The first of the seven warnings of plagues the earth will see.

iamlamad · September 23, 2020

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

1. John the Baptist was not Elijah, you can mix that up and cling to that untruth all you like, Gabriel the Angel in stated in Luke 1 that John was come in the Spirit of Elijah. Jesus was saying that John did the same thing that Elijah was going to do and they received him not. It astounds me that people actually think a man can be born again, its just not factual. Elijah was seem at the Mt of Olives transfiguration. John came to call Israel to repentance, now please show me how he fulfilled Malachi 4:5-6, because he did not, Israel never turned back unto God under John, and Jesus CLEARLY STATED that Elijah would return and restore Israel in the END TIMES. You just have a comprehension problem on these things brother, once you get something in your mind, you have no earthly ability, it seems, to see anything but your understandings. (P.S. I prove above your 3.5 days XAN NOT BE CORRECT)

Matthew 11:

¹³For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.

¹⁴And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.

It seems you DON'T receive it. You could. I did. I believe Jesus.

Matthew 17:

¹⁰And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come? (they knew what Malachi wrote - that Elijah would come before the Day.)

¹¹And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things. (Jesus is only acknowledging that Malachi wrote truth: Elijah would come first, before the Day of the Lord.)

¹²But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. (Jesus told them that this prophecy (coming first) was already fulfilled.) John the baptist fulfilled the part that Elias must come first, before the Day of the Lord, as Malachi wrote. John came before the day of the Lord. )

¹³Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.

Elijah will surely come, but He does not have to arrive before the Day of the Lord. In fact, John shows Him showing up AFTER the start of the DAY.

Your "untruth" is the TRUTH of scripture. We just need to understand it.

You just have a comprehension problem on these things brother You are talking about yourself again. I just showed you the scriptures that show your theory in error.

Jesus was saying that John did the same thing that Elijah was going to do No, go back and read it again.

Jesus CLEARLY STATED that Elijah would return and restore Israel in the END TIMES. True.

As usual, your arguments fail.

Edited September 23, 2020 by iamlamad

iamlamad · September 23, 2020

5 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

You can't read the Judgments (7 Trumps) until all the Seals are broken brother. No Seal is a Judgment, its Jesus, CLEARLY PROPHESYING what is about to befall mankind. We know the Day of the Lord is the Joel 2:31 event, we see that HAPPEN in Rev. chapter 8 with the first four seals, so where does the 6th Seal happen brother? Trump numbers 1, 2, 3 and 4, of course. When does the Anti-Christ go forth? Trump numbers 1, 2, 3 and 4 also, thus that event starts the Wrath of God. Jesus opens a Seal in Heaven and speaks to the Church/Bride in Heaven, this is coming, then he opens Seal #2 and says this is coming, then when he opens Seal #7, thee is SILENCE, the Book can be OPENED and the Judgements can be read, God's Wrath is at hand, the Trumpet Judgements are about to be SOUNDED by the 7 Angels.

You can't read the Judgments (7 Trumps) until all the Seals are broken brother. We seem to agree on that, until you make some statement against it.

No Seal is a Judgment Sorry, but seal 6 starts the Day of the Lord, and that is the start of judgment.

its Jesus, CLEARLY PROPHESYING what is about to befall mankind. No, it is EVENTS made legal so begin to happen as soon as the seal is opened. Case in point: when the first seal was opened, the church was sent out. When the 6th seal WILL BE opened, the day of the Lord will officially start.

We know the Day of the Lord is the Joel 2:31 event The sun turns dark (sackcloth) and the moon into blood, BEFORE the day of the Lord begins.

we see that HAPPEN in Rev. chapter 8 with the first four seals You are all mixed up. Did you mean first four trumpets?

so where does the 6th Seal happen brother? The 6th seal provides the SIGNS of the Day - proving it is imminent. But does it begin at the 6th seal (as the last event - so AFTER) or does it begin between the 6th seal and the 7th. Or does it really start at the 7th seal? I have not made up my mind yet. Since the 70th week starts at the 7th seal, why not the day of the Lord too?

Trump numbers 1, 2, 3 and 4, Sorry, it does not take 4 events too start the day! It MAY start with 7th seal. I don't think John has made it clear. So far I lean toward the Day of the Lord starting at the end of chapter 6 or at seal 7. I think we are both sure that the trumpet judgments are INSIDE the day of the Lord.

When does the Anti-Christ go forth? Trump numbers 1, 2, 3 and 4 NO NO NO! How can he "go forth" when he is not the AC yet, only the man of sin? He has not yet been revealed. No one or very few will know who will become the AC until the revealing. John does not see him rising until chapter 13. My friend, you are jumping the gun.

thus that event starts the Wrath of God. It may well be that the first trumpet is the first event with God's wrath.

Jesus opens a Seal in Heaven and speaks to the Church/Bride in Heaven, this is coming, then he opens Seal #2 and says this is coming, This is myth. Jesus opens a seal, one of the four Beasts say "come and see" and then that event happens, RIGHT THEN.

Seal #7, thee is SILENCE This is one proof that seal 7 is the official start of the 70th week.

the Book can be OPENED and the Judgements can be read, I would say WILL BE read. I think the entire 70th week is written INSIDE the book, except the 7th seal that gets the book opened.

We are not far off here.

iamlamad · September 24, 2020

17 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

After the transfiguration on the mount, Jesus came back down and told the Disciples to tell no one until the Son of Man (Jesus)had been raised from the dead........Then Jesus tells them thus once they aske him a question.

Matt. 17:9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead. 10 And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come?

11 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall(not will but SHALL) first come, and restore all things.

12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. 13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.

Jesus is simply giving them an axiom, Jesus is saying, John the Baptist came and did the EXACT SAME THING that Elijah is going to do, but they REJECTED him and KILLED him, but Elijah will RESTORE the Kingdom, John did not. How do you miss that fact? The Kingdom was overrun in 70 AD, it was NEVER RESTORED, the 70 year punishment was not even finished yet, how could it be restored without REPENTANCE FIRST? The 7th Trumpet by the way, is the 3rd Woe (read Rev. 8:13, its says the Last Three Trumps ARE the 3 Woes) thus the 3rd Woe is ALL 7 Vials, and that will not come to pass in 3.5 days.

2. We know exactly when the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem/Israel/MANY, its in Daniel chapter 12.

Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two(2 Angels), the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. 6 And one (Angel) said to the man clothed in linen(Jesus), which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders? (Remember this QUESTION the Angels asks Jesus !!)

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen(Jesus), which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

Or in modern writing style it would say this, when the Hole peoples (Jewish people) power is lost and they have been scattered, all these things will be finished in 1260 days (Time, times and 1/2 time).

What was THE QUESTION ? How long shall it be until the WONDERS ALL END? Then Jesus Answers, from the time Jerusalem is Conquered, or Scattered, or they are OVERCOME and thus lose their POWER, there will be 1260 days. (and that means the Second Coming of Jesus as we all now know).

So, the bible tells us that the one who Conquers Jerusalem will rule over them 1260 days.

Rev. 11 says this also..........Rev. 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

Now that we know that Jesus himself told Daniel that the Jews will be Conquered during these END TIMES (see Dan. 12:1-2, its END TIMES no doubt) and they will be ruled over or lose power for 1260 days and THEN the end will come to these WONDERS which Daniel was being shown (which of course means the Second Coming), now, what do the other two numbers mean? WELL, Lets see:

Daniel 12:8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? (Asks again the EXACT SAME Question that the Angel asked Jesus, so NATUARLY Jesus' answer is about a specific number of days until ALL THESE WOMDERS END !! So, the 1290, and 1335, is just like the 1260, a SET NUMBER OF DAYS..........Until ALL THESE WONDERS END !!

9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away (Jesus Worship), and the abomination(Image of the Beast) that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. 12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

REMEMBER, its HOW MANY DAYS UNTIL THESE WONDERS END..........that is the question by Daniel, its the exact same question the Angel asked Jesus, so Jesus after telling Daniel to go his way, gives him two more clues in the EXACT SAME MANNER.

The AoD will be 1290 days until ALL THESE WONDERS END.

The 1335 will be 1335 days until ALL THESE WONDERS END.

BOTH.......happen before the Anti-Christ Conquers the Holy peoples at the 1260 event, which by COMPARISON is only 1260 days until all these wonders end at the Second Coming.

