Jesus' marraige feast parable proves a post trib rapture!

[iamlamad]

5 minutes ago, The Light said:

You have quite an imagination.

Question: how could "tribulation" get any greater for a martyr? Can they be killed twice? Therefore, not imagination, only logic.

There is tribulation - the devil hates us becaues he hated Jesus.

 

John 16:33  These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

There is great tribulation  - for the entire church age.

Rev. 7: 14  And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of [the] great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

There is great tribulation promised to the harlot (Rev. 2) in the early church if she did not repent

Rev. 2:²² Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

There will be "days" of "great tribulation" that Jesus spoke of - greater than ANY OTHER.

Matthew 24: 

 

²¹ For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

²² And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Oh ye of little faith! Scripture, not imagination. 

Edited September 26, 2020 by iamlamad

[JohnR7]

16 minutes ago, The Light said:

What passage are you referring to?

Oh, ok I was quoting your quote of Moby

Isaiah 34:8 For Jehovah has a day of vengeance, the year of recompense for the cause of Zion.

Isaiah 61:2 to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor, the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn;

Isaiah 63:4 For the day of vengeance was in my heart, the year of my redeemed is come.

[JohnR7]

4 hours ago, Moby said:

Actually Jesus is referring to a certain portion of the NT church as "friends"

I do think there are lots of people in the church that are saved but they do not represent God. The remnant of those who serve God could be as small as 10% of the people. They are willing to pay the price in sanctification and holiness. 

[The Light]

5 hours ago, Moby said:

Thank you Light but I must give credit to this link where that section was copied out of:

https://sumofthyword.com/2016/10/04/the-rapture-of-the-church-is-after-the-tribulation/

 

Got to say that the one year of wrath was a brilliant find. I'm going to have to get a new understanding of Dan 12 where it appears that there are 3.5 years after the resurrection of many. That cannot be the case.

However, it also cleared up something that I could not get a handle on. First let be say that there are lots of things that in the link that are credible. There is an understanding that there will be a rapture just before the day of the Lord. That is the gathering from heaven and earth. What is not understood is that the bride, the Church will be in heaven before the 70th week of Daniel begins. When the groom comes for the bride in a day she does not know, she is taken to a place in the fathers house that has been prepared for her. This is all Jewish custom and is exactly what Jesus is talking about. After the marriage, there is 7 days of feasting. These are the 7 years that the Church is in heaven. Then on earth part of Israel can see (many in the twelve tribes across the earth), as the fullness of the Gentiles will have come in.

What the one year clarifies for me is I was wondering what would happen in heaven if there were 3.5 years of wrath. it did not make sense to me. Since there is only one year of wrath, it all makes sense. Jesus comes for his bride(the Church) before the 7 years. At the end of the 7 years, there is another rapture event. Those that believe among the 12 tribes will be caught up to heaven to meet the Lord, just as the father came out to meet the prodigal son. The father ran out to meet the son and threw a robe on him and threw him a feast. That is what is happening in heaven during the 1 year of Gods wrath. It is the feast of the prodigal son.

[Moby]

17 hours ago, The Light said:

Got to say that the one year of wrath was a brilliant find. I'm going to have to get a new understanding of Dan 12 where it appears that there are 3.5 years after the resurrection of many. That cannot be the case.

However, it also cleared up something that I could not get a handle on. First let be say that there are lots of things that in the link that are credible. There is an understanding that there will be a rapture just before the day of the Lord. That is the gathering from heaven and earth. What is not understood is that the bride, the Church will be in heaven before the 70th week of Daniel begins. When the groom comes for the bride in a day she does not know, she is taken to a place in the fathers house that has been prepared for her. This is all Jewish custom and is exactly what Jesus is talking about. After the marriage, there is 7 days of feasting. These are the 7 years that the Church is in heaven. Then on earth part of Israel can see (many in the twelve tribes across the earth), as the fullness of the Gentiles will have come in.

