We are still not getting it...... yet.

[kwikphilly]

23 hours ago, enoob57 said:

I do not look to myself to see perfection I look to the Scriptures and The Holy Spirit that teaches them to me >and< all point me to Jesus
Heb 12:2-9

2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

I really like that Brother.....I'm with you,all that I have,all that I do,all that I am....all points met to Jesus

                                                                          Love your Sis   CHOCO

[Gideon]

3 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

" God's promises are yea and amen. The problem lies in our unbelief, pure and simple. "  Amen.

 

"If you abide in my word then are you my disciples indeed; and you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free.

They said unto Jesus; we are Abraham's descendants and have not been the slaves of any man, how say you that we shall be made free?

And Jesus said; Verily verily I say unto you, Whosoever practices sin is the slave of sin. 

 And the slave abides not in the house forever; but the Son abides forever.

If the Son shall make you free, you shall be free indeed" John 8:31-36

 

"For if the Spirit of Him that raised up Christ from the dead dwells in you, He that raised up Christ from the dead shall also give life to your mortal bodies,

by His Spirit that is in you. Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.

For if you live after the flesh you shall die, but if you through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the flesh you shall live."

What kind of life and death is Paul talking about?

"For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God." Romans 8:13-14.

 

"For there has no temptation take you but such as is common to man, but God is faithful who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able,

but will, with the temptation also make a way out that you may be able to escape" 1 Corinthians 10:13.

 

"Therefore leaving the elementary discussion of the doctrine of Christ, let us move on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works,

and of faith towards God. Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgement,

these we will do, if God permit." Hebrews 6:1-3.

 

"Hereby we do know that we know Christ, if we keep His commands [Luke 6:27-49]

 He that says 'I know Him' and keeps not His commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him." 1 John 2:3-4

 

His commands are all about sincere love; sincerely loving everyone, and responding in loving ways; Matthew 5 through 7, Luke 6:27-49.

Therefore:

"He that loves not, knows not God; for God is love" 1 John 4:8

"Whosoever transgresses (disobeys the Torah 1 John 3:4) and abides not in the doctrine of Christ [Matthew 7:28] has not God,

whoever abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son." 2 John 1:9-10.

 

 

We begin with a belief, a belief that Christ died and rose from the dead. Romans 10:9

That belief motivates us to follow Christ; Romans 10:10,17; and to believe and hold dear the words Christ spoke; Matthew 7:21-28, John 14:21-23, 2 Corinthians 5:15.

That belief is empowered by the Holy Spirit of God who guides us towards godliness and holiness. Acts 2:38, Romans 8:8-14, Galatians 5:14-24.

Therefore "with the heart man believes unto righteousness" Romans 10:10

"we are Gods creation created in Christ Jesus for good works" Ephesians 2:10

"they that are Christs have crucified the flesh with its passions and lusts" Galatians 5:24.

 

Thank you for a plain presentation of what God has promised to do for us.... in us. May ears be opened to your words. 

blessings,

Gideon

 

[Heleadethme]

11 hours ago, kwikphilly said:

Blessings

   Good,great-Praise Jesus! Now I might need to read what the OP was saying from the beginning,I did not... and I do agree with the rest of what you said as well....

So,I'll brb.......Okay,I read most of it and already I can see the point what others are trying to convey

Im not sure about you but I get a very mixed message here,unless he is simply not saying in a way that could be well understood?All is WELL,I am not trying to be Saved or rescued by clinging to the Scriptures,is anyone here? We don not need to awaken into Righteousness nor are we brought into Righteousness as anything.We ARE the Righteousness of God in Christ by the Blood of Jesus,whether we remain carnal minded or not we are made Righteous by the Grace of God,God Sees us  Covered by the Blood,He Sees Jesus! We arre Holy,Blameless,Worthy,Spotless,without stain,wrinkle or blemish in the Eyes of God!