The AoD thus happens 30 days BEFORE the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem/Israel/THE MANY. Its the False Prophet (Jewish High Priest) who takes away Jesus Worship from the 1/3 of Jews who REPENT (Zechariah 13:8-9 happens JUST BEFORE the coming DOTL seen in Zechariah 14:1-2), thus he stops Jesus Worship and places an IMAGE (Rev. 13) of the Beast in the Temple 30 days before Jerusalem gets Conquered by this Anti-Christ, who will only then become THE BEAST once he Conquers Jerusalem. This is why the Jews who have ALREADY REPENTED, else they would not know to flee Judea, Flee Judea for the Mountainous area of Petra/Bozrah, they get a 30 day heads up to Flee Judea, REMEMBER, Jesus says do not look back, GO..............well why go if you are leaving as the Anti-Christ is Conquering you ? That makes no sense that SIGN would happen as they were being Conquered. The SIGN comes at the 1290, like Daniel says, which is 30 days BEFORE the 1260.

The BLESSING thus has to be the Two-witnesses showing up 75 days BEFORE the Anti-Christ conquers Jerusalem and 45 days BEFORE the False Prophet (Jewish High Priest) STOPS Jesus Worship, after the 1/3 Repent, and they REPENT because of the BLESSING in the Two-witnesses that show up.

No one cares what day Jesus COMES ON, except you it seems. Rev. 17 is the False Religions being KILLED OFF by the Beast and his Kings or Europe. Rev. 18 is this Whole World (Babylon) being JUDGED over a 42 month period of time. The Marriage in Rev. 19 takes place over a 7 year period, we see them in Rev. 4 and 5 with their White Robes on already.

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. (NUFF SAID)

You are not very good at math, or Prophecy brother.

I already explained this. In verse 11 Jesus is confirming what Malachi said, that Elijah must come first, before the Day of the Lord. The disciples then ask Jesus:

"Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come?" (They know what the scribes have taught them, what Malachi wrote.)

11 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things. ( Here Jesus is only comfirming the truth of what Malachi wrote: In other words: yes, it is true Malachi wrote that Elijah must come first, but I will tell you something else.......)

12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. 13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist. (Jesus tells them Elias is come already. In other words, in the mind of God, the Malachi prophecy was fulfilled. Was John the Baptist before the Day of the Lord? Certainly He was.

Elias truly shall first come (it is written and it is true) But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not,

Jesus is telling them that as far as God was concerned, the Malachi prophecy was already fulfilled. However, many prophecies have more than one fulfillment, and Elijah SHALL come again, but won't have to come FIRST, before the start of the Day of the Lord.

Malachi 4:

⁵Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord:

⁶And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers,

I think John accomplished this. I also think Elijah will accomplish it in the future. Keep in mind, the same word "all" is used when "all" of a city went out to see Jesus, or when "all" Jerusalem was troubled about the wise men. Do you imagine Elijah will win the battle of Armageddon and set up the Millennial kingdom all by himself? Remember, by "restore all things" what Malachi really wrote was to turn the hearts of the children to the fathers, and the fathers to the children. That would be restoring FAMILIES.

We know from Revelation that Elijah DOES COME as one of the two prophets. (But He does NOT come before the Start of the Day of the Lord.)

The 7th Trumpet by the way, is the 3rd Woe (read Rev. 8:13, its says the Last Three Trumps ARE the 3 Woes) thus the 3rd Woe is ALL 7 Vials, and that will not come to pass in 3.5 days.

This is just more wishful thinking. Yes, of course the 7th trumpet is the 3rd woe - but the 7th trumpet is NOT the 7 vials. The 3rd woe is not the 7 vials. Did you not read? John TELLS US what the 3rd woe is:

Rev. 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

The third woe will be the days of GT caused by the devil using the Beast and FP to fulfill his great wrath. It seems you really don't understand the 3.5 days.

2. We know exactly when the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem/Israel/MANY, its in Daniel chapter 12. And you imagine this is instantaneous? 12:1 is the BEGINNING of the days of GT. In Daniel is is a few verses. In Revelation it is a few chapters. Where they should we focus to form doctrine? In Revelation it is at the 6th vial (late in the last half of the week) when spirits are sent out to call in the nations of the world to send their armies. They gather in the valley of Megiddo. Is Jerusalem destroyed yet? NO! Israel is certainly under attack, but "conquered?" That NEVER HAPPENS. It only partially happens. Jesus comes before Jerusalem is completely taken. HOWEVER: at the midpoint, when the man of sin is possessed by the devil and becomes the AC Beast, he will from that point on perhaps exert some control over Jerusalem. He will live there. Remember, many of the Jews there will swallow the lie, that he really is their god. In other words, I don't find "conquer" anywhere in Revelation concerning the Beast.

I am out of tme

Revelation Man · September 24, 2020

On 9/23/2020 at 11:35 AM, iamlamad said:

Perhaps none of those on this forum. But the world is a big place. There are others that agree with my timing of the seals - those that read without preconceived glasses.

Billy and Susan :t2: touche Monsiuer.

On 9/23/2020 at 11:35 AM, iamlamad said:

You keep telling us you hear from the Holy Spirit so of course you are right - but not once that I know of have you written the WORDS the Holy Spirit spoke. Perhaps then, it as only too much pizza or imagination. Too many times, people hear the "still small voice" of their own human spirit and imagine it is God.

I don't think you understand how the Holy Spirit operates per se, but in the post above I quoted the Holy Spirit, which just proves you either don't comprehend very well, or you just skim and reply, which would maybe be why you can't learn anything. I will not tell you the quote, lets see if you can come up with it..........ACTUALLY REQUIRES READING...........

I don't even hear people that try to tell me about the Holy Spirit when it SEEMS ODD TO THEM. I have to ask myself why you do not understand how it works. Therein, I get my questions about people answered in and of itself.

On 9/23/2020 at 11:35 AM, iamlamad said:

When did Jesus ascend and send the Holy Spirit down? The bible tells us this, but you seem to ignore that John wrote it in his two chapter narrative here of the throne room.

Not when these verses you cite above are speaking of, which is.............THINGS THAT MUST BE.........HEREAFTER [The Church Age]. Jesus brought the Holy Spirit back as soon as he died, he opened these Seals whilst the 24 Elders (Church) are seen in Heaven. You know, the ones in Rev. 5:9 that are REDEEMED by the Blood of Jesus. When you can't get past something like Rev. 5:9, why do you just carry on like a mule does, not caring about the facts ? Because your ideas are ALL IMPORTANT Brother. Its not about us, its about Jesus and the TRUTH.

But it doesn't matter to you that the Church, FROM ALL NATIONS, are seen there BEFORE Jesus opens the Seals, that messes with your theory, so lets just forget we saw that verse. I don't get it at all tbh brother.

On 9/23/2020 at 1:25 PM, iamlamad said:

This is a classic example of your imagination. You think you know, so of course everyone who disagrees is wrong - who cares what the WORD says. I pay attention to the CONTEXT of the seals, while you with your imagination ignores the context. Let me remind you again of the context:

I know I know, that is what hearing the Holy Spirit is about.

On 9/23/2020 at 1:25 PM, iamlamad said:

⁶And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

WHEN? WHEN did Jesus ascend and send the Holy Spirit down? I can assure you, just before Jesus opened the first seal.

Again, WHEN Jesus brought the Holy Spirit back (8 Days LATER........After his death) has nothing to do with the Seals that he opens whilst the Church is in Heaven, YOU, and OTHERS got there with the verses that I heretofore have proven was a Rabbit Hole, now you never mention it, but that is what convinced you to go there to start with, the ole, Jesus was no where to be found in Heaven, that was THE WHISPER that got you to go down that rabbit hole brother, the one that can't be true because the Church is IN HEAVEN, in Rev. 4 and 5, but you can't admit it is in Heaven or your theory dissolves.

On 9/23/2020 at 1:25 PM, iamlamad said:

You will never understand the things I do Pride does a lot of talking.

Pride is the very thing I am speaking about as per why you can never change any opinion. You can't imagine how many of my FORMER OPINIONS I have allowed the Holy Spirit to tell me, Ron, you are wrong here. My blog on Babylon I spent months researching stated, Babylon meant Rome, then the Holy Spirit was like, you are WRONG Ron, did I stay with pride? No, I changed my Blog and told everyone why Babylon was the WHOLE WORLD & not Rome. Rev. 16:19 proves it. God called those he defeats Babylon the Great.......well, Who did God defeat ? Vial #6 tells us, its real simple, the KINGS OF THE WHOLE WORLD !! It was never Rome, and because I refused to let MY PRIDE get in the way, God could/can teach me His truths, its not MY TRUTHS. Its His Truths. Therein lies the difference between us brother, I want to be corrected, I have yet to see you ever change on ANYTHING.