What the one year clarifies for me is I was wondering what would happen in heaven if there were 3.5 years of wrath. it did not make sense to me. Since there is only one year of wrath, it all makes sense. Jesus comes for his bride(the Church) before the 7 years. At the end of the 7 years, there is another rapture event. Those that believe among the 12 tribes will be caught up to heaven to meet the Lord, just as the father came out to meet the prodigal son. The father ran out to meet the son and threw a robe on him and threw him a feast. That is what is happening in heaven during the 1 year of Gods wrath. It is the feast of the prodigal son.

Please show me the church in America that resembles either one of these passages:

Acts 2:42-47  And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' teaching and fellowship, in the breaking of bread and the prayers.  (43)  And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done through the apostles.  (44)  And all that believed were together, and had all things common;  (45)  and they sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all, according as any man had need.  (46)  And day by day, continuing stedfastly with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread at home, they took their food with gladness and singleness of heart,  (47)  praising God, and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to them day by day those that were saved.

Acts 4:31-37  And when they had prayed, the place was shaken wherein they were gathered together; and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and they spake the word of God with boldness.  (32)  And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and soul: and not one of them said that aught of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.  (33)  And with great power gave the apostles their witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.  (34)  For neither was there among them any that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,  (35)  and laid them at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto each, according as any one had need.  (36)  And Joseph, who by the apostles was surnamed Barnabas (which is, being interpreted, Son of exhortation), a Levite, a man of Cyprus by race,  (37)  having a field, sold it, and brought the money and laid it at the apostles' feet.

That was the church set up by the bride who walked with Jesus for 3.5 years:

John 3:29  He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, that standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is made full.

Those 120 Holy Spirit filled saints in Acts chapter 2 thru 4 understood what Jesus required for His bride as righteous acts of the saints:

Revelation 19:7-8  Let us rejoice and be exceeding glad, and let us give the glory unto him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.  (8)  And it was given unto her that she should array herself in fine linen, bright and pure: for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

This passage is a much better description of most of the church in America:

Revelation 3:15-17  I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.  (16)  So because thou art lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spew thee out of my mouth.  (17)  Because thou sayest, I am rich, and have gotten riches, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art the wretched one and miserable and poor and blind and naked:

According to the Holy Spirit, who spoke through Paul, the church was to "ALL speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind" but this forum clearly proves that is not even close to true:

1 Corinthians 1:10  Now I beseech you, brethren, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

That should tell any honest Christian that most of the church is NOT listening to the Holy Spirit who ONLY teaches 100% unleavened truth:

John 14:26  But the Comforter, even the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said unto you.

Paul makes it very clear that there is a lot more involved in becoming a "worthy" Christian than most pastors teach:

2 Thessalonians 1:1-12  Paul, and Silvanus, and Timothy, unto the church of the Thessalonians in God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ;  (2)  Grace to you and peace from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.  (3)  We are bound to give thanks to God always to you, brethren, even as it is meet, for that your faith growth exceedingly, and the love of each one of you all toward one another aboundeth;  (4)  so that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and in the afflictions which ye endure;  (5)  which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God; to the end that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:  (6)  if so be that it is a righteous thing with God to recompense affliction to them that afflict you,  (7)  and to you that are afflicted rest with us, at the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven with the angels of his power in flaming fire,  (8)  rendering vengeance to them that know not God, and to them that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus:  (9)  who shall suffer punishment, even eternal destruction from the face of the Lord and from the glory of his might,  (10)  when he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be marvelled at in all them that believed (because our testimony unto you was believed) in that day.  (11)  To which end we also pray always for you, that our God may count you worthy of your calling, and fulfil every desire of goodness and every work of faith, with power;  (12)  that the name of our Lord Jesus may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Please tell me if you think the bride should look a lot more like Paul who told the church to imitate him as he imitated Christ:

1 Corinthians 4:16  I beseech you therefore, be ye imitators of me.

1 Corinthians 11:1  Be ye imitators of me, even as I also am of Christ.

Hebrews 6:12  that ye be not sluggish, but imitators of them who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

2 Thessalonians 3:7  For yourselves know how ye ought to imitate us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you;

Or does the church look a lot more like this:

2 Timothy 3:1-17  But know this, that in the last days grievous times shall come.  (2)  For men shall be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, railers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,  (3)  without natural affection, implacable, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, no lovers of good,  (4)  traitors, headstrong, puffed up, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God;  (5)  holding a form of godliness, but having denied the power thereof: from these also turn away.  (6)  For of these are they that creep into houses, and take captive silly women laden with sins, led away by divers lusts,  (7)  ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.  (8)  And even as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also withstand the truth; men corrupted in mind, reprobate concerning the faith.  (9)  But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be evident unto all men, as theirs also came to be.  (10)  But thou didst follow my teaching, conduct, purpose, faith, longsuffering, love, patience,  (11)  persecutions, sufferings; what things befell me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: and out of them all the Lord delivered me.  (12)  Yea, and all that would live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.  (13)  But evil men and impostors shall wax worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived.  (14)  But abide thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;  (15)  and that from a babe thou hast known the sacred writings which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.  (16)  Every scripture inspired of God is also profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for instruction which is in righteousness:  (17)  that the man of God may be complete, furnished completely unto every good work.

The whole purpose for tribulation(persecution) is produce the same righteousness in our mortal flesh that manifested in Christ:

1 John 2:6  he that saith he abideth in him ought himself also to walk even as he walked.

2 Corinthians 4:10-11  always bearing about in the body the dying of Jesus, that the life also of Jesus may be manifested in our body.  (11)  For we who live are always delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus may be manifested in our mortal flesh.

Please notice that the bride was finally ready by the end of the book of Revelation, not the beginning:

Revelation 19:7-8  Let us rejoice and be exceeding glad, and let us give the glory unto him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.  (8)  And it was given unto her that she should array herself in fine linen, bright and pure: for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

[The Light]

33 minutes ago, Moby said:

Please show me the church in America that resembles either one of these passages:

Acts 2:42-47  And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' teaching and fellowship, in the breaking of bread and the prayers.  (43)  And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done through the apostles.  (44)  And all that believed were together, and had all things common;  (45)  and they sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all, according as any man had need.  (46)  And day by day, continuing stedfastly with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread at home, they took their food with gladness and singleness of heart,  (47)  praising God, and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to them day by day those that were saved.

Acts 4:31-37  And when they had prayed, the place was shaken wherein they were gathered together; and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and they spake the word of God with boldness.  (32)  And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and soul: and not one of them said that aught of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.  (33)  And with great power gave the apostles their witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.  (34)  For neither was there among them any that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,  (35)  and laid them at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto each, according as any one had need.  (36)  And Joseph, who by the apostles was surnamed Barnabas (which is, being interpreted, Son of exhortation), a Levite, a man of Cyprus by race,  (37)  having a field, sold it, and brought the money and laid it at the apostles' feet.

That was the church set up by the bride who walked with Jesus for 3.5 years:

John 3:29  He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, that standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is made full.

Those 120 Holy Spirit filled saints in Acts chapter 2 thru 4 understood what Jesus required for His bride as righteous acts of the saints:

Revelation 19:7-8  Let us rejoice and be exceeding glad, and let us give the glory unto him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.  (8)  And it was given unto her that she should array herself in fine linen, bright and pure: for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

This passage is a much better description of most of the church in America:

Revelation 3:15-17  I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.  (16)  So because thou art lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spew thee out of my mouth.  (17)  Because thou sayest, I am rich, and have gotten riches, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art the wretched one and miserable and poor and blind and naked:

According to the Holy Spirit, who spoke through Paul, the church was to "ALL speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind" but this forum clearly proves that is not even close to true:

1 Corinthians 1:10  Now I beseech you, brethren, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

That should tell any honest Christian that most of the church is NOT listening to the Holy Spirit who ONLY teaches 100% unleavened truth:

John 14:26  But the Comforter, even the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said unto you.

