What is happening?

[Jayne]

5 minutes ago, artsylady said:

Truth:  In the garden, people were told to eat plants.  Much later, Daniel, the prophet, as well as Shadrach, Meshack and Abendnego all thrived on a plant based diet.  You can look these up if you want to.  
 

I guess what you did not look up was the scripture I gave you that said when God told Noah and his family to eat meat that the Bible says, "God blessed them and said...."

This doesn't mean you HAVE to eat meat, but it means that God blessed the eating of meat.  

Also, I talked to you about Daniel, et. al., and the possible reasons why they abstain from meat.  I thought of three reasons off the top of my head that has nothing to do with it being meat:  [1] perhaps it was sacrificed to idols, [2] perhaps it was meat forbidden by God like pigs or rabbit, or [3] perhaps it was too "rich" as the Bible describes it, too much fat left, gravy etc.  

As I said before.....be a vegan or don't be a vegan.  Just don't use the Bible to claim it.  It isn't there.

[artsylady]

11 hours ago, 1sheep said:

Your point of view is not necessarily " christian" because God has given us animals and fish and foul to eat. Scripture given on this subject was totally ignored. 

But it does sound better for you to preface your vegan point if view with "christian".

It is also not wise to assume those who veheimently dissagree with you need to get better informed. You come off as haughty and judgy on a topic that is not christian at all but you insist that this is a moral issue  . Vegans tend to be anthropomorphic which is where all the misplaced emotion comes from! Cows and pigs are for human comsumption and have been since the fall! God knew animals would be dealt with differently in the future when he wrote OT and NT scripture! His word never returns void. It is still okay to eat meat regardless your misplaced emotionally driven retoric that argues with GODS WORDS!

Your decision was based on EMOTION and NOT SCRIPTURE. I read what you wrote. Emotion drove you to became vegan despite what scripture dictates.

Since you claim to be correctable; perhaps from this day forward you wont try to push your emotionally driven lifestyle on others . It is also advisable that veiled  labelling of  others as uninformed, uncompassionate, hearts waxed cold etc cease. 

 

 

I can tell you are uninformed on the issues due to the arguments you try to present.  If you were informed, you wouldn't present them.  

It was compassion and new information that changed my stance.  Getting informed on something that I wasn't really comfortable getting informed on.  However, God takes us out of our comfort zones at times to stretch us, make us grow.   I hope you can relate.  

There ARE scriptural references to support my view and I've stated them enough times.  I don't know how you keep missing them, over and over.    At least you realize it was not until AFTER the FALL that meat of animals became permissable- (not adviseable)

[artsylady]

Also my viewpoint is Christian because 1) I AM a Christian and 2) there are certainly Biblical references to support it as the IDEAL, not just something allowable.

Anyway, since it's allowable, it's also 'debatable'.  I just wish people would stop judging ME because I am trying to see if there are like minded Christians HERE or those who could be open their minds to the possibility.   

As a personal testimony, since I stopped eating animals, I have found that I am kinder, and gentler and more at peace.  I actually find animals come up to me in homes where the owners are surprised as the cat or dog is usually evasive.  The animal really wants to be around me.  And THAT is a very effective testimony to the owner of the animal.  I could blab all day long about this or that, but when they see something like this, every word I say becomes more credible to them, as they see their pet trusts me.

  As I am with my Christianity, I am not preachy about what I eat and my food choices.  I am quietly confident and gracious. I understand that not everyone has had the same info as I have had.  We were at a dinner last night at a theatre production dinner theatre where I had just met a lot of people - a family style meal where bowls were put on the table.   I didn't go on talking about my food choices.  I just put potatoes, veggies, and a roll on my plate.  I know people saw this.  They didn't ask, I didn't say anything.  It's leading by example and not coming across as 'holier than thou'. 

I do 'get it' if you don't want to change or rethink anything.  However, why try to destroy and manipulate my point of view, claiming it is unchristian etc?  