Another point on this, up until a year ago, maybe a little more, I was adamant that those who stated the 7 Seal Earthquake/Events could not match nor be the SAME EVENTS as the Trumps nor Vials. Well, I was halfway right, but halfway wrong, but those that said ALL THREE were the same events were wrong then and are STILL WRONG in full, but they could see a similarity and I was like NO WAY guys, not with the Holy Spirits affirmation I might add, I have the Holy Spirits affirmation now because I see it clearly. There has never been but ONE SET OF WRATH(S), that is the 7 Trumps, the 7 Vials are just the 3rd Woe which emit forth from the 7th Trump. The Seven Seals are NOT ACTIONABLE. So, I allowed God to CORRECT ME in this instance also. And in all instances where God decides to show me His full truths, prideful men can't take correction, thus they FAIL to hear God's still voice in these situations, thus they can't learn God's truths. You of course mistake PRIDE for CONFIDENCE but fail to see why you yourself never take any correction on anything.

It is what it is brother.

On 9/23/2020 at 1:25 PM, iamlamad said:

As you can see, I am FAR from the only one that sees the first seal as the gospel going forth.

Perhaps you should spend some time reading the commentaries..

You are reading men that are mostly dead sir, why do I need MEN'S IDEAS, especially of old, and of course you pick a few that agree with you and thus were not understanding of these prophesies themselves. They commented on the bible as a whole, meaning they probably were not called unto prophesy, but felt the need to comment on even things they did not understand.

The White Horse stands for a Conqueror, The Anti-Christ Conquers in Rev. 6 (really in Rev. 8 and 13...the TIMING is in Rev. 8, the TELLING of it is in Rev. 13, its foretold in Rev. 6). Jesus goes forth Conquering on a White Horse also, because it means TO CONQUER. Symbolism. The CROWN in Rev. 6 is NOTHING LIKE THE CROWN IN Rev. 19. They are DIFFERNT WORDS for a reason.

#4735 Στέφανος stephanos {stef'-an-os} from an apparently primary stepho (to twine or wreathe); TDNT - 7:615,1078; n m

—Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)

1) a crown 1a) a mark of royal or (in general) exalted rank 1a1) the wreath or garland which was given as a prize to victors in public games

—Thayer's (New Testament Greek-English Lexicon)

NOW, in Revelation 19 we see he had on MANY CROWNS, not just one. Rev. 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

#1238 διάδημα diadema {dee-ad'-ay-mah} from a compound of G1223 and G1210; TDNT - n/a; n n

—Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)

1) a diadem 1a) a blue band marked with white which Persian kings used to bind on the turban or tiara 1b) the kingly ornament for the head, the crown For Synonyms see entry G5833

—Thayer's (New Testament Greek-English Lexicon)

From a compound of G1223 and G1210; a "diadem" (as bound about the head):—crown. Compare G4735.

—Strong's (Greek Dictionary of the New Testament)

So one had a STRAW/Wreath like Crown, won by VICTORS, and the other had a Kingly Ornament of MANY CROWNS, because Jesus is King of kings, not just a king that defeats a few people on earth, ONE wins a few wars on earth.......ONE is the King of kings and the majestic Son of the living God. That is why both are CONQUERORS, but described in a much different fashion.

P.S. I doubt any of those guys you cited felt the Seals were opened 2000 some odd years ago. They just were not prophecy guys in general.

On 9/23/2020 at 1:34 PM, iamlamad said:

the book can not be opened until the Seals are all OFF I have always said that the book cannot be opened until ALL SEVEN seals are opened first. This may be the ONLY place we agree.

that is why Seal 6 matches Trump 4, You just contradicted yourself! But perhaps you did not know it. The trumpets are written INSIDE THE BOOK. They cannot possibly match up with any seal! The book cannot be opened until ALL seals (yes, even seal 6) are opened first.

No, you still can not see the BIG PICTURE. I just made the same point I have been making, the one you can't grasp. The Seals are NOT ACTIONABLE sir, just like I stated before, so at the 6th Seal Jesus is (WATCH NOW) Prophesying what will come SHORTLY when the Trumpet Judgments are brought forth AFTER the 7th Seal has LOOSED the Judgment book from its bindings.

So, you are saying Jesus can't Prophesy about what is about to come? REALLY ? You do not want to go there right? You are realizing your error as we chat I hope, LOL. Of course Jesus can PROPHESY what is about to befall mankind, then the Sealed Book BRINGS FORTH that very Judgment. It's all symbolism anyway, that seems to escape you. Its a BOOK OF JUDGEMTS that will be passed onto an Evil/Wicked world. God did not need to write the book of Revelation to Judge us, He judged mankind in Genesis via a flood before He ever gave Moses the written word. it's SYMBOLISM brother. Jesus/God always warns, thus He's telling the Church in Heaven as He's opening the Seals, this is about to befall mankind. Of course the Church needs no warning, but those on earth need that warning, thus is is written, where men can figure it out via prayer and earnest seeking of the Lord God. Amen.

On 9/23/2020 at 1:34 PM, iamlamad said:

you just can't see it because you have tunnel vision brother, I understand you have to lower others so you look good. It is a common trait.

Me telling you why you can't see is me lowering you, so when Paul corrected he was LOWERING OTHERS ? OK...if you say so.

On 9/23/2020 at 1:34 PM, iamlamad said:

that Seal being opened 2000 some odd years ago with you is a "PRIDE THING" and men can't gain knowledge from God when they already KNOW IT ALL Ah! My friend: you are talking about yourself!

⁶And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

Ask yourself WHEN! WHEN did Jesus ascend and send the Holy Spirit down?

Where we differ here is paying attention to CONTEXT. You ignore it, I understand it: Jesus explained it to me.

As explained above, I understand how to be CORRECTED by God, pride is not something that will keep me from hearing God's Holy Spirit correction. I love being corrected, that way I am learning God's secrets.

Edited September 28, 2020 by Revelation Man

Revelation Man · September 24, 2020

On 9/23/2020 at 2:25 PM, iamlamad said:

I guess you really just don't know. This is all MYTH. It is simple logic and you said so youself, NO trumpet can sound until all seals are opened so that the book can be opened. What is the first thing read inside the book? Seven angels get seven trumpets.

Please explain then how any trumpet can come at the time of any seal? It is simply impossible.

BECAUSE........THE.........SEALS...........ARE.........JESUS............PROPHESYING.........THE TRUMPETS. Get it ? The SAME WAY the Trumpets can be Joel 2:31.........LIGHT SWITCH ON YET brother? I think its so simple a concept you just overlooked my point brother. That is why I always say you guys make the simple things seem complex because you over analyze them.

On 9/23/2020 at 2:25 PM, iamlamad said:

Again your theory is wrong because you pulled it out of its 32 AD context. The truth is, the first 5 seals are the entire church age.

Simply no one buys this. I do not take it serious, thus once I debate it with someone, and they cling to it, I just skip over it.

On 9/23/2020 at 2:25 PM, iamlamad said:

By the way, trumpet 1 may or may not be an asteroid. What would burn up all the grass in a huge area and some of the trees? A NUKE. What does "wormwood" tell us. AGain, NUKES. You and I both know that as soon as Iran has the ability, it is going to hit Israel with a nuke. When that happens, both the US and Israel will retaliate - with nukes. Yes, I am guessing. But why would God choose "wormwood" when Chernobyl is wormwood translated to English?

Scientists have confirmed that via any asteroid impact, fires come in first, and since God from His throne room, in some fashion, casts theses fires down onto the earth as an answer to the prayers of the Saints (Two-witnesses is my guess) then I see it all as the same event, an asteroid cast down to earth via God's Judgment.

Rev. 8:3 And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand. 5 And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake.

6 And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound. 7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.

The IMPACT of a 400 yard wide asteroid will be poisonous, most have metals within them, this could of course have an UNKOWN SUBSTANCE that is very poisonous for all we know. The impact of the asteroid that wiped out the DINOS was like greater than all the Nuclear Weapons on earth. These things are violent by nature.

Iran is never getting a Nuke. God is going to defeat Russia, Iran and Turkey on the mount of God BEFORE the Anti-Christ comes to power, that is the Ezekiel 38 war of Gog and Magog, the Anti-Christ defeats Jerusalem, the other never do.

On 9/23/2020 at 2:25 PM, iamlamad said:

. Those under the altar are told specifically that they can not gain VENGEANCE, until ALL THE BROTHERS have been killed in like manner as they have. It is NOT a metaphor! They are crying for judgment. (the 6th seal starts judgment). But they are told they have to wait before that 6th seal can start God's judgment How long? Until the final number has come it. Or, until the very last martyr has been killed. You imagine this is future; the truth is, it started with the first martyr. Stephen was not the first, but without a doubt was in that group. It is truth, martys are STILL HAPPENING in the church age, and will continue until the pretrib rapture ENDS the church age. Then, and only then will judgment begin, with the 6th seal.

