The Trinity & The Godhead

[Thorwald]

When I compare John 1:18 and 5:37 to Acts 7:55-56 and God saying, "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased," I am very puzzled. These scriptures seem to contradict one another. We then have to cope with John [who was in the spirit] seeing God and Christ, in Revelation chapters 4 and 5.

I also have trouble with making sense of Isaiah 44:6, and the ending of Revelation 1:6 ["unto God and His Father"].

Your thoughts would be very much appreciated.

 

Edited May 9, 2017 by Thorwald
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[wingnut-]

I John 5:6 This is He who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ; not only by water, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit who bears witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness on earth: the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.

God bless

[wingnut-]

I'll try to explain this in my own words, I hope you find this more helpful.  When God has presented Himself to anyone throughout the bible, it was Jesus they were seeing, not the Father.  When someone heard God, it was either Jesus or the Spirit of God they were hearing, not God the Father.

In the case of John or Stephen, they were both in the Spirit, not in the flesh, so it was more like a vision or a dream.  Have you ever had a dream, where someone else is part of your dream, but you can't see their face, yet somehow know that you know this individual?  Sometimes you may not ever know who it was, but you know it was someone that you know.  That is how I see those occasions.

It's also important to note that in the Acts passage it does not say Stephen saw God, it says he saw the glory of God.  I can't say what that means precisely, but I liken it to maybe a brightness that drowns out the shape of what is behind it.

God bless

[OneLight]

19 hours ago, Thorwald said:

When I compare John 1:18 and 5:37 to Acts 7:55-56 and God saying, "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased," I am very puzzled. These scriptures seem to contradict one another. We then have to cope with John [who was in the spirit] seeing God and Christ, in Revelation chapters 4 and 5.

I also have trouble with making sense of Isaiah 44:6, and the ending of Revelation 1:6 ["unto God and His Father"].

Your thoughts would be very much appreciated.

 

How do you see a contradiction?  If you read the verses in their context, they show you the truth.  Take any verse out of context and compare to any other and you will have confusion, which is how false doctrine is developed, so I do suggest you keep them in their proper context for better understanding.

On another note, if you have a question as to how the site is run, please PM one of the servants and they will answer.

[George]

On 5/9/2017 at 1:13 AM, Thorwald said:

When I compare John 1:18 and 5:37 to Acts 7:55-56 and God saying, "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased," I am very puzzled. These scriptures seem to contradict one another. We then have to cope with John [who was in the spirit] seeing God and Christ, in Revelation chapters 4 and 5.

I also have trouble with making sense of Isaiah 44:6, and the ending of Revelation 1:6 ["unto God and His Father"].

One of the greatest mysteries of the Bible is the TriUnity of God.  I use the word TriUnity since in the Hebrew we have the word -- ECHAD for the word ONE when discussing one of the Words for God, which literally means ONENESS.  If it was ABSOLUTE ONE you would use the Hebrew word Yachid.

For example, we read in Genesis,

Genesis 1:26  Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. And let them have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over the livestock and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." 

This is very connected to what it says in Isaiah 48.

Isa 48:16  Draw near to me, hear this: from the beginning I have not spoken in secret, from the time it came to be I have been there." And now the Lord GOD has sent me, and his Spirit. 
Isa 48:17  Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: "I am the LORD your God, who teaches you to profit, who leads you in the way you should go. 

We have a picture of the Lord God and the Lord God the Redeemer.  So even in Isaiah we read how there was unity, however different aspects of God.

Isa 43:10  "You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me. 
Isa 43:11  I, I am the LORD, and besides me there is no savior. 

In Daniel, we begin to see a deeper mystery ...

Dan 7:9  "As I looked, thrones were placed, and the Ancient of Days took his seat; his clothing was white as snow, and the hair of his head like pure wool; his throne was fiery flames; its wheels were burning fire. 
Dan 7:10  A stream of fire issued and came out from before him; a thousand thousands served him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him; the court sat in judgment, and the books were opened. 
Dan 7:11  "I looked then because of the sound of the great words that the horn was speaking. And as I looked, the beast was killed, and its body destroyed and given over to be burned with fire. 
Dan 7:12  As for the rest of the beasts, their dominion was taken away, but their lives were prolonged for a season and a time. 
Dan 7:13  "I saw in the night visions, and behold, with the clouds of heaven there came one like a son of man, and he came to the Ancient of Days and was presented before him. 
Dan 7:14  And to him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom, that all peoples, nations, and languages should serve him; his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom one that shall not be destroyed. 
Dan 7:15  "As for me, Daniel, my spirit within me was anxious, and the visions of my head alarmed me. 
Dan 7:16  I approached one of those who stood there and asked him the truth concerning all this. So he told me and made known to me the interpretation of the things. 
Dan 7:17  'These four great beasts are four kings who shall arise out of the earth. 
Dan 7:18  But the saints of the Most High shall receive the kingdom and possess the kingdom forever, forever and ever.' 
Dan 7:19  "Then I desired to know the truth about the fourth beast, which was different from all the rest, exceedingly terrifying, with its teeth of iron and claws of bronze, and which devoured and broke in pieces and stamped what was left with its feet, 
Dan 7:20  and about the ten horns that were on its head, and the other horn that came up and before which three of them fell, the horn that had eyes and a mouth that spoke great things, and that seemed greater than its companions. 
Dan 7:21  As I looked, this horn made war with the saints and prevailed over them, 
Dan 7:22  until the Ancient of Days came, and judgment was given for the saints of the Most High, and the time came when the saints possessed the kingdom. 
Dan 7:23  "Thus he said: 'As for the fourth beast, there shall be a fourth kingdom on earth, which shall be different from all the kingdoms, and it shall devour the whole earth, and trample it down, and break it to pieces. 
Dan 7:24  As for the ten horns, out of this kingdom ten kings shall arise, and another shall arise after them; he shall be different from the former ones, and shall put down three kings. 
Dan 7:25  He shall speak words against the Most High, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High, and shall think to change the times and the law; and they shall be given into his hand for a time, times, and half a time. 
Dan 7:26  But the court shall sit in judgment, and his dominion shall be taken away, to be consumed and destroyed to the end. 
Dan 7:27  And the kingdom and the dominion and the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven shall be given to the people of the saints of the Most High; his kingdom shall be an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.' 
Dan 7:28  "Here is the end of the matter. As for me, Daniel, my thoughts greatly alarmed me, and my color changed, but I kept the matter in my heart." 

So we see in Daniel the difference in the Son of Man and the Ancient of Days, thus we see the distinction once again in Revelation 22.

Rev 22:1  And he showed me a pure river of Water of Life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. 
Rev 22:2  In the midst of its street, and of the river, from here and from there, was the Tree of Life, which bore twelve fruits, each yielding its fruit according to one month. And the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. 
Rev 22:3  And every curse will no longer be; but the throne of God and of the Lamb will be in it, and His servants will serve Him. 

While we can't fully understand the TriUnity of God, it's clearly shown throughout Scripture.