[Guest 1sheep]

10 minutes ago, artsylady said:

Truth:  In the garden, people were told to eat plants.  Much later, Daniel, the prophet, as well as Shadrach, Meshack and Abendnego all thrived on a plant based diet.  You can look these up if you want to.  
What's the verse in the Bible "Everything is permissible, not everything is adviseable"?  Maybe it applies here.  See, Bible verses, Bible references apply to my way of thinking. It's a debatable matter.  If you don't wish to see it, change your thinking or learn something new, I have not come back here to talk to you or anyone like you.   Of course, I knew there would be many like you.  It's the same in the secular world.  

It's those who wish to rethink, change, grow, or at  least look at things from a different viewpoint, that I would like to speak to.

I briefly saw someone ask why make things that taste and resemble meat, but are not meat?  I am glad you asked that.   I don't wish any being to be raised in an abusive way, all of their lives to face a slaughter house where they scream in fear, have their throats slashed and blood spilt so that I can 'enjoy' my meat, 3 times a day.  I didn't adopt a plant based diet because I didn't enjoy meat.  I adopted it because it was gentler, kinder and no sentient being is hurt.    However, after a certain amount of time of abstaining, I also could not ever 'enjoy' eating animal flesh. 

Truth: You can try to twist scripture to fit your anthropomorphizing the emotions of animals but in the real world it just doesnt work. 

You only think you are being kinder now  because you liken the cows emotions to a humans! You dont eat the m although God told us we are free to do so. Dont yoy think God knew the animal raisibg conditions today when he wr o te the OT and NT?  God wrote it anyways didnt he? Somehow your opinions usurp Gods. Why cant you see how deceived you are? 

Genesis 9 sums it all up. You are arguing with God and his words . Im just the messenger! 

You claim to be more compassionate( other thread) but I dont see your pushing your vegan lifestyle in our faces as compassionate or loving. You have already been told several times to stop assuming we are uninformed when we dissagree with you. We just don't care to hear about your perceived moral epiphany! Your change came born out of misplaced feelings. Period. You are reaped in emotionalism! 

Changing your mind about food didnt make you "grow" spiritually. Your words are not going to make anyone else grow either! Vegan lifestyle isnt making you a better person than others who eat differently. 

Eat your grass and be happy. Ill stick with my chicken and turkey and cows! Dobt assume I am missing anything because I disagree with you. I am not unlearned or ignorant because I dissagree. I am level headed . I base my opinions on what God has stated.  I dont liken a cows disposition to that of a frightened human which is what you do. Anthropomorphic reasoning is not being level headed.

 

 

 

[artsylady]

19 minutes ago, Jayne said:

I guess what you did not look up was the scripture I gave you that said when God told Noah and his family to eat meat that the Bible says, "God blessed them and said...."

This doesn't mean you HAVE to eat meat, but it means that God blessed the eating of meat.  

Also, I talked to you about Daniel, et. al., and the possible reasons why they abstain from meat.  I thought of three reasons off the top of my head that has nothing to do with it being meat:  [1] perhaps it was sacrificed to idols, [2] perhaps it was meat forbidden by God like pigs or rabbit, or [3] perhaps it was too "rich" as the Bible describes it, too much fat left, gravy etc.  

As I said before.....be a vegan or don't be a vegan.  Just don't use the Bible to claim it.  It isn't there.

What verse in Genesis pertaining to Noah and the new laws says God 'blessed' eating animals?  I just read it and did not see it.  

"Perhaps, perhaps, perhaps"....     

You are clearly making assumptions.

What is clear, however, and in scripture is that their health was better when they did NOT eat animals.  

I WILL use the Bible.  It's right there - clear and concise - no 'perhaps' necessary.

[artsylady]

5 minutes ago, 1sheep said:

Truth: You can try to twist scripture to fit your anthropomorphizing the emotions of animals but in the real world it just doesnt work. 

You only think you are being kinder now  because you liken the cows emotions to a humans! You dont eat the m although God told us we are free to do so. Dont yoy think God knew the animal raisibg conditions today when he wr o te the OT and NT?  God wrote it anyways didnt he? Somehow your opinions usurp Gods. Why cant you see how deceived you are? 

Genesis 9 sums it all up. You are arguing with God and his words . Im just the messenger! 