Just a little logic proves this: if they were 70th week martyrs, beheaded, they would KNOW God's judgment had already started - and would end at the end of 7 years.

It has to be a Metaphor, it hasn't happened yet. By its VERY NATURE it has to be Metaphoric, do you really think God/Jesus has to ask those dead people how they feel in the grave? Come on man......God knows all things. Its METAPHORIC, Jesus is telling us what is in their hearts, even as they rest in their graves God knows our very hearts.

So God uses this to tell us, THESE PEOPLE (Martyrs of the Tribulation period) will be raised at the very end, when the Anti-Christs tyrannical rule is over, not before. This is made VERY CLEAR, in Rev. 20:4, ONLY THOSE killed for NOT TAKKING the Mark of the Beast are raised and Judged in Rev. 20:4, AFTER we the Church returns with Jesus in Rev. 19, that is because they will live and reign WITH Jesus ON EARTH for 1000 years.

The Church is seen in Rev. 7:9-17, we came out of the GREAT TRIBULATION as in the 2000 year Church Age. As in 2000>7. I got all the answers because I hear instruction brother. They want VENGEANCE via THOSE ON EARTH who KILLED THEM.......You get that? The ones under the 5th Altar just told you via God's understanding of their HEARTS...........that they want Vengeance on people STILL ALIVE ON EARTH during the END TIMES !! Who killed them becase they wouldn't bow down to the Beast (Rev. 20:4).

Rev. 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

So, the ones that killed them, DWELL ON EARTH as in they are ALIVE on earth at the very end.(I have the answers brother because I listen to the Holy Writ and the Holy Spirit).

Edited September 28, 2020 by Revelation Man

iamlamad · September 24, 2020

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

BECAUSE........THE.........SEALS...........ARE.........JESUS............PROPHESYING.........THE TRUMPETS. Get it ? The SAME WAY the Trumpets can be Joel 2:31.........LIGHT ON YET brother? I think its so simple a concept you just overlooked my point brother. That is why I always say yiu guys make the simple tings seem complex because you over analyze them.

Simply no one buys this. I do not take it serious, thus once I debate it with someone, and they cling to it, I just skip over it.

Scientists have confirmed that via any impact, fires come in first, and since God from His throne room, in some fashion, casts theses fires down onto the earth as an answer to the prayers of the Saints (Two-witnesses is my guess) then I see it all as the same event, an asteroid cast down to earth via God's Judgment.

Rev. 8:3 And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand. 5 And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake.

6 And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound.

7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.

The IMPACT of a 400 yard asteroid will be poisonous, most have metals within them, this could have an UNKOWNS SUBSTANCE that is very poisonous for all we know. The impact of the asteroid that wiped out the DINOS was like greater than all the Nuclear Weapons on earth. These things are violent by nature.

Iran is never getting a Nuke. God is going to defeat Russia, Iran and Turkey on the mount of God BEFORE the Anti-Christ comes to power, that is the Ezekiel 38 war of Gog and Magog, the Anti-Christ defeats Jerusalem, the other never do.

It has to be a Metaphor, it hasn't happened yet. By its VERY NATURE it has to be Metaphoric, do you really think God/Jesus has to ask those dead people how they feel in the grave? Come on man......God knows all things. Its METAPHORIC, Jesus is telling us what is in their hearts, even as they rest in their graves God knows our very hearts.

So God uses this to tell us, THESE PEOPLE (Martyrs of the Tribulation period) will be raised at the very end, when the Anti-Christs tyrannical rule is over, not before. This is made VERY CLEAR, in Rev. 20:4, ONLY THOSE killed for NOT TAKKING the Mark of the Beast are raised in Judged in Rev. 20:4, AFTER we the Church returns with Jesus in Rev. 19, that is because they will live and reign WITH Jesus ON EARTH for 1000 years.

The Church is seen in Rev. 7:9-17, we came out of the GREAT TRIBULATION as in the 2000 year Church Age. As in 2000>7. I got all the answers because I hear instruction brother. They want VENGEANCE via THOSE ON EARTH who KILLED THEM.......You get that? The ones under the 5th Altar just told you via God's understanding of their HEARTS...........that they want Vengeance on people STILL ALIVE ON EARTH during the END TIMES !!

Rev. 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

So, the ones that killed them, DWELL ON EARTH as in they are ALIVE on earth at the very end.(I have the answers brother because I listen to the Holy Writ and the Holy Spirit).

BECAUSE........THE.........SEALS...........ARE.........JESUS............PROPHESYING..... Your theory, but not truth. Strike 1! There is not scripture even hinting at such a thing.

The SAME WAY the Trumpets can be Joel 2:31 That's not truth either; just your imagination. Strike 2! Is this the way you solve scripture: just imagine an answer? Joel 2:31 is the sun turning dark and the moon into blood. If these are total eclipses, they could happen in ONE MONTH. The trumpets are NOT Joel 2:31.

LIGHT ON YET brother? Enough to recognize your many errors in thinking.

I think its so simple a concept you just overlooked my point That is not it at all: we don't buy into your imagination. I have yet to see you make a comment and base it on scripture correctly understood. (I am not saying you have not.)

Simply no one buys this. I do not take it serious, I showed you commentary after commentary that wrote "THE GOSPEL" going forth. When did that happen? Soon after Jesus ascended. You are wrong again (about no one buying it and about the timing of the first seal.) STRIKE 3! What this tells the readers is that your thinking is so far from what the Author intended in many scriptures that you can't take the truth of scripture seriously.

I agree, it COULD be an asteroid. It MIGHT be an asteroid. It also could be a nuke. No one is going to know for sure until it happens.

It has to be a Metaphor, it hasn't happened yet. You have already struck out and we are not half way through. Your errors in the timing of the seals causes the domino effect: one error after another. It is not a metaphor, and it has been happening since Jesus sent out the church. Stephen was one of the first. By its VERY NATURE it has to be Metaphoric, do you really think God/Jesus has to ask those dead people how they feel in the grave? You amaze me! Only their BODY was dead. THEY where there under the altar. They were asking God and God ANSWERED them. That is not metaphoric, it is literal. It is your imagination again. It was not about "feelings." they wanted to know when God would judge those that murdered them. They KNEW God is a God of justice.

Jesus is telling us what is in their hearts, even as they rest in their graves Pure imagination: Here is the truth:

10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

(Why not just take the word as written? There is no need to use imagination.)

THESE PEOPLE (Martyrs of the Tribulation period) God and John have not yet started the Day of the Lord, or the 70th week, and you imagine "the tribulation period." This theory is so far off, it is not a strike, not out in left field. This theory is totally out of the ball park! A NON SEQUITUR. (For the readers, the real martyrs of the "tribulation period" begin showing up in heaven in chapter 15!)

will be raised at the very end, when the Anti-Christs tyrannical rule is over, Sorry, WRONG AGAIN! They are church age martyrs and will be raised at the pretrib rapture. So far your batting average is ZERO, not one thing righht.

AFTER we the Church returns with Jesus in Rev. 19, Finally! Thank God forever! Finally something that is TRUTH. I'll bold this!

The Church is seen in Rev. 7:9-17, we came out of the GREAT TRIBULATION as in the 2000 year Church Age. Finally! Thank God forever! Finally something else that is TRUTH. See when you teach what is written, I readily agree with you!

I got all the answers because I hear instruction brother. I suspect most of the time you talk to yourself - meaning your own imagination. It is very good to have a RIGHT answer now and then!

in Rev. 20:4, ONLY THOSE killed for NOT TAKKING the Mark of the Beast are raised in Judged in Rev. 20:4, Sorry, not true. John saw both the New and Old testament saints seated on thrones, and they too will take place in that resurrection - just not all at the same time. I suspect the Old Testament saints will be raised (on the last day of the 70th week - at the 7th vial) WITH the TWO witnesses. The Two Witnesses will be Old Testament saints. So you missed it again.

They want VENGEANCE via THOSE ON EARTH who KILLED THEM.......You get that? I think anyone martyred would feel the same way. But not only vengeance: they know God is a God of justice, and know that eventually HE WILL JUDGE. They know justice will be done - they just don't know when. That is what they are asking, a TIMING question.

(I have the answers brother because I listen to the Holy Writ and the Holy Spirit). (As if no one else can or does.) Sadly, most of your answers were wrong.

