Torah in the New Testament: part 1, Acts Meeting

[Yishai]

27 minutes ago, appy said:

or they are condoning sin; or even sinning... your NOT God.  I like most here have NEVER told anyone to sin or that it is even ok.  You just accused me of something I did not do and do not do!!

"dont matter if you dont mean it that way, it is still a fact thats what it means when anyone says the Law is done away with or that we should not keep it. "

im telling you what The Word describes as sin, I put zero words in your mouth, only gave you the real understanding of the words you speak.  Ive never once said anyone here was un saved, yet two people have accused me of this now, thats literally putting words in a person's mouth...I also have never once spread the false teaching of Saved by Torah, nor the False teaching of it is abolished. 

[Yishai]

1 hour ago, Alive said:

You really should stop this. It is not good for you. @Yishai

I have prayed for you and have prayed that God will stop you. This is no small thing. Do not play this way.

Gal. 1:6   I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, ⁷ which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. ⁸ But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. ⁹ As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

Gal. 3:1 O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified? ² This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? ³ Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? ⁴ Have you suffered so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain?

Gal. 3:5   Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— ⁶ just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” ⁷ Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. ⁸ And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” ⁹ So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.

Gal. 3:10   For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.” ¹¹ But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.” ¹² Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”

Gal. 3:13   Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”), ¹⁴ that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through 

Noah found grace in the eyes of YHWH, Abraham was counted righteous thru faith, these two things has always been what saves us, its always been a false teaching that we are saved by works of the Law, if you look to the works to save you you have fallen from grace. Were supposed to Keep His Laws bc He saved us, not in order to be saved. "For I am YHWH your Elohim who brought you out of the land of Egypt" saved us from slavery, not one verse says keep my commandments to Be saved. This was a false rabbinical teaching of people "under Torah" they belived they was justified from its deeds instead of Faith and Grace. Its very simple, if I was talking to a person about Messiah, and they believed and had Faith I would then hand them the New Testament and say this is your Salvation, Then I would hand them The Torah and say this is your instructions and Law as a new citizen(salvation is the citzenship) then hand the remainder of the Tanach(OT) and say these are the Prophecys. 

[Alive]

13 minutes ago, Yishai said:

Noah found grace in the eyes of YHWH, Abraham was counted righteous thru faith, these two things has always been what saves us, its always been a false teaching that we are saved by works of the Law, if you look to the works to save you you have fallen from grace. Were supposed to Keep His Laws bc He saved us, not in order to be saved. "For I am YHWH your Elohim who brought you out of the land of Egypt" saved us from slavery, not one verse says keep my commandments to Be saved. This was a false rabbinical teaching of people "under Torah" they belived they was justified from its deeds instead of Faith and Grace. Its very simple, if I was talking to a person about Messiah, and they believed and had Faith I would then hand them the New Testament and say this is your Salvation, Then I would hand them The Torah and say this is your instructions and Law as a new citizen(salvation is the citzenship) then hand the remainder of the Tanach(OT) and say these are the Prophecys. 

Then you would be doing them a great disservice. Have you ever been used of the Lord to preach the gospel and lead a person to Christ and then have the responsibility to disciple that one?

What a convert needs is to be taught the Cross of Christ, the Blood and the indwelling Holy Spirit as the Teacher and 'Paraclete'. They need to be shown that the new Life within them is real and to anticipate 'hearing' the promptings of the Spirit within.

You are playing and I suspect have no idea of the implications of what you are trying to teach. For your sake, I hope that you don't understand. Whatever your goal here is--you are causing damage to the 'little ones'--this is not good for you.

This is not a game and this is not a playing field.

[Yishai]

26 minutes ago, Alive said:

Then you would be doing them a great disservice. Have you ever been used of the Lord to preach the gospel and lead a person to Christ and then have the responsibility to disciple that one?

What a convert needs is to be taught the Cross of Christ, the Blood and the indwelling Holy Spirit as the Teacher and 'Paraclete'. They need to be shown that the new Life within them is real and to anticipate 'hearing' the promptings of the Spirit within.

You are playing and I suspect have no idea of the implications of what you are trying to teach. For your sake, I hope that you don't understand. Whatever your goal here is--you are causing damage to the 'little ones'--this is not good for you.

This is not a game and this is not a playing field.

Teaching what John taught the knowledge of sin 1st john 3:4 "everyone practising sin also practises lawlesness, and sin is the breaking of Torah"

 teaching what the Messiah Taught in Mathew 5:17-19  "Do not think that I Have come to loosen Torah or the prophets, I have not come to loosen but to fulfill. 18. For truly I say to you that not one Yodh orStroke will pass from Torah until everything happens. 19. All who loosen therefore from one of these small commandments and teach thus to the sons of man, will be called little in the Kingdom of Heaven, but all who do and teach this will be called great in The Kingdom of Heaven"

 teaching what Paul taught Romans 7:12 "So indeed Torah is Holy and The commandment Holy and Just and Good"
 along with countless other pro Torah verses from Paul im doing a study on, what is bad is believing we are saved by the deeds of Torah aka under Torah, but if I kill a animal while hunting OF COURSE i SHOULD drain its blood and cover it with dirt as The Father Commanded in Torah.

