Suicide

[nebula]

SisterT -

Love you, but I've got "legalism" warning bells going off in my head.

OK, what am I thinking? The verse you were quoting comes from the I John, stating that a man who does not love his brother is a murderer. I am reminded of Jesus' sermon on the mount about hatred, how murder comes from the heart. I wonder if "murderer" in the context of Scripture here has more to do with a "heart' issue than a "deed" issue. I mean, there's a difference between someone who commits manslaughter (unintentional killing of someone) being called a murderer and someone who has murder seathing in his heart being called a murderer. See the difference?

Now, I could just as easily argue that anyone suffering from depression is a murderer. Why? Because the passage is referring to those that do not love their brother. How many people who suffer from depression struggle with self-hatred?

So, do we now say that anyone suffering from depression is not going to Heaven?

Just some thoughts to get the chains in the head working.

[Catsmeow]

Nebula: The best answer to these kinds of questions are this:

God is perfect in knowledge and has all the facts, (unlike humans)...he's incapable of making a wrong choice or unfair verdict.

God is a God of mercy and often shows mercy to whomever He chooses to show mercy.

I can only trust God's perfect decision to do what is right and fair and just, while trusting in His mammoth compassion and merciful tendencies.

God is so very patient and kind and where there is any hope for leniency, God will grant it, I imagine.

[SisterT-Enduring2TheEnd]

OK, what am I thinking?  The verse you were quoting comes from the I John, stating that a man who does not love his brother is a murderer.  I am reminded of Jesus' sermon on the mount about hatred, how murder comes from the heart.  I wonder if "murderer" in the context of Scripture here has more to do with a "heart' issue than a "deed" issue.  I mean, there's a difference between someone who commits manslaughter (unintentional killing of someone) being called a murderer and someone who has murder seathing in his heart being called a murderer.  See the difference?

Thank you for your comments.

But 1 John 3:15 isn't the only passage where I drew my conclusions.

I also stated Revelation 21:9 and Galatians 5:19-21, both of which deal with the deed of murder and, in my opinion, fits also with the 1 John 3:15 passage as well. After all, if a murderer will not inherit the Kingdom of God, then it fits that they don't have eternal life abiding in them, correct? And speaking of the heart, didn't Jesus say that out of the heart proceeds evil things like murder that make a man unclean (Matthew 15:19)? Thought preceeds action. It begins in the heart and then it is carried out. If a person has hatred in their heart for themselves, they are in trouble already because the potential of committing the act has taken root. But if they take that hatred to the next level and murder themselves, then they are in danger of Hell fire, not Heaven. As I stated before on another topic, to take a human life, even your own life, is to attack the very image of God Himself (because man was made in the image of God), an attack that God does NOT take lightly, according to the Scriptures.

Therefore, I cannot accept the view that a Christian who commits the act of murder on themselves (suicide) will inherit the kingdom of God. I hear and understand what you're trying to say and I truly appreciate what you're saying but I've got to stick with the Word here. I know people want to believe that a Christian who takes their life will be in Heaven but, based solely on the Word of God, I don't believe that.

Thanks for your comment, Nebula.

[eric]

Have to agree with you Cats. My mother took her own life forty years ago when I was jusy forty. Coroners report, Took her own life while the state of her mind was unbalanced owing to severe depression. There is no way anyone can convince that my mother will lose her relationship with God because she became desperately depressed.

I mean what sort of God do some people think we are serving here huh? you lose your mind and God doesn't want to know? Give me a break.

[Snowdoove]

OK, what am I thinking?

[Snowdoove]

The greatest strength is gentleness - An Iroquois saying.

Snowdoove

[SisterT-Enduring2TheEnd]

I have heard of this idea that is taught by some preachers, if you are a person who suffers from depression, it is because you can't deal with life.

I disagree with this teaching.

I don't believe I said anything remotely like that in my comments so I'm at a loss at where your comments come from. The question of the topic was If a Christian commits suicide, will they go to Heaven (or something to that effect). My opinion, based on Scripture, is NO. When opinions are solicited, such as the nature of these boards, I may give mine. That's what I did here. As you can see, I'm not concerned if no one agrees with me. I'm just expressing my opinion. Folks just need to remember that not everyone will have the same opinion on certain topics.

Thank you.

[Snowdoove]

I have heard of this idea that is taught by some preachers, if you are a person who suffers from depression, it is because you can't deal with life.

I disagree with this teaching.

I don't believe I said anything remotely like that in my comments so I'm at a loss at where your comments come from. The question of the topic was If a Christian commits suicide, will they go to Heaven (or something to that effect). My opinion, based on Scripture, is NO. When opinions are solicited, such as the nature of these boards, I may give mine. That's what I did here. As you can see, I'm not concerned if no one agrees with me. I'm just expressing my opinion. Folks just need to remember that not everyone will have the same opinion on certain topics.

Thank you.

I edited my message...Snowdoove

[Rick]

I too had a family member commit suicide. And like many others here, I too wondered about his soul. He too had professed faith in Christ.

I was brought to remember about Samson, who had his strength from God. After it was taken from him, he had asked God to restore it. Which He did. In bringing down the columns he also brought down many ungodly men. But it was at the cost of his own life. Which he well knew beforehand. And which God knew as well, but yet still gave him the strength to accomplish it.

I am also mindful that Jesus Himself, came into this world, knowing beforehand what fate awaited Him. Yet entered into it knowing that it would ultimately lead to His own death. If a man does something that leads to his own death, irregardless of whatever reason he has for doing it. It is considered suicide in the eyes of man. Self death. Yet Jesus said they did not take His life, He laid it down. Because of that, it could be argued that they were responsible for His death, not Himself, and it was a righteous death. Which it was! But He came to give His life a ransom for many. He knew beforehand what would bring His death, and entered into it. And I thank God that He did!

Each of us commit suicide every day of our life. Whether through a sin of commission or a sin of omission, For God said that the wages of sin are death, and we all sin. Leading to our own death. Is there a sin unto death for each of us?

Did the early christians commit suicide because they professed the gospel to a world that they knew beforehand would take their life for doing it? Do christians today still die from doing something they know will lead to their death?, it happens everyday. Is there anyone who dies from anything other than sin? No, we all die from the same cause, sin. Even Jesus Himself died because of sin. Not His own, but because the sin of the world had been placed upon Him. The saved, and the unsaved alike die, the just and the unjust. Its just that many different means are used in order to accomplish it. We can add to our days, or we can take away from them, But we all die, Whether it be from sickness, injury, old age, or self inflicted.

Im not going to attempt to say what fate, someone has met, who has taken their own life, and would dissuade anyone that I could, from doing so, but only want to present something to think about. For only God knows the human heart and whether someone is His or not.

Rick

[angels4u]

Eric,

I believe your Mom is in heaven and I agree very much with your statement:

I mean what sort of God do some people think we are serving here huh? you lose your mind and God doesn't want to know? Give me a break.