Revelation Man · September 24, 2020

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

How can anyone make something so simple into something difficult? Oh! It makes someone look better in their own eyes.

First, some basics:

ALL FIVE mentions of the 3 1/2 year period of time given in Revelation are for the LAST HALF of the week.

11:1-2 The man of sin enters Jerusalem to make it his home. He HAS to be in Jerusalem to enter the temple in Jerusalem.
11:3 The two witnesses suddenly SHOW UP - that come here because the man of sin just came

These two mentions of the 3.5 year period of time prove chapter 11:1 is very close to the division point. Both of these countdowns will start slightly before the division point.

12:6 The woman begins to flee: perhaps 2 seconds after the abomination that will divide the week.
12:14: the woman gets supernatural Protection for time, times and half of time.

These two countdowns begin just after the division point, but only just. Again these prove chapter 12 to be a midpoint chapter.

13:5 42 months of authority this coundown starts last so will end last. We see that in Revelation: the week ends at the 7th vial, but it is some unknown time later before Jesus returns.

Did you ever notice? 11:2 shows that John is very near the midpoint of the week and the countdown of trampling will begin.
11:3 shows the 1260 days of testifying, this countdown probably starting a second or to after the 42 months. Again, these countdowns prove John is very close to the midpoint.

Oh OH! John takes the readers down the last half of the week with the two witnesses all in chapter 11! So is the week over in chapter 12? No, because another countdown begins in chapter 12, proving chapter 12 is a midpoint chapter.

Some people solve this dilemma by moving the start of the Two witnesses to the start of the week. NO, that is wrong and not the intent of the Author. They begin right where John saw them and wrote. Others solve this by starting a parenthesis in chapter 10 and taking it all the way to 11:14. That is not right either.

The truth is, verses 11:4 through 11:13 are written as a parenthesis. So the death of the Two Witnesses is written in chapter 11 but really happens in chapter 16 where the week ends.

Rev. 11 is a Parenthetical Citation Chapter IN FULL, its about the Two-witnesses Ministry on earth. Nothing else in reality, though it covers other things like Woe #2 and Woe #3 which is the 7th Trump, AFTER the Two-witnesses DIE, the 7th Trump blows and brings VICTORY to Jesus via the 7 VIALS of Judgment that get poured out which takes 75 days to come to pass, thus the Two-witnesses' 1260 days of Ministry AND the 7th Trump/3rd Woe which THEY PRAY DOWN, is shown in Rev. 11 as being a part of their Ministry because THEY PRAYED IT DOWN, thus the Rev. 11 chapter lasts 1335 days, even though they die on the 1260th day of their Ministry on earth.

Rev. 11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and (1.)measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. 2 But (2.) the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. 3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

1.) God is telling John to MEASURE the Temple (God's holy temple) and THEM THAT WORSHIP THEREIN (the Jewish people who are the ONLY ONES allowed in the Temple/Altar). We are being told by this, WHOM the Two-witnesses have come to preach repentance unto............ONLY THE JEWS. (Do not Measure the Outer Court........The Gentiles were allowed to come unto the Outer Courts only).

2.) Do not measure the OUTER COURT is telling us the Two-witnesses PARAMETERS. They are to go unto the Jews ONLY, not unto the Gentiles, just like Jesus, the Bride/Church is already in heaven. I bet you have never once stopped to think why the temple and altar and those that worship therein is MEASURED have you? How do you MEASURE PEOPLE ? It means the Two-witnesses are PUT FORTH on this earth to call the Jews unto repentance, just like Malachi 4:5-6 says. And yes, the Anti-Christ WILL INDEED tread afoot the Holy city for 42 months, but the Two-witnesses come to call the Jews unto repentance BEFORE this 42 months begins, at the 1335. Which s 75 days before the 1260 event.

Now let me prove your last sentence is in error.

The Two-witnesses DIE and are RAISED UP, all during the 2nd Woe !!

Rev. 11:11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. 12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. 13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

So, please EXPLAIN unto me brother how they DIE at the VERY END, when it is clearly explained here that they die DURING the Second Woe (2nd Woe), and it ENDS right after they are RAISED UNTO Heaven. You are going to have to be Houdini to escape this one brother. :21:

So, they don't die in Rev. 16 do they ? You were just saying that because you knew the Vials couldn't be 3.5 days in length. Now you are BOXED IN and you have no way out brother. :noidea: :mgdetective: Professor RevMan, at your service.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

The Man of Sin does not put forth the AoD, its done at the 1290 Why is it you know better than John? He wrote the book!

According to Dan. 9:27 what ever event causes the daily sacrifices to stop is the event that divides the week into TWO EQUAL halves. So forget your 1290: that is a myth. It is 1260 days -> ABOMINATION -> 1260 days.

The Man in Linen did not lie brother. (He's Jesus). Dan. 9:27 is VAUGE but CLEAR. It states he makes an AGREEMENT for 7 years and in the middle of the week breaks those agreements AND CAUSES...........Go read it.............He CAUSES the Sacrifice and Oblation to CEASE. Remember, God had to tell Daniel about these things, BUT He could not tell him about the coming False Prophet, whereas God could inform John about the coming False Prophet. Have you ever wondered why ? The 1290 tells of the False Prophet, Dan. 9:27 tells of him vaguely also, he is the TOOL used (CAUSES) by the Anti-Christ to both stop the Jesus Worship (Sacrifice) and bring forth the Abominations. So why could John be told about the False Prophet but Daniel couldn't be informed about him? Because, if Daniel had spoken about a Coming High/Priest False Prophet, then the Jewish Pharisees/Scribes, Peoples etc. etc. would have killed every other High Priest FEARING he was the ONE TO COME, just like King Herod tried to kill baby Jesus via the Prophetic utterings. So, Daniel was not told about him, thus we get the 1290 instead, AND we see that the Dan. 9:27 passage says this prince to come CAUSES these things to come to pass.

Now what does Daniel 12:11 say? It happens at the 1290......AND you can not deny this fact brother !! :sherlock:

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

Since they flee in 12:6, and were told to flee the INSTANT they see the abomination, then the abomination will be seconds before verse 12:6.

Did you just not read this verse?

2 Thes. 2:⁴Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Look, if ANYONE other than the high priest enters the Holy of Holies - the temple has been desecrated and would have to be cleansed before any more sacrifices are done. But the Beast will not allow that. He will make the Holy of Holies his office!

So when the man of sin enters the holy of Holies, without a doubt recorded on video, those in Judea flee. And it will happen in day 1260. It is what divides the week.

Its an IMAGE placed by the High Priest. They flee 30 days BEFORE the 1260, at the 1290, just like Jesus stated. Jesus stated that it would STAND where it OUGHT NOT STAND, at the 1290 time, which is 30 days BEFORE the 1260 event.

If the High Priest is offering Meat Sacrifices then the temple was NEVER CLEANSED, it was CLEANSED because the Jews who repented (1/3) came to the Temple and Worshiped Jesus there, before this High Priest found out what was happening and became enraged.

Matt. 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

Jesus is not inferring its a man, seems like Rev. 13, he infers it is am IMAGE STANDING in the holy of holies.

Rev. 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

Daniel 12:11 says the AoD happens on the 1290, NOT the 1260, you have no answer for that fact do you? BUT I DO !!

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

if you can't get the Seals right, its a very, very, very LONG SHOT you will ever get the timing of the AoD sorted out brother. You are talking about yourself again. It needs no sorting: we KNOW from scripture the abomination divides the week: 1260 / 1260. Sorry, no 1290 in the 70th week. That is myth.

You can never get everything to FIT...........because its all in error as per the TIMING brother, mine always fits, because its CORRECT.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

So both have earthly "OFFICES" of 1260 days on earth, as THE BEAST and as the TWO-WITNESSES, I would not have said "offices" but we can go with that. And it is not 100% accurate anyway. The two witnesses get 1260 days but the Beast gets 42 months. Why not say it like John said it? We agree on this time frame, I think, but these two periods of time do not start at the same time. The witnessing will start days, perhaps weeks before the 42 months. This is also proven in Revelation: the week ends at the 7th vial, but Jesus does not return to catch the Beast until chapter 19. There will be TIME between the 7th vial and Jesus return.

1335 = The Two-witnesses.

1260 = The Beast

1290 = the False Prophets shenanigans.

The 7th Trump = the 3rd Woe. The 7th Vial is Jesus' return, he lands on the Mt. of Olives and splits it into.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

you think the Two-witnesses show up 3.5 days BEFORE the Beast and thus once they die and are raised 3.5 days later it ALL ENDS, when the 7 Vials have not even been poured out yet you still don't get it: I "got it" before you did, for you still haven't. I have written in over and over, but you miss it. I think because you imagine it is wrong so you plan your answer instead of studying what I wrote. Let's try it again.

