Has anyone had to leave a worldly church?

[Sugarbaker]

Unfortunately, many churches are providing entertainment rather than spiritual development. 
 

When I was a child I remember going to vacation Bible school. The  highlight of the week writing part of our memory verse in macaroni letters glued to a popsicle stick to make a wall hanging. We had homemade cookies and Kool-Aid for snack. When my daughters went years ago there was a “Price is Right”  theme complete with a roulette wheel, microphone,  special lights and MC dressed in a tuxedo. The final day included a hotdog and hamburger barbecue for over 300 kids plus the parents. The fire department showed up in one of the giant trucks and then sprayed water while the kids ran through it. It was quite a production. The youth group was even more extreme. The interior of the building was completely covered in black and white tiles—- floors walls and ceilings. There was loud music, dark  rooms and neon lights. I feel like I was going into a bar.

 

Sermons are not much better; seems like about five minutes worth of scripture and actual teaching and the rest is personal stories on an unrelated topic.

 

That being said I do think a zombie night is very inappropriate for a church. And I’m not sure that Dr. Suess  is a great role model either considering that his first wife (whom he left for another woman) later committed suicide. Ha ha when I was in high school for church youth group had an overnight lock down—co-ed. I was walking out the door with some record albums to play and my mom went through them and read the titles of each song. She made me leave Barry Manilow at home because one of the songs was “why don’t we live together.” Poor Barry didn’t get to go to the church lock down but Mick Jagger made it. Really don’t know what that has to do with anything but it just came to mind, thought that I’d throw it in.
 

LonerAndy, You made mention of the fact that the kids who grew up in church no longer go there. I don’t think that is so uncommon or dependent on having a hip youth group. We have that promise “train up a child in the way that he should go and when he is old he will not depart from it. “  That doesn’t guarantee that they will be in church during their college or young adult years, but that they WILL come back. 
 

I realize that there is a lot of pressure to be relevant and to make church engaging and enticing, but we need to remember why we are really there. I remember as a teenager being incredibly bored during sermons in fact I’m not gonna lie there’s days that my mind wanders. A very wise woman once told me “even though you’re bored in church you were still giving that hour to God. “

 

 

[bornagain2011]

13 hours ago, DDisconnect said:

I'm not sure what to say on the matter of your church, but I will weigh in on one thing.

You wish to uphold your commitment for the anniversary party and that is good. So now it's a matter of trying to find churches. If you aren't aware of all the churches in your area, go to Google and type in "(city of residence), (state of residence) churches" or whatever the case is for whatever country you're from. Me personally, I made a written list so that I could put a rating and make small shorthand notes as I went through each one. You will see a list of churches on Google. Click on one and you'll see 4 circles from left to right - Call, Directions, Save, Website. You can click on Website and it should take you to that church's website. Each site is different, of course, but you can generally read a mission statement and watch previously livestreamed worship services. You can find info like who the staff is and what activities they do. Then if you have any questions, you can hit the back button to get back to Google and you've got that far left Call circle. When I did this, I made a rating system that accounted for what things they say vs what things they don't, the general attitude, wording, and presentation of the site, whether the church had a big focus on any one thing that seemed offputting (the site mainly talks about the pastor rather than Christ, they seem a little too financially-minded, etc), whether the previously aired livestreams showed what seems to be spirit-led worship, and so on. This left me with a list with some high ratings, a few mediums, and some low ratings. So I started watching live sermons at the churches I rated highly first and that's how I've come across the church I'm currently planning on attending.

That was a whole bunch of typing, I apologize, but this way you can kind of try to gauge the other local churches in the meantime whilst you uphold your anniversary commitment. Might save some time and trouble when it comes to shopping around as well.

Wow! That's great advice! I hadn't thought of doing that, the thought of going to a bunch of different churches overwhelms me, your advice really simplifies someof that process.

Thank you

[bornagain2011]

Thank you everyone for your very helpful advice! I found out this morning that I'm not the only one who thinks this way at my church.

I talked with the youth pastor's wife, I started off by apologizing for being argumentative during the meeting. And then I told her that there are some thingd that I don't agree with and that make me feel convicted.

She justified the secularism by saying it's not a sin and it's fun for the kids. We basically agreed to disagree in a loving way.

