Bush's 3 little words, 1 big betrayal

[Trust & Obey]

My loyalty is to Israel first.

I hope, for Bush's sake and the sake of America, that he did not know what he was talking about.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I hope you live there then.

[Trust & Obey]

Hal Lindsey appears regularly on TBN with Jan and Paul.

Dan

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And your point is?

[Trust & Obey]

Perhaps Bush did the right thing for once, if he's forcing Israel to adhere to a treaty.  The violence in Israel and Palestine is just as much Israel's fault as it is Palestine's.  The Palestinians may be blowing themselves up to kill Israelis as well, but Israelis are the only ones with tanks.  The Israeli army has a superior military to ANY military on earth.  They can prepare for battle faster than even OUR military.  There's no reason for them to still be having this conflict.  Personally, I think our president has done some incredibly stupid things already such as invading a country that hasn't done anything to us, making sure that I don't have social security when I'm older (though I have to pay into it now, I probably won't see it come back to me when I retire), etc.  I haven't agreed with but a very select few things that he's done and to be honest with you, I couldn't even recall them offhand.  At least Clinton didn't help to destroy our military.  Israel should fend for itself, as should Palestine.  We shouldn't intervene, and neither should any other nation.  If other nations threw in their military support with either side... and it was clear that they were lending military support i.e. they sent in their own batallions of soldiers into the country to fight palestine or israel, THEN we should intervene.  But it's not really our business.  Never has been, and I'm sorry, but the USA is not the savior of the world.  We can't be.  *shrug*  Getting a bit off topic there for a bit, but I think ya get me drift.  I don't see how we can blame one country without blaming the other, but perhaps that's just me...  and millions of other people with common sense. 

???

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Fluffy, don't forget that Israel gained the land and expanded their border in defense after being attacked by literally all of her neighbors.

Go take the treaty talk to the Arabs. They're the ones who violate every condition, promise, and cease-fire ever entered in to.

[dgolvach]

And your point is?

Hal Lindsey has written some interesting things. He has a view about end-times and Israel that are his right to have an express. It dosen't mean he is correct. Many people who are well known enough to command a certain amount of TV audience have views that they express. It dosen't mean much.

Frankly I just need to just cool off for a bit before I return to this subject. I'm so mad, I can't post in a way that is suitable for this board. That would be wrong and 2 wrongs don't make a ...well you know the rest.

God Bless America and you

Dan

[apothanein kerdos]

Fluffy....save yourself the trouble. You've already lost this debate...for good reason...you're wrong. Shiloh could argue your case better than you could and destroy it after setting it up.

[Gerioke]

Poor President Bush. I wish I could hug the guy. He gets it from the left for being too pro-Israel and now the right for not being pro-Israel enough. Even though I may not agree with him on everything I still see him as a brother and a patriot. The best friend (nation- wise) Israel has ever had has been the U.S.. Its not an easy task to try to bring peace to that region but it is(appearently) part of

[Ahavah]

Conservative, Republican, Liberal, Demacrat...I voted for Yeshua on my ballat..so what does that make me? HAhaha

[Guest shiloh357]

Ok folks, everyone take a deep breath.

IThe 1949 Armistice Line has been the basis for all talks regarding peace all the way back to the Peanut Farmer and his complete sell-out of everyone involved at Camp David.  For the life of me, I do not see the big problem with his statement as an affirmation of that basis.

Anyone who think that Israel's position is completely correct, remember, the position is put forward by men.  It is absolutely impossible to have peace in the area if neither side will give anything, including lines on a map.

All of that said, if it ever comes down to a choice of the PLO or Israel, I will be there to fight with the Israelis, as will President Bush, I am certain of that.

That blow up was all about the same lines, if you look at the botton line of it.

I'm not saying that we need to go too far with the Palestinians, but I do believe there is nothing wrong with giving an inch to possibly saves miles of graves.

"Warriors hate war as they know first hand the horror of it."

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey Reb!!

Israel has always been on the giving end. Israel has agreed to give the Palestinians more than any other nation would give were they in the same predicament. The problem is that Israel has not given or is unwilling to give. Israel has given more than anyone when it comes to the Palestinians. The problem lies with the Arab nation and their stubborn refusal to recognize Israel's right to exist and live in peace alongside Israel.

[RGR]

I can't add more to the Israeli position better than what has already been done by Shiloh, but I'd like to a thought of my own.

Why do you think we were sneak attacked on 9/11? Our support of Israel. Does that not tell you what these Islamanuts are and what they stand for? They have to resort to sneak attacks to do their dirty work. If martyrdom is so great, why doesn't Bin Laden try it instead of risking dying of old age?

[Guest shiloh357]

But if you really look at the lines in question, Israel will still have a net gain through the prism of history, won't they?

Perhaps, but in the light of what Israel has done, it is the Arabs who are unwilling I think, to honor the armistice lines.

I think what needs to be pointed out here, is that we are not dealing with two entities working for the same thing.

Israel desires genuine peace as we see peace; namely, bilateral goodwill and mutually prosperous relationships between nations. The Arab governments see the political process (under which the armistice falls) as a means to achieve their ultimate goal, Israel's destruction. Politics is a tool to the Arabs. It is the only weapon they have, seeing that they cannot outmatch Israel on the field of battle. Politics is a means of buying time. They whine and moan about the armistice lines, and other issues such as settlements, right of return, etc. It is all a smokescreen.

If we were dealing with two governments that operated from the same moral code and a similar respect for human rights and the political process, that would be one thing. What we have is ONE government operating from a sincere desire for peace, and 22 despotic maniacal regimes bent upon Israel's destruction at any cost. I don't think Israel should be asked to give any more. They have given and given and given and all they have received in the past is bloodshed. Any "net gain" Israel has, was bought and payed for the blood of Israeli soldiers and the innocent souls viciously and brutally mowed down by terrorists for the "sin" of being born Jewish, and being born in Israel. No other nation would make a peace treaty with such an enemy.

It is time for the Arabs to show good faith. It is time for THEM to give.