3 1/2 days before the abomination (the man of sin entering the temple - day 1260) the two witnesses show up and begin their ministry of 1260 days. (3.5 days later - the abomination that divides the week). (Verses 11;4-11:13 don't count in chronology, so for now, skip over them.)

They will testify for their allotted 1260 days - which will take them to just 3 1/2 days before the END of the week, when they are killed. They lay dead those 3.5 days, and then are resurrected WITH ALL the Old Testament saints - at the 7th vial that ends the week. so they GOT their 1260 days.

Its not 3.5 days. That is preposterous brother, you can't have 7 Vials being poured out in 3.5 days....BESIDES, my above points make that concept NULL & VOID, the Two-witnesses are RAISED UP TO HEAVEN.........THEN the 2nd Woe ends.......Remember from above? It was such a powerful point you can't forget it I am 100 percent sure. So, the Vials must last at least 72 days, unless the 3.5 days are a part of the 1260 day ministry, which I doubt.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

3.5 days BEFORE the Beast I would say 3.5 days before the abomination or the division point of teh week: day 1260.

The Two-witnesses do not die BEFORE the AoD, man you are confused more than I thought. The 1260 days parallel each other, EXCEPT for 75 days.........1335 days BEFORE the Second Coming vs. 1260 days BEFORE the Second Coming.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

That makes absolutely no sense as per the timings brother. Because you have not understood what I write. Are you going to be of the group that moves the two witnesses to the first half of the week? Please tell me no!

I understand it completely, you are conflating everything in the book of Revelation.

Mine is SIMPLE..............Two-witnesses come to call the Jews unto repentance and thus show up 1335 days before the Second Coming of Jesus Christ ENDS ALL THESE WONDERS at the Second Coming, and thus they show up 75 days BEFORE the Beast Conquers Jerusalem, Israel and the MANY.

The Beast shows up 1260 days BEFORE the Second Coming ENDS ALL THESE WONDERS at the Second Coming.

Thus 1335 - 1260 = 75. The Two-witnesses show up 75 days before the Beast Conquers Jerusalem and they the DIE 75 days before the Beast DIES at the Second Coming via the 7th Vial.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

The AoD happens 30 days before the Anti-Christ becomes THE BEAST, This is not true, but please show us HOW you come to this idea. Then I can show you why it is error. It is true, he does not become the beast at the moment He declares to be god - the moment of the abomination. It will be the 7th trumpet marking the abomination that will send Michael to go to war with Satan. I don't think it will take long. It will be Satan possessing the man of sin that will cause Him to turn BEAST. So very shortly after the war, John saw the Beast rising.

READ Daniel 12:11 man !! I posted it already.

Daniel 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

The 7th Trump has ZERO to do with the AoD. My goodness !! The AoD happens before any Trumps are blown (30 days BEFORE).

Trumpet = 1260 start.........AoD = 1290 READ Dan. 12:11 ABOVE.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

the AoD is the False Prophet (Jewish High Priest) placing the IMAGE of the Beast in the Temple. Please show us where the FP does the abomination. I have never seen that scripture. the REAL AoD will be the man of sin entered the most holy place in the temple - marked by the 7th trumpet. Mind you, if you can prove this by scripture, I will change my mind.

As I explained ABOVE Daniel was not told about the False Prophet for a specific reason, but John was. The AoD is shown by Jesus in Matt. 24:15 to be that which STANDS WHERE IT OUGHT NOT..........In Daniel 12:11 the Man in Linen (Jesus) tells us it happens at the 1290 event, which happens 30 days BEFORE the 1260 Conquering of Jerusalem. NOW.......Read Rev. 13, who places the IMAGE of the Beast in the Temple, the Anti-Christ or FALSE PROPHET ? Its the False Prophet.

We have an EXACT LIKENESS of these two TYPES. This that I stumbled upon while studying all the Kings of Daniel 11, in my HUGE THREAD/Blog on Daniel 11 has led me down this whole path, I came to understand who the TYPE False Prophet was in History. He was alive at the exact same time as Antiochus.

His name is Jason (real name Yeshua, of course) he bribed Antiochus into naming him the High Priest, thereby having his own brother, Onias III, a pious High Priest killed, and he thus tried to Hellenize the Jews (force them to worship Greek gods and to take on Greek culture) thereby leading to the Maccabean Revolt!! Thus he and and Antiochus, living at the SAME TIME, were the DYNAMIC DUE TYPE, one a man that desired to be worshiped as god, the other a TRAITOR High Priest !!

The AoD happens 30 days before the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem at the 1260. You see, when you do not understand these things in full, NOTHING FITS. All of my understandings FIT, because the truth always prevails in the end brother.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

Two-Witnesses show u 3.5 days before The Beast.......... Close but not cigar: they show us just before the man of sin enters the temple and abominates. @ (trademark: I invented a word)

You can't be reading, I am pointing out something close to what YOU BELIVE, not what I believe, to show you WHY it can't be 3.5 days.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

..The Beast Conquers Jerusalem/Israel/MANY. WHEN? They will still be fighting in Jerusalem at the end of the week! His first goal will be to deceive the WORLD. It will not be until late in the week when the devil sends out the demons to gather the nations.

Zechariah 14:1-2 = the Day of the Lord..........Zechariah 14:3-4 and further is Jesus landing on the Mt. of Olives, and splitting it into. You not knowing this astounds me brother. Read Daniel 11:40-443, WHO does the Anti-Christ defeat? Israel, other Countries around Israel and ALL of North Africa which = THE MANY. He is not allowed to Conquer the Petra/Bozrah areal. LOL.........Its obvious.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

So, they are on the scene according to you at the 1263.5 Mark.........The Beast of course shows up at the 1260 Mark. I knew you did not understand. They show up 3.5 days before the division point: 1260 / 1260 so they would show up on day 1256.5 so 3.5 days out of their 1260 days will be in the first half. Then 1256.5 days will be taken out of the LAST 1260 days.

You are right, NOTHING about your TIMING is CORRECT.

They show up at the 1335, I understand you do not get anything about the timings brother. You are all over the place tbh.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

If the Two-witnesses die 3.5 days before they ARISE It is truth. They die just 3.5 days before the 7th vial that ends the week.

WRONG..........As I show ABOVE, they die during the 2nd Woe.........way before the 7th Vial. REMEMBER THIS?

Rev. 11:14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

They DIE.........they then are RAISED..........then the 2nd Woe ENDS. :shofar: COME UP HERE !!

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

that means that 3.5 days later, according to the 1260 day rule of the Beast (that's his LIMIT) the Beast must DIE and be cast into hell by Jesus. You MISSED something along the way: the Beast's 42 months START LAST - so they END LAST.

The 42 months of trampling and the 1260 days of testifying start before the midpoint so end before the end of the week.
The 1260 days of fleeing and the 3.5 years of protection will end at the 7th vial that ends the week.
The 42 months of authority keeps right on happened through the events of chapters 17, 18 and most of 19 - but they end when Jesus descends. Here is where the 1290 days MIGHT come into play: the marriage and supper in heaven may just take 30 days before Jesus descends. the 1290th day may be His return. This argument fails.

I missed NOTHING, I say it starts 75 days AFTER the Two-witnesses, you say only 3.5 days after. Which means ALL 7 VIALS have to come to pass in 3.5 days............BUT even that does not ring true because you MISCALCULATED when the 3.5 days ends. It ENDS during the 2nd Woe, SEE ABOVE, where I BLOW THE SHOFAR. Come up here happens BEFORE the 7th Trump Sounds, and thus the 3rd Woe comes !!

I weave it all together like Sherlock Holmes don't I? :mgdetective:

NO.........the 42 Months can only be 42 months, else its more trampling than 42 months.

The 1290 days is EXACTLY what I referenced it is. Its not a "MIGHT BE" brother.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

There is no IFFS, ANDS or MAYBES Agreed! See, there IS something we agree on. What you missed is that there is TIME between the 126o days countdown of fleeing and the 42 months countdown of authority. You know, it is just might be possible the 42 months of authority will not equal 1260 days; it may be a day or two off. Therefore it would be wise to count the authority as 42 months - the way John did

The Fleeing starts on the 1290, not the 1260. Once the 1260 comes there is just 1260 days left. You have to move things around because when you get WRONG PEICES of a puzzle in WRONG PLACES the other pieces will not fit either. My puzzle has 100,000 pieces and 999,999 are already in place.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

because BOTH have ONLY 1260 days via their EARTJLY OFFICES. Yes, but one starts AFTER the other and will END after the other.
This argument fails.

