Spiritual significance of water baptism as part of salvation

[Waggles]

just be like a child and do not overthink it. 

remember even Jesus himself got water baptised. now there is a role model to follow. 

[Whyme]

24 minutes ago, Waggles said:

Good grief unbelievable 

Thats what I think of your post

[Whyme]

Jesus was talking about being born again, and he was asked if a person can be put back in the womb and be born again. In the womb is the first birth. Its not referring to baptism but birth

Edited April 1, 2021 by Whyme

[Waggles]

42 minutes ago, Whyme said:

Jesus was talking about being born again, and he was asked if a person can be put back in the womb and be born again. In the womb is the first birth. Its not referring to baptism but birth

NO - Jesus was talking about spiritual truths and requirements to Nicodemus who had no comprehension of what Jesus had revealed to him.

Seems the same problem still exists today. 

[Whyme]

25 minutes ago, Waggles said:

NO - Jesus was talking about spiritual truths and requirements to Nicodemus who had no comprehension of what Jesus had revealed to him.

Seems the same problem still exists today. 

Actually, yes, Jesus and Nicodemus were indeed talking about both physical and spiritual birth.

[BeyondET]

1 hour ago, Waggles said:

just be like a child and do not overthink it. 

remember even Jesus himself got water baptised. now there is a role model to follow. 

That happened no doubt and was performed in the latter part of his life, it’s on my bucket list indeed.

[BeyondET]

51 minutes ago, Whyme said:

Actually, yes, Jesus and Nicodemus were indeed talking about both physical and spiritual birth.

That is interesting, seems there is a implication of a part completed the water part at birth, born of water and of the Spirit. if someone has never been born can they enter into the kingdom.

5Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. 

6Flesh is born of flesh, but spirit is born of the Spirit. 

7Do not be amazed that I said, ‘You must be born again.’ 

8The wind blows where it wishes. You hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”

seems the born again is the spiritual birth

[Guest kingdombrat]

It's a public sign of Following the very example of Christ.   There is no cleansing to it, no guarantee of anything but a little wetter than before, no implications towards Salvation.  The true [significance] of the being a "witness" to water submission, is a practice that is acceptable in the form of being His Witness. 

 

John was preaching "Baptism" in a form of being buried under something and coming up clean.   He turns that idealism into being covered in the Blood of Christ.   He honored the One he preached about and humbled himself to fulfill the purpose of Yeshua's Baptism.   

 

So, even though there is no attachment to (1) must do (2) a requirement for Salvation (3) a Direct command, there is still a Spiritual [connection].  John witnessed this Connection when He [being the only one and testifying to it later in John's Gospel] where the Complete Godhead United on Earth.   This was a Promise John had asked from God to give him a sign to who the Messiah would be.   And somehow, the obedience to be [Baptized] and be His open Witness, there's a special spiritual connection we don't know the real significance of, yet.

Edited April 2, 2021 by kingdombrat

[Whyme]

50 minutes ago, BeyondET said:

That is interesting, seems there is a implication of a part completed the water part at birth, born of water and of the Spirit. if someone has never been born can they enter into the kingdom.

5Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. 

6Flesh is born of flesh, but spirit is born of the Spirit. 

7Do not be amazed that I said, ‘You must be born again.’ 

8The wind blows where it wishes. You hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”

seems the born again is the spiritual birth

Yes, flesh is born of flesh. This sounds like the natural birth. One birth is natural and the other spiritual.

Edited April 2, 2021 by Whyme

[Waggles]

7 hours ago, Whyme said:

Yes, flesh is born of flesh. This sounds like the natural birth. One birth is natural and the other spiritual.

So you have to be born and alive to enter the kingdom of God - do you not think that is obvious! Only living people can enter the kingdom of God those who have been born - duh! 

No that is not what Jesus is saying. He is indeed talking of water baptism and Holy Spirit baptism - and the rest of the NT upholds and explains this with doctrinal consistency. 

Hebrews 6:1 Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 with instruction about ablutions, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And this we will do if God permits. [RSV] 

6:1 Therefore let us go on towards perfection, leaving behind the basic teaching about Christ, and not laying again the foundation: repentance from dead works and faith towards God, 2 instruction about baptisms, laying on of hands, resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgement. 3 And we will do this, if God permits. [NRSV] 

Edited April 2, 2021 by Waggles