Paul makes it very clear that there is a lot more involved in becoming a "worthy" Christian than most pastors teach:

2 Thessalonians 1:1-12  Paul, and Silvanus, and Timothy, unto the church of the Thessalonians in God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ;  (2)  Grace to you and peace from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.  (3)  We are bound to give thanks to God always to you, brethren, even as it is meet, for that your faith growth exceedingly, and the love of each one of you all toward one another aboundeth;  (4)  so that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and in the afflictions which ye endure;  (5)  which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God; to the end that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:  (6)  if so be that it is a righteous thing with God to recompense affliction to them that afflict you,  (7)  and to you that are afflicted rest with us, at the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven with the angels of his power in flaming fire,  (8)  rendering vengeance to them that know not God, and to them that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus:  (9)  who shall suffer punishment, even eternal destruction from the face of the Lord and from the glory of his might,  (10)  when he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be marvelled at in all them that believed (because our testimony unto you was believed) in that day.  (11)  To which end we also pray always for you, that our God may count you worthy of your calling, and fulfil every desire of goodness and every work of faith, with power;  (12)  that the name of our Lord Jesus may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Please tell me if you think the bride should look a lot more like Paul who told the church to imitate him as he imitated Christ:

1 Corinthians 4:16  I beseech you therefore, be ye imitators of me.

1 Corinthians 11:1  Be ye imitators of me, even as I also am of Christ.

Hebrews 6:12  that ye be not sluggish, but imitators of them who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

2 Thessalonians 3:7  For yourselves know how ye ought to imitate us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you;

The Church will not be perfect and man is not perfect. The Church is perfect through the blood of Christ who paid the price for our sin.

 

33 minutes ago, Moby said:

Or does the church look a lot more like this:

2 Timothy 3:1-17  But know this, that in the last days grievous times shall come.  (2)  For men shall be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, railers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,  (3)  without natural affection, implacable, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, no lovers of good,  (4)  traitors, headstrong, puffed up, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God;  (5)  holding a form of godliness, but having denied the power thereof: from these also turn away.  (6)  For of these are they that creep into houses, and take captive silly women laden with sins, led away by divers lusts,  (7)  ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.  (8)  And even as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also withstand the truth; men corrupted in mind, reprobate concerning the faith.  (9)  But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be evident unto all men, as theirs also came to be.  (10)  But thou didst follow my teaching, conduct, purpose, faith, longsuffering, love, patience,  (11)  persecutions, sufferings; what things befell me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: and out of them all the Lord delivered me.  (12)  Yea, and all that would live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.  (13)  But evil men and impostors shall wax worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived.  (14)  But abide thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;  (15)  and that from a babe thou hast known the sacred writings which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.  (16)  Every scripture inspired of God is also profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for instruction which is in righteousness:  (17)  that the man of God may be complete, furnished completely unto every good work.

This looks more like the world to me. The Church is instructed what to do: From such, turn away.

 

33 minutes ago, Moby said:

 

The whole purpose for tribulation(persecution) is produce the same righteousness in our mortal flesh that manifested in Christ:

1 John 2:6  he that saith he abideth in him ought himself also to walk even as he walked.

2 Corinthians 4:10-11  always bearing about in the body the dying of Jesus, that the life also of Jesus may be manifested in our body.  (11)  For we who live are always delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus may be manifested in our mortal flesh.

You do not have to go through "the tribulation" to produce righteousness. Everyone goes through tribulation in their life. I don't think you are saying that all that have died without going through "the tribulation" are unworthy. We all have tribulation.

 

33 minutes ago, Moby said:

Please notice that the bride was finally ready by the end of the book of Revelation, not the beginning:

Revelation 19:7-8  Let us rejoice and be exceeding glad, and let us give the glory unto him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.  (8)  And it was given unto her that she should array herself in fine linen, bright and pure: for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

That is a new vision. So where are we in the Bible when this marriage supper takes place.

Right after this event.

Rev 14

¹⁴ And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

¹⁵ And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

¹⁶ And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

¹⁷ And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

¹⁸ And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

¹⁹ And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

This is the gathering from heaven and earth just before the wrath of God begins. This event puts us back in the sixth seal, just prior to the wrath of God.

Rev 6

¹⁷ For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

The fig tree has two harvests. Do you not think that there will be a marriage supper for the 1st harvest?

Jacob worked 7 years for Rachael but was given Leah instead. There was a marriage feast. He had to work 7 more years to get his bride Rachael.

 

 

[WilliamL]

On 9/22/2020 at 12:48 PM, iamlamad said:

The Greek word behind "is come" is also used in these verses: It is an aorist verb. Of this type of verb Strongs tells us:

Is characterized by its emphasis on punctiliar action; that is, the concept of the verb is considered without regard for past, present, or future time. There is no direct or clear English equivalent for this tense,

In other words, this kind of a verb has no timing information.