You got that right and still don't understand that the Two-witnesses show up 75 days before the Beast and die 75 days before he dies.

On 9/23/2020 at 3:52 PM, iamlamad said:

the Beasts timeline that runs from the 1260 Conquering of Jerusalem until Jesus returns. You still have to prove this conquering by scripture.

As it turns out, every argument of yours fails under scrutiny.

Its called not being able to comprehend these things brother. Your timing on everything is off kilter, so, your arguments are thus not in line with the scriptures, and how could they be if your timing is off kilter?

Edited September 28, 2020 by Revelation Man

iamlamad · September 24, 2020

21 minutes ago, Revelation Man said:

Rev. 11 is a Parenthetical Citation Chapter IN FULL, its about the Two-witnesses Ministry on earth. Nothing else in reality, though it covers other things like Woe #2 and Woe #7 which is the 7th Trump, AFTER the Two-witnesses DIE, the 7th Trump blows and bring VICTORY to Jesus via the 7 VIALS of Judgment that get poured out which takes 75 days to come to pass, thus the Two-witnesses' 1260 days of Ministry AND the 7th Trump/3rd Woe which THEY PRAY DOWN, is shown in Rev. 11 as being a part of their Ministry because THEY PRAYED IT DOWN, thus the Rev. 11 chapter lasts 1335 days, even though they die on the 1260th day of their Ministry on earth.

Rev. 11 is a Parenthetical Citation Chapter IN FULL, Who said? You? Nearly all of the posts here is imagination, not scripture at all. Anyone can insert a parenthesis anywhere and Say it is right. Now let's use a little logic:

If you put the entire chapter into a parenthesis (some even included chapter 10) then you take the 42 month countdown, and the 1260 days countdown OUT OF JOHN'S chronology. In other words, they can start anywhere. That is just more imagination. If one uses LOGIC they put parentheses where JOHN put the parentheses. We can figure that out by putting in parenthesis ONLY what does not fit in John's Chronology. (Those that don't believe in John's chronology, are already off.)

11:1: the man of sin moves to Jerusalem with His army: just days before he is to enter the temple. (He has to BE in Jerusalem to enter the temple in Jerusalem.) This fits perfectly with John's chronology, since he is just before the midpoint division.
11:2 He arrives with a gentile army who will trample the city for 42 months. This is a countdown that must stay IN John's chronology. It cannot be inside a parenthesis. It must stay OUT of any parenthesis.
11:3 The two witnesses just appear: they were sent down from heaven. They start a countdown of 1260 days. That too must stay outside of any parenthesis. It is a part of John's chronology.
11:4 This starts a discussion about the Two Witnesses that has no information regarding chronology. This then can be INSIDE a parenthesis. That is why I start a parenthesis here. It leaves the two chapter 11 coundowns in and as a part of John's chronology.

11:4-11:13 There is nothing in these verses that must remain outside a parenthesis so as to be a part of John's chronology. Therefore they are put INSIDE a parenthesis. What is inside has NO BEARING on chronology. It could be for any time.

11:14: The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly. (This pertains to chronology so must stay out of any parenthesis. It has timing information that relates to chronology. It is TIME for the 7th trumpet / third woe.

11:15 the 7th trumpet sounds AS the man of sin enters the temple. It is a marker.

(When God spoke to me, He said "You could find that exact midpoint clearly marked." I was in the spirit, but my spirit man asked Him: "how would I find that." He answered: "Every time I mentioned an event that would go from the midpoint to the end of the week, I always included the 3 1/2 year period of time. When you find the mentions of the 3 1/2 years, you will be very close to the exact midpoint.")

The 7th trumpet is a "marker" for the division point of the 70th week: at the 120 days mark. The week is divided into two equal parts of 1260 days each.

I have only covered your first sentence!

Edited September 24, 2020 by iamlamad

iamlamad · September 24, 2020

22 minutes ago, Revelation Man said:

Rev. 11 is a Parenthetical Citation Chapter IN FULL, its about the Two-witnesses Ministry on earth. Nothing else in reality, though it covers other things like Woe #2 and Woe #7 which is the 7th Trump, AFTER the Two-witnesses DIE, the 7th Trump blows and bring VICTORY to Jesus via the 7 VIALS of Judgment that get poured out which takes 75 days to come to pass, thus the Two-witnesses' 1260 days of Ministry AND the 7th Trump/3rd Woe which THEY PRAY DOWN, is shown in Rev. 11 as being a part of their Ministry because THEY PRAYED IT DOWN, thus the Rev. 11 chapter lasts 1335 days, even though they die on the 1260th day of their Ministry on earth.

Woe #2 and Woe #7 Change the 7 to a 3.

AFTER the Two-witnesses DIE, the 7th Trump blows You are already mistaken, substituing imagination for good exegesis.

If you were right, then the 7th trumpet would sound at the end of the week, and the 1260 days of fleeing, the time, times, and half of time of protection, and the 42 months of the Beast would start a the end of the week. This of course cannot be the truth. The 1260 days of testifying cannot possibly play out in the timing of chapter 11. That is why John put these verses in a parenthesis. (If you put the whole chapter in a parenthesis, then the entire chapter has a Chronology and you have worse problems.) It only APPEARS that they die before the 7th trumpet. But what they do is inside a parenthesis without any bearing on chronology. Use logic here: their 1260 days BEGINS just before the midpoint, and they must testify for half the week, or 1260 days: therefore, they must END their testimony just before the END of the week.

They BEGIN to testify just before the MIDPOINT, they testify for 1260 days; that takes them to just before the END of the week.
But just as they suddenly appear in John's narrative, just before the midpoint, John takes the readers down a side trail - the last half of the week as a parenthesis - so as not to ruin his chronology.

(For the readers: do you remember diagramming sentences? A diagonal line would be drawn off the main sentence line, and then a line parallel would be added; for example, for a prepositional phrase. I like to call it a side journey: it is the last half of the week as a parallel to John's main timeline. In fact, after chapter 13, there are FIVE (5) parallel countdowns all taking place at the same time: each mention of the last 3 1/2 years running parallel to each other.)

With the parenthesis ended, then the 7th trumpet marks the division point in the week - as proven by those fleeing just seconds after, as shown in 12:6.

Note carefully: all happen at different times as a staggered starting of runners on a round track:

11:2 the 42 month countdown of trampling begins
11:3 The 1260 day countdown of witnessing begins
Midpoint marked by the 7th trumpet
12:6 the 1260 days of fleeing countdown begins
12:14 the time, times and half of time countdown of protection begins.

13:5 the 42 months of Authority countdown begins

All start very near the midpoint of the week.

The truth is, AFTER the Two-witnesses DIE, 3.5 days later the 7th vial is poured out

which takes 75 days to come to pass Unless this can be proven by scripture, it is just more MYTH.

the Two-witnesses' 1260 days of Ministry AND the 7th Trump/3rd Woe which THEY PRAY DOWN This is just more imagination. They begin only begin 3.5 days before the 7th trumpet.

thus the Rev. 11 chapter lasts 1335 days, even though they die on the 1260th day of their Ministry on earth. Total myth: cannot be proven by scripture.

iamlamad · September 24, 2020

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

Rev. 11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and (1.)measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. 2 But (2.) the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. 3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

1.) God is telling John to MEASURE the Temple (God's holy temple) and THEM THAT WORSHIP THEREIN (the Jewish people who are the ONLY ONES allowed in the Temple//Altar). We are being told by this, WHOM the Two-witnesses have come to preach repentance unto ONLY THE JEWS. (Do not Measure the Outer Court........The Gentiles were allowed to come unto the Outer Courts only.

2.) Do not measure the OUTER COURT is telling us the Two-witnesses PARAMETERS. They are to go unto the Jews ONLY, not unto the Gentiles, just like Jesus, the Bride/Church is already in heaven. I bet you have never once stopped to think why the temple and altar and those tat worship therein is MEASURED have you? How do you MEASURE PEOPLE ? It means the Two-witnesses are PPUT FORTH on this earth to call the Jews unto repentance, just like Malachi 4:5-6 says. And yes, the Anti-Christ WILL INDEED tread afoot the Holy city for 42 months, but the Two-witnesses come to call the Jews unto repentance BEFORE this 42 months begins, at the 1335. Which s 75 days before the 1260 event.

Now let me prove your last sentence is in error.

The Two-witnesses DIE and are RAISED UP, all during the 2nd Woe !!