You claim to be more compassionate( other thread) but I dont see your pushing your vegan lifestyle in our faces as compassionate or loving. You have already been told several times to stop assuming we are uninformed when we dissagree with you. We just don't care to hear about your perceived moral epiphany! Your change came born out of misplaced feelings. Period. You are reaped in emotionalism! 

Changing your mind about food didnt make you "grow" spiritually. Your words are not going to make anyone else grow either! Vegan lifestyle isnt making you a better person than others who eat differently. 

Eat your grass and be happy. Ill stick with my chicken and turkey and cows! Dobt assume I am missing anything because I disagree with you. I am not unlearned or ignorant because I dissagree. I am level headed . I base my opinions on what God has stated.  I dont liken a cows disposition to that of a frightened human which is what you do. Anthropomorphic reasoning is not being level headed.

 

 

 

I have said over and over that I know people like you won't change and that I am not really here to talk to you anyway.

 

So why do you keep commenting?   DO you feel the need to defend your belief that you want to eat animals?   Why?

[Jayne]

I'm an animal lover, too.  Since before I went to kindergarten.  My grandparents always remarked that I had the animal "touch".  I'm 57 now and I do all I can to  care for feral cats around my home.  I feed them, provide shelter, take them to get spayed and neutered.  I give to animals shelters to have them spayed and neutered.

But I still eat hamburgers and chicken and eggs and fish.  My dietary preferences has nothing to do with my affection towards animals or their affinity towards me all of my life.

[artsylady]

1 minute ago, Jayne said:

I'm an animal lover, too.  Since before I went to kindergarten.  My grandparents always remarked that I had the animal "touch".  I'm 57 now and I do all I can to  care for feral cats around my home.  I feed them, provide shelter, take them to get spayed and neutered.  I give to animals shelters to have them spayed and neutered.

But I still eat hamburgers and chicken and eggs and fish.  My dietary preferences has nothing to do with my affection towards animals or their affinity towards me all of my life.

If you were in China, would you eat a cat?

[Guest 1sheep]

37 minutes ago, artsylady said:

For what?   You think I don't know about meat references in the Bible?  I do.  I also know things have changed since Jesus day.  I also know "GOD owns the cattle on a thousand hills"

It's the modern day treatment of God's creatures, like the cows that aren't actually on hills anymore.   That is what I'm talking about. I'm sorry you keep missing my point.   Is it because you want to?

I don't have a lot of time to come here to have people misrepresent what I say and judge me and jump to incorrect conclusions and misquote me. 

 

Surely to God, there are people reading these threads who can see what's happening and how things are being manipulated.  Are you sure you really want to keep commenting here about this, the way you have been?

I keep telling you Im not missing your point! I hear you. I understa n d your unreasonable emotionalism. 

There you go again saying things have changed since Jesus day. So what! Last I checked God is all knowing. He hasnt changed his mind from when he wrote Genesis 9 has he? Didnt God know exactly what is going on now 6000 yrs ago or 2000 yrs ago? That would be a resounding YES! 

ANTHROPOMORHIC behavior is denying what God gave us for our nourishment and pleasure. I choose Gods words. I choose to eat juicy delicious meat.G o d is my judge. Your words are like a clanging gong because your words deny Gods words.

Have some  steak ...

[artsylady]

Just now, 1sheep said:

I keep telling you Im not missing your point! I hear you. I understa n d your unreasonable emotionalism. 

There you go again saying things have changed since Jesus day. So what! Last I checked God is all knowing. He hasnt changed his mind from when he wrote Genesis 9 has he? Didnt God know exactly what is going on now 6000 yrs ago or 2000 yrs ago? That would be a resounding YES! 

ANTHROPOMORHIC behavior is denying what God gave us for our nourishment and pleasure. I choose Gods words. I choose to eat juicy delicious meat.G o d is my judge. Your words are like a clanging gong because your words deny Gods words.

Have some  steak ...

I am not judging you.  Are you judging me?   Why won't you allow me to have my opinion on this matter? 

 

You should be able to see that in the Garden, when things were perfect, humans were eating plants and seeds.  Do you understand that?  Let's start there.