  Now,if Gideon is speaking to the unbeliever,he's almost right,if not then he is undoubtedly sincere but sincerely wrong.....Jesus is not"doing it",it WAS DONE 2000+yrs ago                         With love -in Christ,Kwik

Bless you sister...I’ll try to share how the Lord has been showing me these things….not saying this is perfect, and please test it, but this is the understanding I have received of these scriptures, and you'll see why I believe the OP is consistent with the truth.  It is true that the righteousness of Christ has been imputed to us……..and we were each given a deposit of grace that cost us nothing in the beginning ( some receive more, some less)……many sins fell off us at the point of salvation or very quickly after.  But we are not perfect yet……what we received in the beginning of our walk was only the down payment as a guarantee that the good work Jesus began in us He is able also to complete/perfect it.  We are called to grow and increase….in faith, in good works, in fruits, in righteousness and in knowledge of God.

The parable of the talents in Matthew 25 follows on from the parable of the ten virgins and is speaking basically along the same lines.  Both parables carry promise as well as serious warning.  Whatever measure of faith and grace we were given in the beginning, we need to be gaining more.

Jesus also said that though we have had the bath and are clean, we still need to allow Him to wash our feet otherwise He warns that He will have no part with us.

Remember Paul rebuking some folks saying that though they should be teachers by now, they were still as babes needing milk and not ready for meat.  He had many more things to teach them that they couldn’t bear yet, even though they really should have been able to by then….they were not yet ready to digest meat because they weren’t weaned from the milk.  He spoke about leaving the foundational teachings (milk) and going on to perfection (requiring meat).

Isa 28:9  Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.

Gal 3:3  Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

There is no question that the need to grow and perfect our faith is all over the scriptures.

It is the wisdom  of God that we take the kingdom (land of promise) little by little……after coming to faith in Christ we still have work to do , a race to run, battles to fight:

Exo 23:29-30

I will not drive them out from before thee in one year; lest the land become desolate, and the beast of the field multiply against thee.

By little and little I will drive them out from before thee, until thou be increased, and inherit the land.

Deu 7:22

And the LORD thy God will put out those nations before thee by little and little: thou mayest not consume them at once, lest the beasts of the field increase upon thee.

Phl 3:12  Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

Even though the perfect righteousness of Christ is imputed to the believer, and we are given a measure of that grace in the beginning, we still have a journey, a race, a battle to apprehend and get hold of in our life on earth all the rest of what has been laid up in heaven for us.  (And I believe this is even the meaning of the prayer of Jesus that He taught those who were already believers to pray…..that God’s will would be done on earth as it is in heaven and that His kingdom would come.)

Heb 4:9-11

There remaineth therefore a rest (promised land of rest) to the people of God.

For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

And yes, we who believe have entered this rest, but it’s a kind of paradox, we have both entered it by faith (imputed) yet we also need to be endeavouring in real time to participate in the process of entering it and taking the land.….this is something like how the Lamb of God was slain from the foundation of the world, even though He wasn’t actually crucified in time until about 2,020 years ago.  

Edited March 30, 2020 by Heleadethme

[Blood Bought 1953]

On 3/28/2020 at 10:46 AM, Gideon said:

Brother, if God is not yet revealing to you what I have been asked to share, why bother yourself with this? God certainly is able to lead people to truth and lead them away from error, amen?  
 

It should be obvious, but far too often it is not, that that promises of God, practically speaking, are not doing what they have clearly promised to do for us snd IN us. We have been told that our shields of faith will quench ALL the fiery arrows of satan, and that we have been delivered from the power of darkness, not just forgiven for the sins we still find ourselves committing. But do we see these manifested in our walks? 

Where is the problem? Is our God a liar? Has He underestimated our fallen nature so that even when provided with a way of escape when we fall into temptations,  we continue to not take that promised way of escape? Really? 

God's promises are yea and amen. The problem lies in our unbelief, pure and simple. We can either accept our "humanness" and use it as an excuse for us to continue in our self ruling old nature. convincing ourselves that the purpose of grace is to bridge the gap between our best efforts (yeah, right)  and our continued failures,. OR we can admit we have limited the Holy One of Israel by our unbelief, confess it as sin for it is,  and well.... start believing.  And when we do, and we will,  we will finally see and experience the full power of the grace of God, and all the promises He has made to us will become our possession. 
 