And yet the simple truth is that the vast majority of aorist verbs are translated as simple past tense.

The wife in Rev. 19 has been in heaven since the rapture at the 6th seal. That "great multitude" are seen in Rev. 7:9, and are the same "great multitude" seen in 19:6. They did not spend all that time in heaven waiting for the 7th seal, all 7 trumpets, and the first 6 bowls to be fulfilled before the marriage took place. When the bride goes to the groom's father's house, the marriage is consummated first thing.

[iamlamad]

1 hour ago, WilliamL said:

And yet the simple truth is that the vast majority of aorist verbs are translated as simple past tense.

The wife in Rev. 19 has been in heaven since the rapture at the 6th seal. That "great multitude" are seen in Rev. 7:9, and are the same "great multitude" seen in 19:6. They did not spend all that time in heaven waiting for the 7th seal, all 7 trumpets, and the first 6 bowls to be fulfilled before the marriage took place. When the bride goes to the groom's father's house, the marriage is consummated first thing.

the vast majority of aorist verbs are translated as simple past tense.  What other choice would make the most sense? We simply don't have verbs that match these Aorist verbs. ALL  of our verbs have timing information.
The wife in Rev. 19 has been in heaven since the rapture at the 6th seal. Agreed. 

The wife in Rev. 19 has been in heaven since the rapture at the 6th seal.  You will have to take that up with John and the Holy Spirit, for they show the marriage in chapter 19, not in chapter 7. WHY is the marriage shown in chapter 19? Simple, God must wait for the GUESTS to be resurrected: the OT saints, and their resurrection will be on the last day of the 70th week. 

[Moby]

10 hours ago, The Light said:

The Church will not be perfect and man is not perfect. The Church is perfect through the blood of Christ who paid the price for our sin.

This looks more like the world to me. The Church is instructed what to do: From such, turn away.

You do not have to go through "the tribulation" to produce righteousness. Everyone goes through tribulation in their life. I don't think you are saying that all that have died without going through "the tribulation" are unworthy. We all have tribulation.

That is a new vision. So where are we in the Bible when this marriage supper takes place.

Right after this event.

Rev 14 ¹⁴ And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

¹⁵ And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

¹⁶ And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

¹⁷ And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

¹⁸ And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

¹⁹ And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

This is the gathering from heaven and earth just before the wrath of God begins. This event puts us back in the sixth seal, just prior to the wrath of God.

Rev 6 ¹⁷ For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

The fig tree has two harvests. Do you not think that there will be a marriage supper for the 1st harvest?

Jacob worked 7 years for Rachael but was given Leah instead. There was a marriage feast. He had to work 7 more years to get his bride Rachael.

From what Paul said in this passage it appears Jesus is demanding a church "not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish":

Ephesians 5:25-27  Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself up for it;  (26)  that he might sanctify it, having cleansed it by the washing of water with the word,  (27)  that he might present the church to himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

No this passage is not talking about the world but it is talking about the church acting like the world instead of obeying the Word:

2 Timothy 3:1-17  But know this, that in the last days grievous times shall come.  (2)  For men shall be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, railers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,  (3)  without natural affection, implacable, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, no lovers of good,  (4)  traitors, headstrong, puffed up, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God;  (5)  holding a form of godliness, but having denied the power thereof: from these also turn away.  (6)  For of these are they that creep into houses(church buildings), and take captive silly women(church members) laden with sins, led away by divers lusts,  (7)  ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.  (8)  And even as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also withstand the truth; men corrupted in mind, reprobate concerning the faith.  (9)  But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be evident unto all men, as theirs also came to be.  (10)  But thou didst follow my teaching, conduct, purpose, faith, longsuffering, love, patience,  (11)  persecutions, sufferings; what things befell me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: and out of them all the Lord delivered me.  (12)  Yea, and all that would live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.  (13)  But evil men and impostors shall wax worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived.  (14)  But abide thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;  (15)  and that from a babe thou hast known the sacred writings which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.  (16)  Every scripture inspired of God is also profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for instruction which is in righteousness:  (17)  that the man of God may be complete, furnished completely unto every good work.

