we see evidence of such a revival? Shouldn't we be seeing a Golden Eagle emblazoned on a building in Europe? Or on a flag? Armbands? Anything signifying the desire of a group to reorganize the Roman empire would be helpful. Maybe a political party named Roman Conservative Party, or some such? Do we hear any calls for forming a senate body in the EU to elect a leader based on the Roman model of a republic or dictatorship? And where are the remnants of the Roman political entity? Not the RCC, this is a religious entity, not a political one. I'm not seeing any such thing but if someone has, please let me know.

We do see the reboot of an empire that ruled the known world. An entity that never died out but grew since it's abolition in the early 1900's. Today this group has unsettled the entire world and too many are ignoring this. We are ignoring the evidence that is right before our eyes. Why do we do that? Why are we predisposed to doggedly adhere to our conceptions and ignore reality? Maybe it's because we don't like reality intruding on personal ideals. I hate that myself but I still allow the evidence to engage and refute, if possible, my preconceptions. We all need to change our thinking to fit the facts.

The facts are Radical Islam is on the rise. This theocracy is bent on killing or enslaving everyone refusing to convert. They slaughter men, women and children all over the world by any means necessary. They use vehicles to mow down anyone not them and use beheadings to terrorize everyone, and they increase in number. Their numbers increase in populated areas not just on the battlefield. This is worse and more difficult than fighting against an army in a defined theater. The army of radical Islam is spread far and wide in many western cities and it's much larger than most know. 

We have already been invaded by enormous sleeper cells just waiting for the moment when their leader rises to world prominence. 

That leader is going to be Islamic. They are well prepared and in place to carry out the commands of this coming leader. We all to need to be prepared ourselves.

 

Good post! When I look at the "five fallen:" Egypt - Muslim nation today; Assyria = Muslim nation today; Babylon = Iraq = a  Muslim nation today; Medo-persia = Iran = Muslim nation today; Greece as in the Middle East as in the Seleucid Empire = same land areas as these others  = all Muslim lands today.   I might add, one of these heads, Iraq, has received a deadly wound and the king put to death.

[Daniel 11:36]

Good post !!!  You have cleared the air

The "anti-christ" will rise up in the vestiges of the region of modern Turkey/Syria/Iraq where Antiochus IV ruled just before the first century [Daniel 11:21-35]

This one is noted in the next verses [Daniel 11:36-45]

It is the Lord who will confirm His covenant with a portion of believing Israel ..... and it is the other prince who is the anti-christ [Daniel 9:26-27]

The inter-positional time frame is that of the offering of salvation to the Gentiles which is about 2000 years still on going

Once the Lord is ready He will take all of those made immortal [Romans 11:25], and then He will the bring the 70th week decreed for Israel  .... the coming tribulation period

 

Edited June 5, 2017 by Daniel 11:36

[BobRyan]

On 6/4/2017 at 8:27 AM, BobRyan said:

Certainly it is true that what some call "the king of the south" in Daniel 12 - may well be Islam - (Egypt at one point and then Islam) -- and it fights against Rome the RCC "the king of the North" as Daniel 11 and 12 point out.

But Daniel 7 and Revelation 12 make it clear that it is Rome, the RCC that dominates during the 1260 years of the dark ages.

In Rev 13 -- another beast arises after the end of the dark ages. The papacy receives a deadly wound (1798) after the 1260 years  - and that wound is also later healed after those dark ages.

 

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

When I look at the "five fallen:" Egypt - Muslim nation today; Assyria = Muslim nation today; Babylon = Iraq = a  Muslim nation today; Medo-persia = Iran = Muslim nation today; Greece as in the Middle East as in the Seleucid Empire = same land areas as these others  = all Muslim lands today.   I might add, one of these heads, Iraq, has received a deadly wound and the king put to death.

The "5 have fallen" of Rev 17 refers to the 4 in Daniel 7 - Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, pagan-Rome, and the 5th is the little horn (papacy) of both Dan 7 and 8 that fell when it received the deadly wound in Rev 13. All of these had already been named in the Bible except for pagan-Rome and the papacy.

John is taken to a time context still future to his day -  where the 4 empires of the past already named in Dan 2, 7 and 8 have fallen and also the 5^th (which is little horn) of Dan 7 has fallen. (Rev 13 – deadly wound 1798)

 

 

[iamlamad]

5 hours ago, BobRyan said:

 

The "5 have fallen" of Rev 17 refers to the 4 in Daniel 7 - Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, pagan-Rome, and the 5th is the little horn (papacy) of both Dan 7 and 8 that fell when it received the deadly wound in Rev 13. All of these had already been named in the Bible except for pagan-Rome and the papacy.

John is taken to a time context still future to his day -  where the 4 empires of the past already named in Dan 2, 7 and 8 have fallen and also the 5^th (which is little horn) of Dan 7 has fallen. (Rev 13 – deadly wound 1798)

That sounds good in theory, but then, in Daniel 7 when the main beast is killed, it is written that the others lives are spared for a time and a season (1 year and 1 month?) It seems then that Daniel is telling us that these 4 beasts (kings with kingdoms) are all alive RIGHT NOW in the earth.