So, it's clear nothing will change. So, now I battle with whether to be involved in ministry in the church and be a mentor to the children, or to not be involved in ministry, maybe be involved in women's ministry instead, or whether we need to move on. Or whether I should stay, like someone mentioned above, and help guide the church ministry towards righteousness. 

I will keep praying, reading my bible and waiting for His answer.

[Aimes]

On 9/2/2020 at 10:40 PM, bornagain2011 said:

Thank you everyone for your very helpful advice! I found out this morning that I'm not the only one who thinks this way at my church.

I talked with the youth pastor's wife, I started off by apologizing for being argumentative during the meeting. And then I told her that there are some thingd that I don't agree with and that make me feel convicted.

She justified the secularism by saying it's not a sin and it's fun for the kids. We basically agreed to disagree in a loving way.

So, it's clear nothing will change. So, now I battle with whether to be involved in ministry in the church and be a mentor to the children, or to not be involved in ministry, maybe be involved in women's ministry instead, or whether we need to move on. Or whether I should stay, like someone mentioned above, and help guide the church ministry towards righteousness. 

I will keep praying, reading my bible and waiting for His answer.

One of the most heart wrenching decisions I ever had to make was leaving the church I was saved in...my pastor turned the way of hyper grace and left sound doctrine. I tried....I prayed....and I cried. He had been the only Pastor I'd known to truly love and serve Jesus (I grew up in a ultra religious environment and most of the pastors I saw growing up didn't represent the Christ I now love), but this Pastor truly knew the Christ who had come to rescue me but had slipped away. It was so difficult but I knew that I couldn't remain there if I wasn't being fed Truth. 

I'll be praying for you. It's hard to leave a church that you love. 

[bornagain2011]

Thank you Aimes,

That sounds really tough, I'm sorry you went through that  .

It has been a while since Ive been on here and a lot has happened. Some things happened in my marriage, and we have since gotten marriage mentors and have been working on things. One of the decisions we ended up making was to leave that church. We left about 4 weeks ago. It was very hard, very heartbreaking. But we needed to do what we felt like God was leading us to do. 

We started going to another church, and this new one seems ligit, the pastor pushes you to search the scriptures and grow in your faith.

The thing that is kind of sad is that no one has really reached out to us about us not being there. I did call the pastor's wife last week and let her know, but other than that no one seems to notice. 

But the thing that is different about this time as apposed to the other times we have tried to leave is that I am not holding on to any bitter feelings etc. I am moving on and trying to only think about the positives. I don't let myself dwell on all the memories or the people that we miss. Whats so hard is that there was a lot of good, but I refuse to settle for a lukewarm faith, and our old church wasnt helping us grow in our faith, and there didn't seem to be the close family feeling I believe churches should be like.

There are so many things I want to say, but I wont get into them tonight.

[JohnD]

While there is an element of hypersensitivity (others not seeming to be as spiritual as we

are especially when we are on a mountain peak at the time)... there is an element of worldliness

in every congregation (church). The late Dr. Chuck Missler said that there are elements of all seven 

churches in Revelation in every Church.

In my case,  I have plied pastors and deacons and elders with biblical questions they did not wish to face

and  though I intended to continue on as salt and light for that congregation I was asked to leave.

I wasn't being a jerk about it. I had hoped to help correct the situation.  

The traditions of man are not to be underestimated... "this is how we've always done it..." often flies in the

face of scripture that teaches the contrary.

"I've been thrown out of better churches than this..."

 

[Starise]

Contemplating leaving a church carried with it a whole bag of mixed up emotions and thoughts for me. This is especially true if a person tends to overthink things. We want to do the best thing but don't always know what it is. Leaving a group of people we became attached to in some way can seem like a divorce even if the leaving is beneficial.

When I look back on the churches I've left, sometimes I see that I acted foolishly and probably should have showed some fortitude and stayed or at least left in a way that was more considerate. This was my young immaturity showing through. During those years I would localize problems  I was convinced  were the very last straw when in reality this was not always the case.

I have since began to see close church bodies as more like larger extensions of families. Not exactly but close. In families siblings argue, they disagree, they fight, they find fault. This helped me a lot to see it this way because now instead of going off the deep end I just tell myself, " Oh that's just so and so blowing off again about something". People are very predictable that way. You almost know ahead of time who will be the blabber mouth in group prayer not letting anyone else pray or who will be speaking up in meetings or who will routinely be late to gatherings. I'm sure there are things about me they know too. I'm not necessarily saying that there never is good reason to leave, I'm only saying that even in good churches these things exist.