Rev. 11:11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. 12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. 13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

So, please EXPLAIN unto me brother how they DIE at the VERY END, when it is clearly explained here that they die DURING the Second Woe (2nd Woe), and it ENDS right after they are RAISED UNTO Heaven. You are going to have to be Houdini to escape this one brother.

So, they don't die in Rev. 16 do they ? You were just saying that because you knew the Vials couldn't be 3.5 days. Now you are BOXED IN and you have no way out brother. Professor RevMan, at your service.

How many times am I going to have to go over this before you GET it? First, lets start at the beginning: Gen. 1:1......no, kidding. Do you understand a parenthesis?

John covered the seals one after another: first he opened one of the seals, then he opened the second, then the third, then the fourth, then the fifth, (the first seal was the church sent out, the second, third and fourth was the devil trying to stop teh church, and the fifth was the martyrs of the church age.) then the 6th, then went into an intermission.

With a parenthesis, the text outside the parenthesis should make good sense with the parenthesis removed. The text inside a parenthesis will not have to follow the chronology outside - and usually does not.

So let's read chapter 11 with the parenthesis in a different font color. John's Chronology will be the normal font color.

TIMING in John's narrative: the week started with the 7th seal, and the first 6 trumpets have sounded, during the first half of the 70th week. It is just a few days before the abomination division point of 1260 <-|-> 1260.

1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. (The new Jewish temple is finished. john is told to measure it.)

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. (What happens here: why do the gentiles begin here to trample the city? Why weren't they here to trample the city the week before? I did not hear words, but I believe He told me: the man of sin arrives in Jerusalem with a gentile army. he is coming to make Jerusalem his home for the next 3.5 years. I believe he arrives just days before the abomination that will divide the week into two equal halves according to Dan. 9:27.)

3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. (Two witnesses suddenly SHOW UP and begin testifying. it is now just 3 1/2 days before the abomination that divides the week. In 3.5 days, the week will be divided.

4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

verses 5 through 12 (Their story is written here but as a parenthesis. It really will take place from the midpoint to the end of the week: chapter 11 to chapter 16. )

13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly. (an acknowledgement and announcement)

15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. (The man of sin just entered the temple - the Holy of Holies - and declared to the world (via video camera's) that HE - the man of sin -- is the god of the Jews and off the world. The 7th trumpet marks that time in heaven. This is proven because seconds later those Jews living in Judea begin to flee. So the sacrifices stop, and the week is divided: 1260 |1260.

Seconds later the woman (subset living in Judea) begin to flee. (12:6)
As they are fleeing, they are supernaturally protected and will be for 3 1/2 years. It is the midpoint of the week, so 1260 days to go.

There is war in heaven. Satan is cast down. (Rev. 12) (The city is being trampled, and the Two witnesses are testifying. The woman is fleeing and being protected. )

The Beast is seen rising (Rev. 13.) The Beast begins his 42 months. (The city is being trampled, and the Two witnesses are testifying. The woman is fleeing and being protected. And now the Beast is beasting for 42 months.)

The False Prophet shows up, tells the Beast they need an image and a mark. They get started. (Chapter 13)

God sends three angels with three message to everyone on earth in their own language (Rev. 14)
1. Worship God.
2. Babylon is falling is falling (prophecy)
3. Don't take the mark.
(The city is being trampled, and the Two witnesses are testifying. The woman is fleeing and being protected. And now the Beast is beasting [doing what Beasts do].)

The Image is built, the mark is created, and now they start to be enforced. (end of chapter 14) (The city is being trampled, and the Two witnesses are testifying. The woman is fleeing and being protected. And now the Beast is beasting for 42 months.)

Days of GT begin; the beheaded JUST NOW begin showing up in heaven. (Rev. 15) (The city is being trampled, and the Two witnesses are testifying. The woman is fleeing and being protected. And now the Beast is beasting [doing what Beasts do].)

Days of GT drag on.

Finally God has had enough and sends the seven angels with the plagues and vials. (The city is being trampled, and the Two witnesses are testifying. The woman is fleeing and being protected. And now the Beast is beasting [doing what Beasts do].)

The first 6 vials are poured out, stopping the days of GT. (Rev. 16) (The city is being trampled, and the Two witnesses are testifying. The woman is fleeing and being protected. And now the Beast is beasting [doing what Beasts do].)

The two witnesses are killed, their 1260 days are up. (it is just 3.5 days to the end of the week.) The trampling continues, the fleeing are still fleeing, the protected are still protected, and the 42 months of Authority continues.)

The 7th vial is poured out ending the week. the cities of the world fall. Babylon is destroyed. (The city quits being trampled: the army moves out to the valley for batttle. The Two witnesses rise with all the rest of the Old Testament saints: Daniel will stand in His lot TODAY. It is resurrection day for those beheaded, and for the OT Saints.) (The fleeing still flee, and are protected) and the 42 months of authority continue, but are very close to ending.

JESUS RETURNS! Rev. 19. All five parallel countdowns are done.

Do you see how the Two witnesses continue right on past the 7th trumpet, past the first 6 vials, and all the way almost to the end of the week. This is because their death is written INSIDE a Parenthesis. Only their arrival is outside the parenthesis, showing us that they SHOW UP just before the midpoint.

the Two-witnesses come to call the Jews unto repentance BEFORE this 42 months begins, at the 1335. Which s 75 days before the 1260 event. Yes, they show up just 3.5 DAYS before the 42 months of authority begins. They show up JUST AFTER the 42 months of trampling. If you doubt me, read above again. The 1335 is MYTH.

at the 1335. Which s 75 days before the 1260 event. Look, all these times, the 1260's, the 42's, the 3.5 years, ALL are times that START at the midpoint of the week and go to the end of the week. It is exactly the same with the the 1290 and the 1335: The 1290 extends past the 1260th day 30 more days to a time after the week has ended. Same with the 1335, or it is farther past the week. These numbers have nothing to do with inside the week. You are using them backwards.

Your 75 days theory is myth, plain and simple.

The Two-witnesses DIE and are RAISED UP, all during the 2nd Woe !! No, you don't understand a parenthesis. Sorry to say.

By the way, the 2nd woe is the killing of 1/3 of earth's population. Do you imagine the final death is seconds before the 7th trumpet? NO one else thinks this way! The second woe STARTS: 1/3 are killed, then it ENDS. The killing STOPS. Before chapter 11. So now, they don't even SHOW UP during the second woe, because it does not last until the 3rd woe. It starts - then it ends, and then it is time for the 3rd woe. The ONLY thing that happens during the 2nd woe is the 1/3 killed. When that number is reached, the 2nd woe ENDS.

Rev. 11:11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them WHEN? Since they starts just before the midpoint, and must testify for half the week, their death is very near the END of the week. Their resurrection IS the end of the week. You really must learn about parentheses.

I hope you realize that ALL FIVE countdowns in days, months and years, are for the LAST HALF of the week.

please EXPLAIN unto me brother how they DIE at the VERY END, when it is clearly explained here that they die DURING the Second Woe (2nd Woe), and it ENDS right after they are RAISED UNTO Heaven. You are going to have to be Houdini to escape this one brother. It is simple, do some studying on parentheses. Read the above over and over until the light comes on. It is not rocket science, it is only a parenthesis. Again, what is INSIDE a parenthesis does not add to the chronology outside the parenthesis. It is a time all of its own.

Tiger Woods was only 2 under par on the 10th hole, and most of the other players was ahead of him at this point, (he was 5 under on the 10th hole the year before) but he got 4 under par on the 11th hole and one the game.

What is inside the parenthesis has no bearing whatsoever on the rest of the sentence. It is just added information.

Tiger Woods was only 2 under par on the 10th hole, (but he was well under par on the rest of the holes and won the game) because he ended up in a sand trap.

Notice in the sentences the time is at the 10th hole, but inside the parenthesis, he already won. Before the parenthesis, at the 10th hole, and after the parenthesis STILL on the 10th hole.

It is the same with the Two Witnesses' parenthesis: the "rest of the story" of them was written inside the parenthesis. But at the end of the parenthesis, time is where the parenthesis started: they just arrived and started their testimony.

I really do believe you can get this: I have faith in you! Perhaps you hated English in school! ;-) So no Houdini; I just know English very well.

So, they don't die in Rev. 16 do they ? Yes, OF COURSE they do: they must testify for 1260 days. They began JUST before the midpoint. Therefore their testimony MUST cover most of the last half of the week. (their death was told INSIDE a parenthesis. The 7th trumpet is MIDPOINT. The fleeing at 12:6 is MIDPOINT. Their 1260 days CANNOT possibly play out in chapter 11, else everything after chapter 11 would be after the week!

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