Mt.12:40 - Three days and three nights

[Anne2]

8 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

Thank you, I could not understand that till now. That after the Passover the 14th and the High Sabbath Holiday which is the 15th. The day after the Sabath is the day of the first fruits celebration. And it is the first day of the week. 

The Passover on the 14th the High Sabbath Day the First Day of the Unleavened Bread Holidays is the 15th always but the first Day of the Omer is not always on the 16th. If the 15th it happened to be on the regular Sabath Day on the seven day of the and Passover on the 14th then only then the 16th of Nisan would it be the first day of the Omer the day of the first fruits. 

But in Leviticus it says to be celebrated on the day after the Sabath the first day of the week because the celebration of the Unleavened Bread does not always fall on the seven day of the week. 

As the first day of the month Nisan is not a set day as it is determined by the moon cycle. They had a lunar year. And 1st day of the month it was determined by the full  moon. That's why it says count seven weeks and one day. 

So are you saying you understand lev 23 to be speaking of a Sabbath day of the week, and not a Sabbath by festival?

 

Edited May 28, 2024 by Anne2

[Your closest friendnt]

3 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

So are you saying you understand lev 23 to be speaking of a Sabbath day of the week, and not a Sabbath by festival?

 

In Leviticus we have the 14th is the Passover and the 15th the first day of the seven days Unleavened Bread Holidays. And it says that besides the Sabath days every week the Lord gave them some Holidays to be regarded as Sabath Days even though they do not fall on the Sabath Day the seven day of the week.  Those Days were called High Sabbath Days regarded as Holy unto the Lord no work was done like on the Sabath. 

[farouk]

17 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

Thank you, I could not understand that till now. That after the Passover the 14th and the High Sabbath Holiday which is the 15th. The day after the Sabath is the day of the first fruits celebration. And it is the first day of the week. 

The Passover on the 14th the High Sabbath Day the First Day of the Unleavened Bread Holidays is the 15th always but the first Day of the Omer is not always on the 16th. If the 15th it happened to be on the regular Sabath Day on the seven day of the and Passover on the 14th then only then the 16th of Nisan would it be the first day of the Omer the day of the first fruits. 

But in Leviticus it says to be celebrated on the day after the Sabath the first day of the week because the celebration of the Unleavened Bread does not always fall on the seven day of the week. 

As the first day of the month Nisan is not a set day as it is determined by the moon cycle. They had a lunar year. And 1st day of the month it was determined by the full  moon. That's why it says count seven weeks and one day. And does not give a set day in the Calendar. It remain to be determined. Even for the first fruits day it says it has to be all the time the first day of the week imediatly after the Sabath Day after the first day of the Unleavened Bread Holidays. That's how the day of the first fruits is determined because the first day of the Unleavened Bread it may be on the Sabath Day. Was it on the sabbath day the year Jesus Christ was crucified? That's the question.  

@Your closest friendnt Commentators speak of moveable feasts, don't they?

Perhaps this is relevant also.

[farouk]

15 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

So are you saying you understand lev 23 to be speaking of a Sabbath day of the week, and not a Sabbath by festival?

 

@Anne2 Interesting distinction, especially since there were moveable feasts in the OT...

[Anne2]

22 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

In Leviticus we have the 14th is the Passover and the 15th the first day of the seven days Unleavened Bread Holidays. And it says that besides the Sabath days every week the Lord gave them some Holidays to be regarded as Sabath Days even though they do not fall on the Sabath Day the seven day of the week.  Those Days were called High Sabbath Days regarded as Holy unto the Lord no work was done like on the Sabath. 

Oh, ok I think I am understanding you better.

This is something I have been thinking on...

The Pharisees and Sadducees had a dispute over the Festal Calendar.

The Sadducees took Sabbaths to be literal weekly Sabbath days (movable), the Pharisees took them as festival sabbaths by date in the year (fixed).

It makes me consider that Sunday being the day he was raised was acknowledged by all the Church early on. Could this have been to know that Both Sectarian Calendars were reconciled that year for neither to have a dispute concerning him that year?

Those days were made for a shadow of HIM???? Not him made for those days???? It does not matter????

Edited May 28, 2024 by Anne2

[farouk]

4 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

Oh, ok I think I am understanding you better.

This is something I have been thinking on...

The Pharisees and Sadducees had a dispute over the Festal Calendar.

The Sadducees took Sabbaths to be literal weekly Sabbath days, the Pharisees took them as festival sabbaths by date.