Ive also shown in original post the undeniable conclusion of the meeting in acts 15:21-22. 

No harm is in My words what so ever. 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Yishai

[Alive]

6 minutes ago, Yishai said:

Teaching what John taught the knowledge of sin 1st john 3:4 "everyone practising sin also practises lawlesness, and sin is the breaking of Torah"

 teaching what the Messiah Taught in Mathew 5:17-19  "Do not think that I Have come to loosen Torah or the prophets, I have not come to loosen but to fulfill. 18. For truly I say to you that not one Yodh orStroke will pass from Torah until everything happens. 19. All who loosen therefore from one of these small commandments and teach thus to the sons of man, will be called little in the Kingdom of Heaven, but all who do and teach this will be called great in The Kingdom of Heaven"

 teaching what Paul taught Romans 7:12 "So indeed Torah is Holy and The commandment Holy and Just and Good"
 along with countless other pro Torah verses from Paul im doing a study on, what is bad is believing we are saved by the deeds of Torah aka under Torah, but if I kill a animal while hunting OF COURSE i SHOULD drain its blood and cover it with dirt as The Father Commanded in Torah.

Ive also shown in original post the undeniable conclusion of the meeting in acts 15:21-22. 

No harm is in My words what so ever. 

Rom 7.12--plucking one verse from an entire discourse. Folks--please read on from there and on to the entire teaching of the next chapter. The balance of Romans 7 and all of the 8th chapter.

[Yishai]

3 minutes ago, Alive said:

Rom 7.12--plucking one verse from an entire discourse. Folks--please read on from there and on to the entire teaching of the next chapter. The balance of Romans 7 and all of the 8th chapter.

Ive got 12 verses plus from Romans alone wrote down to support what i was shown. His teaching is aginst the mindset that we are saved by deeds, He would never go against Gods Commandments or the Messiah. Read to support not to contradict. Any contradiction is false.

Edited February 5, 2020 by Yishai

[Alive]

For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

[Yishai]

19 minutes ago, Alive said:

For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

Amen! Great verse supporting what I was shown as well, He is The King Of Confirmation . Idk if I have this wrote down yet either. I LOVE it. Thanks.

This in no way contradicts anything I have said one time, Paul taught against the mindset of saved by deeds, that everyone has Always been saved by faith n grace, and that in no way does he speak against the keeping of Gods commands that was prepared beforehand. NO1 would ever tell you to not be obedient to the Holy commands. YHWH saves thu Faith in His son. Ive never once said anybody is saved by deeds(Torah). 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Yishai

[Yishai]

9 minutes ago, maryjayne said:

So what have you had revealed to you about why we need to keep Torah and what purpose it serves?

Torah does not give salvation. Torah does not keep us saved. So what does it do?

Awesome question Mary! Torah is a corrector of False Doctrine(ender of denominations and confusion) Y'shua showed us the two most important Commandments of All Torah, 1. Love YHWH with all your Heart, Soul, and Mind/might, Deaut,6:4.(If we Love Him with everything, we will also Love His Son, His Santuary, His Laws and Commands) And 2. To love your Neighbor as your self, this command fulfills all of the Moral Law in Torah. Leviticus 19:18...

And it is important for everyone to know what is sin and whats not, as we should learned this aloong time ago. John taught the knowledge of sin 1st john 3:4 "everyone practising sin also practises lawlesness, and sin is the breaking of Torah" 

 

[George]

@Yishai Interesting discussion ... 

Everyone take a step back and let's not make accusations and assume what the other is thinking.  I think there are a lot of assumptions going on.

As far as the Torah, as Yeshua summed up the Torah in these commandments ...

Mat 22:37  And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 
Mat 22:38  This is the great and first commandment. 
Mat 22:39  And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 
Mat 22:40  On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.” 

LOVE is the essence of the entire Bible.  

Rom 13:8  Owe no one anything, except to love each other, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law. 
Rom 13:9  For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not covet,” and any other commandment, are summed up in this word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 
Rom 13:10  Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law. 

In all of these discussions, let's not forget what truly separates believers from the world -- LOVE!

When looking at the Torah from the perspective of God's love toward us ... instead of how we love God through the law ... but rather how God loves us, and we love our neighbor in understanding the Torah will go a great bit farther in your understanding of the OT.

Oftentimes, those who are "torah" teachers are legalists and haven't comprehended the real purpose of the Torah ... however, if you look at it from the perspective of how God loves us, and how we love our neighbor ... we will truly understand the LOVE and GRACE in the Torah.

When God describes Himself ... think about this ...

Exo 34:6  The LORD passed before him and proclaimed, “The LORD, the LORD, a God merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in steadfast love and faithfulness, 
Exo 34:7  keeping steadfast love for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, but who will by no means clear the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children and the children's children, to the third and the fourth generation.” 

Whereby people who understand that God is merciful, gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness ... realize this as the main understanding of who God is.

But this does not negate that fact that God is a God of justice.

We're all called to love one another ... let's do so ... for we can have disagreements in love ... in doing so, maybe we'll learn a thing or two,

God bless,

George