One thing I had to admit to myself is that I hate routine and sometimes I don't want to attend church. I would , over time, begin to resent the routine. Lack of variety kills it for me no matter where I am. I have recognized this is part of who I am and need to realize it's me and not look for reasons to point the finger at someone or something to feel justified in leaving. Not only that but I never developed "close" relationships with people the way I thought I should. Waking early to go sit in a pew and shake a few hands and say hello just doesn't always feel like it's enough unless I adjusted my expectation much lower. 

Sometimes issues grate on us, grate on our inner consciences. We try to deal with it internally because this is the safe way. We tell ourselves it will go away but it doesn't go away and it's a big deal to us. A big enough deal to leave which is in stark contrast to not liking a few people or the way someone does something. I think we should be mature enough as Christians to roll with those minor "church family" kinds of things. They blow over, everyone forgives ( isn't that a fruit of the spirit?). 

The things that bothered me were mainly doctrinal inaccuracies or things I seen pastors do that were in effect taking away from their role . I would bottle it up inside. He'll change or "it" will change.........but it never did, so I finally left. The last time I left it was peaceful. If a church views someone as unhappy, they would rather they leave than become a church gossip and pull everyone else down, especially if that person is aware of and highlighting things they would rather not be known or brought out. 

So far as I can tell, there is no scripture that says it's a sin to leave to find a better "fit" for yourself and your family. Just remember that there is no perfect fit because none of us are perfect. 

As the Bible says, There's a "time" for everything under the sun. Sometimes it's "time" to leave.

 

Edited December 18, 2020 by Starise

[1to3]

I noticed  a falling away already in the years of Jimmy Lee Swaggart  where all the christian scandals began to come into public view.

I felt betrayed and very confused, and fed up and more  or less left the church ( still attended christian churches but not regularly) and began to look more seriously at other belief systems and go to different belief gatherings. Thankfully in my heart I never gave up on God and He began calling me back to Him in 1996, but it took three warnings - in the space of 6 years-from Him, to make me SEE again He was the ONLY Way , Truth and Life and to get back on track with Him, I had to let go of all the other philosophies and worldly stuff I had strayed into. So when I decide to let go of the world and SEEK Him alone it was in the end of November in the year of 2002. I really gave all to Him and let go of my worldly life ,trashed and  burned all worldly things from music, to books. When I did that, I felt a huge weight leave me and I felt wonderfully free and at peace. From there unwards my relationship with Christ began to grow much more than it ever did before and I saw also how by placing my trust in Him more and more how He was able to change me and guide me and restore me.  At that time God placed certain people certain true good Christians my way to share Gods Word , take the time to speak with me and guide me. One of them said if you really want to have true discernment of who is telling the truth and who is lying from church to pastor to brethren, get to know and read the bible for yourself. then you will be equipped with His Word to guide you and align your life to His truth. The Holy Spirit of God is our teacher, corrector and guide and His Word is also here to teach, reproof and guide your path.

All Scripture is God-Breathed

2 Timothy 3:16
…15From infancy you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for instruction, for conviction, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17so that the man of God may be complete, fully equipped for every good work.

So with great hunger for His word I began to read the bible and learn from it. I still tried to find a bible believing church in my area, but was sadly disappointed as I began to see a falling away of Gods Word and an embracing of false teachings. So I began to search online for bible believing ministries, to get nourished by His Word so that also in some way I may participate with them to some capacity, but have unfortunately not found any bible believing church in my area.   Most people I know are either atheist, or do not believe completely in Gods Word.  I know only  a handful now of a bible believers in Gods Word and who align their lives to His Word. 

The bible does warn of a falling away:

2 Thessalonians 2:3-4

Christ taught that the end times would be marked by a massive exodus of believers from the faith. There will be both tremendous persecution and false teaching causing this exodus. Paul said the same thing in 2 Thessalonians about the end times. Before Christ’s return, there will be a great rebellion. People, including professing believers, will begin to follow the Anti-Christ. However, as mentioned,

this warning is not just for some future time; it is for today. Hebrews 3:12 says, “See to it, brothers and sisters, that none of you has an evil, unbelieving heart that forsakes the living God.”