We are all entering the valley of decision in these final days where we choose who will reign over us.... Us with our salvation tucked in our back pocket to be pulled out in emergencies only or God reigning in our fully yielded, fully believing hearts where we come into agreement with Him that we ARE new  creatures. 

There will be no middle ground here. Goats on the left. Sheep on the right. And God says "Choose."

blessings, 

Gids

 

. convincing ourselves that the purpose of grace is to bridge the gap between our best efforts(yeah, right)  and our continued failures

 

yet another false accusation by one  that does not understand Grace......still waiting for a simple “ cut and paste” from somebody somewhere that would prove somebody actually believes this clap- trap..... 

[kwikphilly]

7 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

Im not sure about you but I get a very mixed message here,unless he is simply not saying in a way that could be well understood?All is WELL,I am not trying to be Saved or rescued by clinging to the Scriptures,is anyone here? Kwik

Beloved Sister

    Thank you for your reply,it helps me to understand what you understand or have misunderstood.I speak to you in Love & never with disrespect,whether we agree or do not agree here is not a Salvational issue,that I could see but I do see a little  mis-application (& taking verses of Scripture out of context which will lead to lack of Understanding,which of course will hinder growth) Mixed message

  Let us begin here with what you said:

Quote

given a deposit of grace that cost us nothing in the beginning ( some receive more, some less)……many sins fell off us at the point of salvation or very quickly after.        Hedleadethme

We are not given a deposit of Gods Grace ,no one Receives more or less of Gods Saving Grace,it is by His Grace that we are Saved.....what has been deposited is Holy Spirit in which is the Guaranteed Seal of Redemption

Quote

Ephesians 1:13&14 “Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession – to the praise of his glory.”

Quote

cost us nothing in the beginning                  Heleadthme

We owe nothing,nothing is required of us in return for the Grace of God,it is His GIFT to us for having accepted  by Faith (& trust)in  Jesus...when we came to the foot of the cross we completely rely on Jesus-belief is the one requirement-the one thing that God accepted from us GRACIOUSLY.....His Grace does not expire

Quote

…many sins fell off us at the point of salvation or very quickly after.        Hedleadethme

All of our  sin was washed away by the Precious Blood of Jesus,past ,present & future sin-the moment we asked His Forgiveness at the foot of the cross--one drop of His Blood ids enough Blood ,Gods Grace is enough
 

Quote

 

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:

⁹ Not of works, lest any man should boast.       Ephesians 2;8-9

 

Before moving on and having a post as long as an epic saga I thought it would be a good idea to stop here to give you an opportunity to reply ,if you wish.....then if you like I would be happy to go further......

                                                                           With love in Christ,Your Sister Kwik

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Reflection]

On 3/29/2020 at 10:26 PM, Heleadethme said:

You are taking away many teachings of scripture....and there seems to be a penalty for that written on the last page of the bible.

The penalty is also applied to them that try to add things the scripture doesn't say

Rev 22:17

¶

And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

 

Rev 22:18

¶

For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book

 

On 3/29/2020 at 10:24 PM, Heleadethme said:

He also said to count the cost.....because after receiving Christ without cost to us, there are then things that WE need to begin buying, ie, pay the price to obtain....."buy the truth", and buy extra oil for our lamps (only the initial deposit was free).....remember the man who went and sold all he had in order to "buy" the field containing the treasure and pearl of great price.

You don't understand the things you are talking about here, you are mixing concepts and need to be more careful

Edited March 30, 2020 by Reflection

[Heleadethme]

2 hours ago, kwikphilly said:

Beloved Sister

    Thank you for your reply,it helps me to understand what you understand or have misunderstood.I speak to you in Love & never with disrespect,whether we agree or do not agree here is not a Salvational issue,that I could see but I do see a little  mis-application (& taking verses of Scripture out of context which will lead to lack of Understanding,which of course will hinder growth) Mixed message

  Let us begin here with what you said:

We are not given a deposit of Gods Grace ,no one Receives more or less of Gods Saving Grace,it is by His Grace that we are Saved.....what has been deposited is Holy Spirit in which is the Guaranteed Seal of Redemption