It makes me consider that Sunday being the day he was raised was acknowledged by all the Church early on. Could this have been to know that Both Sectarian Calendars were reconciled that year for neither to have a dispute concerning him that year?

Those days were made for a shadow of HIM???? Not him made for those days???? It does not matter????

@Anne2 It's remarkable how the Sadducees could deny resurrection and yet insist on a legalistic interpretation of sabbaths.

Reminds me of an atheist politician in the 19th century who used to tell ppl which churches appealed to him: as if the trappings appealed to the flesh, with the core missing altogether.

[Anne2]

1 minute ago, farouk said:

@Anne2 It's remarkable how the Sadducees could deny resurrection and yet insist on a legalistic interpretation of sabbaths.

Well, not so much more remarkable than the legalism of the Pharisees concerning a resurrection and deny it. Which is worse? Maybe neither...

Luke 16:29  Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30  And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31  And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
 

[farouk]

24 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

Well, not so much more remarkable than the legalism of the Pharisees concerning a resurrection and deny it. Which is worse? Maybe neither...

Luke 16:29  Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30  And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31  And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
 

Yes, good point, @Anne2 and a passage relevant to the discussion.

[Your closest friendnt]

@Indentured Servant

I realized that from what I can get from what is written down one thing is loud and clear that Jesus Christ was resurrected on Sunday before sunrise because the women met him at that time resurrected. The only people who can tell are the Roman soldiers who guard the tomb. And perhaps other people. 

There is nothing to point to what day was the Passover day or the 14th of Nissan. The next day was the first day of the Unleavened Bread Holidays and it was a High Sabbath Day. Which it means that is celebrated as a Sabbath day on any day it falls and it was call a High Sabbath not because it falls on the Sabath Day, the Saturday and that could also happen but because of importance of that day which was one of the mandatory Holidays as it was the first day of the seven day of the Unleavened Bread Holidays. 

Sorry for insisting because I thought that High Sabbath it must mean the special Holyday that falls on the Sabath Day. It could fall on any Day and the Passover Day is always the preparation day for the High Sabbath day which is a day put aside to the Lord and like the Sabbath no work to be done and special offerings were offered.  Again sorry for insisting. To find out the specific day someone must know the specific year and study the charts for what day of the week was the Nissan 14, or what day was the 1 day of the year which is the 1st day of the month Nisan. Good grief. I learned a lot and I redirected my self. 

Edited May 29, 2024 by Your closest friendnt

[Indentured Servant]

12 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said:

@Indentured Servant

I realized that from what I can get from what is written down one thing is loud and clear that Jesus Christ was resurrected on Sunday before sunrise because the women met him at that time resurrected. The only people who can tell are the Roman soldiers who guard the tomb. And perhaps other people. 

There is nothing to point to what day was the Passover day or the 14th of Nissan. The next day was the first day of the Unleavened Bread Holidays and it was a High Sabbath Day. Which it means that is celebrated as a Sabbath day on any day it falls and it was call a High Sabbath not because it falls on the Sabath Day, the Saturday and that could also happen but because of importance of that day which was one of the mandatory Holidays as it was the first day of the seven day of the Unleavened Bread Holidays. 

Sorry for insisting because I thought that High Sabbath it must mean the special Holyday that falls on the Sabath Day. It could fall on any Day and the Passover Day is always the preparation day for the High Sabbath day which is a day put aside to the Lord and like the Sabbath no work to be done and special offerings were offered.  Again sorry for insisting. To find out the specific day someone must know the specific year and study the charts for what day of the week was the Nissan 14, or what day was the 1 day of the year which is the 1st day of the month Nisan. Good grief. I learned a lot and I redirected my self. 

Thank you for your considerate reply. 

I suppose we each have our own way to interpret (or accept) what we are taught by people who have interpreted what they've been taught by previous generations and differing perspectives.

My apologies, I don't see what you see in scripture as "on Sunday," as I don't place my understanding of this based on English translations of the Bible nor on the potential for error in public speakers and theologians.

I read scripture in Greek, (and Hebrew.) If my understanding is hindered in any way, I consult God. He has offered to teach us, give us wisdom and insight, only for the asking. In that, I took Him at His Word, and I always ask. 

I have not always believed as I do, now. I was a teacher, I've even preached, developed Bible study curriculum, and have written on various doctrinal studies. I find my past efforts, in the words of Solomon, as "meaningless."

We all have our path, and sometimes it means having differing orientations on biblical knowledge. It is nice to know that we can still find respect in each other's walk.