When Paul says, “in the later times,” this refers to the age between Christ’s first coming and second coming. Hebrews 1:2 says, “in these last days he has spoken to us in a son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he created the world.” In 1 John 2:18, the apostle John calls this the last hour. We are in the last days, as we await Christ’s coming, and these days will be marked by increasing apostasy—those who profess Christ and enjoy fellowship in the church but fall away.

So look at the churches today, many are embracing inclusiveness of religions. If you keep a daily relationship close to our Lord and Savior Christ Jesus, He will direct your path and guide you to wear you should be.

Better to be alone with Gods Word than be in an assembly of false doctrines.

I know there still does exist some really good bible believing ministries (Praise God), just unfortunately not in my area. Maybe where you live you can find a good bible believing church, if not God still wants a daily relationship with you and will continue to guide you as you SEEK daily His Word. Also there is Christian radio that can be a great blessing .

In Christ Jesus Always;

1to3

Edited December 18, 2020 by 1to3

[Willa]

I left a liberal church for doctrinal reasons--they didn't teach the basic bible doctrines about the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.  They did teach the little kids Bible stories.  Yet they forbid folk dancing, playing cards, going to movies.  None of this is taught in Scripture but might be considered worldly.

So I prefer to stick to the do's and don'ts in the Bible such as the fruit of the flesh and the fruit of the Spirit in Galatians 5.  

I don't advocate zombie parties but sometimes a party based on a well known series like Dr. Seuss will draw kids in if it sounds fun.  If they also have alter calls where salvation is spelled out, I don't see the harm of it.  That is what our vacation Bible Schools do.  

Some groups for teens try to show that you can have a lot of clean fun without drugs, booze and sex.  The memories of our trips to the river and our campfire sing alongs was one of the things that drew me back into church.  It was good fellowship. As I said, the evangelism should not be neglected but kids need some fun and warm fuzzies as well.  It is God's job to save us, change us into His likeness and to fill us with His Spirit.  Being critical isn't edifying.  

[1to3]

 

In Matthew 7:13-14, Christ tells us how hard it is to enter the kingdom of heaven; He describes a narrow road leading to life and a broad road leading to destruction. False teachers are one reason many are on the broad road.

 

Matthew 5:16
…15Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a basket. Instead, they set it on a stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. 16In the same way, let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven. 17Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets. I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them.…

2 Corinthians 6:14-18
Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness? And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God. As God has said:
"I will dwell in them
And walk among them.
I will be their God,
And they shall be My people."
Therefore "Come out from among them
And be separate, says the Lord.
Do not touch what is unclean,
And I will receive you."
"I will be a Father to you,
And you shall be My sons and daughters,
Says the LORD Almighty."

 

 

John 15:18-19
"If the world hates you, you know that it hated Me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own. Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you

John 17:14-19
I have given them Your word; and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one. They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth. As You sent Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they also may be sanctified by the truth.

1 Peter 2:9-10
But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; who once were not a people but are now the people of God, who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy.

James 4:4
Adulterers and adulteresses! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Whoever therefore wants to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.

Revelation 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues.

Romans 12:2
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.

1 Corinthians 2:14-16
But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one. For "who has known the mind of the LORD that he may instruct Him?" But we have the mind of Christ.

Ephesians 2:1-2
And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience,

1 Peter 1:15-16
but as He who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct, because it is written, "Be holy, for I am holy."

Matthew 10:14

And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet.2

 

John 7-11

Beware of Antichrist Deceivers

⁷ For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. ⁸ Look to yourselves, that ^[a]we do not lose those things we worked for, but that we may receive a full reward.

⁹ Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. ¹⁰ If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him; ¹¹ for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.

Deuteronomy 30:20
that you may love the LORD your God, that you may obey His voice, and that you may cling to Him, for He is your life and the length of your days; and that you may dwell in the land which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them."

 

Luke 14:26
"If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple.

 

Colossians 3:1-4
If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of God. Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth. For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with Him in glory.

 

2 Corinthians 6:14

Do Not Be Unequally Yoked
13As a fair exchange, I ask you as my children: Open wide your hearts also. 14Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership can righteousness have with wickedness? Or what fellowship does light have with darkness? 15What harmony is there between Christ and Belial? Or what does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?…