We owe nothing,nothing is required of us in return for the Grace of God,it is His GIFT to us for having accepted  by Faith (& trust)in  Jesus...when we came to the foot of the cross we completely rely on Jesus-belief is the one requirement-the one thing that God accepted from us GRACIOUSLY.....His Grace does not expire

All of our  sin was washed away by the Precious Blood of Jesus,past ,present & future sin-the moment we asked His Forgiveness at the foot of the cross--one drop of His Blood ids enough Blood ,Gods Grace is enough
 

Before moving on and having a post as long as an epic saga I thought it would be a good idea to stop here to give you an opportunity to reply ,if you wish.....then if you like I would be happy to go further......

                                                                           With love in Christ,Your Sister Kwik

 

 

 

 

 

 

In a nutshell, it seems that you are talking about salvation and I am talking about running the race after we have been saved.  I tried to explain how there is a kind of paradoxical element to these things.  The race is not won instantaneously at the moment we come to faith in Christ, because we have yet to run it.

Luk 14:33

So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.

Mat 16:24-25

Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

1Co 9:24-25

Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.

And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

2Ti 2:4-5

No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.

And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully.

 

 

[Heleadethme]

4 hours ago, Reflection said:

You don't understand the things you are talking about here, you are mixing concepts and need to be more careful

I'm just trying to point out that we have our part in working out our salvation....we have a cross to carry...a cost to count.  Not saying anything that isn't in the bible.  Remember Paul saying he was filling up that which was behind of the sufferings of Christ.  That might sound blasphemous to some....and yet there it is in scripture....and can only be perceived by the mind of Christ, not the carnal mind.  I don't know what you mean by mixing concepts..........I see only harmonious agreement with all these scriptures.

But before we go any further....do you believe the Lord still works miracles and speaks to His people today?

Edit:  forgot to mention this scripture:  

Pro 23:23

Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.

Edited March 30, 2020 by Heleadethme

[Gideon]

10 hours ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

. convincing ourselves that the purpose of grace is to bridge the gap between our best efforts(yeah, right)  and our continued failures

 

yet another false accusation by one  that does not understand Grace......still waiting for a simple “ cut and paste” from somebody somewhere that would prove somebody actually believes this clap- trap..... 

I am not trying to upset you, even though that seems to be the result. 

I have made a statement questioning about  our seeking to walk pleasing to God, as to whether or not we are actually giving it our best effort. 

Here is what God has spoken in the Word.

We are to present ourselves as living sacrifices, body, soul  and spirit, and God considers this "our reasonable service". 

We are to lay aside every weight and the sin that doth so easily beset us, and run the race set before us. 

We are to love not the world, nor the things in the world, setting our affections on things above. 

We are to run our race as if there were but one prize, and give all diligence to make our calling and election sure. 

So, is this what you see is being taught in our churches? 

Brother, I have thick skin, and take no offense but i believe any reasonable and honest view of how most Christians are walking is NOT even close to this. Do you disagree with this?

Paul hated.... HATED..... his sinful old nature, crying out to be delivered from  his constant failure. He did not say, well, that is whqt grace is for. He declared grace is our teacher as to HOW we walk as overcomers. He sought the Lord with all that was within him to be changed, freed, and grace .brought him to the place he was made victorious over the things that once bound him. 

There are those, praise God, who HATE their carnal nature and with their whole hearts they are pressing in for the rest that remains for the people of God. They will be rewarded. 

But half heartedness, using grace as our stopgap to assure us all is well, when the real desire of our heart is not to see sin totally cut out of our lives, that is far more prevalent today. However, until we can admit to it, we will remain earthbound. Saved, perhaps, but most certainly not safe. 

blessings to you,

Gids

 

[TheBlade]

Hay Gids.. pray you and your family are blessed. Question.. I saw this I believe from you here "There will be no middle ground here. Goats on the left. Sheep on the right. And God says "Choose.". Not to derail..

How do you see that playing out? From what I read and understand Jesus comes sets foot on the earth and gathers the nations that just came out of the great tribulation. When He says never knew you.. for me they were never saved. Unless you believe the Church goes through the great tribulation. Why say it if it does not apply to us. Thanks