Yes you are right that Father chooses how much tribulation each saint needs during their lifetime on the earth. But we are talking about these last days when there are more Christians alive presently than any time in history. The scriptures contain more prophesy about the last 8 years than any other prophetic time. Jesus opens the seven seals to prove who will chose to be slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they hold just like the apostles in Jesus day:

Revelation 6:9-11  And when he opened the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of them that had been slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:  (10)  and they cried with a great voice, saying, How long, O Master, the holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?  (11)  And there was given them to each one a white robe; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little time, until their fellow-servants also and their brethren, who should be killed even as they were, should have fulfilled their course.

Revelation 12:11  And they overcame him because of the blood of the Lamb, and because of the word of their testimony; and they loved not their life even unto death.

What I meant by saying the bride will be ready by the end of the book of Revelation not the beginning is because she along with the virgins and wedding guest must go through the amount of tribulation necessary to produce the fruit our Father desires for each part:

100 fold~~~~~~~bride~~~~~~~sun glory~~~~~~gold

60 fold~~~~~~~virgins~~~~~~moon glory~~~~~~silver

30 fold~~~wedding guests~~~star glory~~~~precious stones

It is our Father who foreordains this from the foundation of the world and it is He who will execute his word upon the earth, finishing it and cutting it short:

Romans 9:28  for the Lord will execute his word upon the earth, finishing it and cutting it short.

But not until the elect are finished in their proper lot:

Matthew 24:22  And except those days had been shortened, no flesh would have been saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Daniel 12:12-13  Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.  (13)  But go thou thy way till the end be; for thou shalt rest, and shalt stand in thy lot, at the end of the days.

[The Light]

15 hours ago, Moby said:

Yes you are right that Father chooses how much tribulation each saint needs during their lifetime on the earth. But we are talking about these last days when there are more Christians alive presently than any time in history. The scriptures contain more prophesy about the last 8 years than any other prophetic time. Jesus opens the seven seals to prove who will chose to be slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they hold just like the apostles in Jesus day:
 

Seven of the last eight years are the 70th week of Daniel. The 70th week of Daniel is about the people of Daniel as the Church will already be in heaven before the seals are opened, see Rev 5. That is why there are 144,000 first fruits from the 12 tribes. That is why the harvest from the earth that you see with the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal is mainly about the people of Daniel.

15 hours ago, Moby said:

Revelation 6:9-11  And when he opened the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of them that had been slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:  (10)  and they cried with a great voice, saying, How long, O Master, the holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?  (11)  And there was given them to each one a white robe; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little time, until their fellow-servants also and their brethren, who should be killed even as they were, should have fulfilled their course.

Do you view this is the Great Tribulation?

 

15 hours ago, Moby said:

 

Revelation 12:11  And they overcame him because of the blood of the Lamb, and because of the word of their testimony; and they loved not their life even unto death.

This verse is not about the Church. This verse has to do with the seed of the woman. FYI if a person has a Gentile mother and a Jewish father the child is considered a Gentile. If a person has a Jewish mother and a Gentile father the child is considered a Jew. When the word speaks of the dragon going after the seed of the woman, it is saying that the dragon goes after the Jews across the earth. They are the seed of the woman, not the Church.

Rev 12

¹² Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

¹³ And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

¹⁴ And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

¹⁵ And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

¹⁶ And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

¹⁷ And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

 

15 hours ago, Moby said:

It is our Father who foreordains this from the foundation of the world and it is He who will execute his word upon the earth, finishing it and cutting it short:

Romans 9:28  for the Lord will execute his word upon the earth, finishing it and cutting it short.

But not until the elect are finished in their proper lot:

Matthew 24:22  And except those days had been shortened, no flesh would have been saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Daniel 12:12-13  Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.  (13)  But go thou thy way till the end be; for thou shalt rest, and shalt stand in thy lot, at the end of the days.

The days are shortened for the elect. The elect that the days are shortened for are the 12 tribes across the earth. The elect of the Church will already be in heaven at this time and will return with Jesus at the gathering from heaven and earth.