Theological Problems with God-guided Evolution

[Sparks]

20 minutes ago, one.opinion said:

That was a specific incarnation of God. Jesus Himself teaches that God is Spirit in John 4. Additionally, where would this put groups like Neanderthals that looked quite a bit like us. Were they also made in God's image because they look similar to Homo sapiens?

Ho, boy. 

See how the evolution garbage made it in to the topic? 

Hypothetically, if we leave the human-made evolution religion out of the picture, how would would you interpret Genesis 1:26?  There is God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost, and they are One. 

God said our image, like us.

What did they mean?

[one.opinion]

7 minutes ago, Sparks said:

See how the evolution garbage made it in to the topic? 

Genesis 1:26 implies the imbuing of something beyond physical. We cannot be like God in any physical way because God is Spirit. Jesus took on the form of humanity. Humanity was not given a physical form to be like God. Again, check John 4 and the words of Jesus about this.

There is no evolution garbage in my post. Neanderthals were very real. YEC scientists only contest when they were on the earth.

 

[Sparks]

1 minute ago, one.opinion said:

Genesis 1:26 implies the imbuing of something beyond physical. We cannot be like God in any physical way because God is Spirit. Jesus took on the form of humanity. Humanity was not given a physical form to be like God. Again, check John 4 and the words of Jesus about this.

Yes, when you make things up using eisegesis, this might be true. 

2 minutes ago, one.opinion said:

There is no evolution garbage in my post. Neanderthals were very real. YEC scientists only contest when they were on the earth.

You will find they were humans who lived for a long time.  If you lived for 600 years, you would look just them being old and your forehead never stops growing, and the world is littered with people from that age before the flood. 

When you learn to look at the flood as God's judgement over a couple of years instead of the 'geologic column,' you will discover that a world-wide flood would leave exactly the evidence you see today.

Scientists found a body with a smaller head and claimed it was another species, but it was just a human kid with Microcephaly.   "This head looks different" does not mean it's not human.

We will not agree, seemingly on anything political, theological, vaccine based and more.   

[Amigo42]

On 6/3/2021 at 6:26 PM, one.opinion said:

I grew up in a family where I was taught Young Earth Creation. However, as a Biology major as an undergraduate and through the process of earning a PhD degree in a molecular virology lab, I became convinced that there was too much evidence supporting evolution to be ignored.

So, what is your definition of evolution?  Are we talking apes to humans, ants to pigs, or the endosymbiotic theory?  I was a Biology major too and saw no evidence of real "evolution.". However, if you mean micro evolution, then yes there is evidence for this.  Evolution technically means slow change over time.  Look at Corona and its various variants and mutations in just one year.  

[one.opinion]

1 minute ago, Sparks said:

Yes, when you make things up using eisegesis, this might be true. 

Not eisegesis, just interpretation in full context of the Bible.

 

[one.opinion]

10 minutes ago, Amigo42 said:

Evolution technically means slow change over time. 

Yes, the definition is heritable change over time. The term gets used in multiple contexts, though. It can be used to refer to the concept of species development over time, and even can be used to encompass common ancestry.

12 minutes ago, Amigo42 said:

So, what is your definition of evolution?  Are we talking apes to humans, ants to pigs, or the endosymbiotic theory? 

Since you did take a look at the OP, you'll see that I accept common ancestry, but that really want to avoid another "evidence for evolution" thread that is frustrating and boring.

I want this thread to focus on theology. As a Christ follower that accepts the baggage associated with "evolution", I still find basic theological points in Genesis 1-3. I would like to see if we can agree on these or if there are fundamental differences in our understanding of the major theological points from those three chapters.

[AandW_Rootbeer]

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

*  I accept the inerrancy of Scripture. I will not agree 100% of the time with 100% of my brothers and sisters in Christ on exactly what a Biblical passage means, or how it should be read. However, that does NOT mean that I only believe certain parts of the Bible or that I am calling God a liar.

You differ on interpretation which is quite normal among Believers and Non-Believers.   I see no error in this idealism.

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

*  I grew up in a family where I was taught Young Earth Creation. However, as a Biology major as an undergraduate and through the process of earning a PhD degree in a molecular virology lab, I became convinced that there was too much evidence supporting evolution to be ignored.

You are believer in an older Earth due to your belief in Evolution.   But have you ever witnessed in a natural format single cell becoming multi-celled and merge from one Specie to a completely newer Specie.   Or, just because you've seen an example on a smaller scale, you believe it would have to happen on a larger scale even without observable proofs?

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

*  Additionally, I discovered time and again that I was taught poorly regarding "facts" pertaining to evolution or a young earth.

I think this is a norm for many.

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

*  I would like to use this thread to demonstrate how a follower of Christ can, in good faith, still accept the biological process of evolution.

This will be worth reading.

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

So, without further ado, these are the major theological points that I gather from Genesis 1-3.

Let's begin!

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

1. God is creator of ALL things. I believe that the original audience for these chapters was a group of people that had just escaped 400 years immersed in a culture teeming with false gods. This was an important reminder for them.

Personally, I believe the knowledge of Genesis and Creation had been widely known among the Hebrew Peoples leading into the 400 years of Egyptian slavery.  I believe God just clarified it to Moses in Person once the Hebrew Peoples made it to the the Wilderness.   God wanted a Written Account of it for future Generations like us to read.

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

2. God made humans special - in His likeness. We possess something that is unique among living creatures. This is quite likely something more than just bigger brains and the ability to talk. I believe our Imago Dei is spiritual, not physical.

But God said, Let us make man... then we see God forming man.   I believe the Spiritual Image is a given, but God was also speaking in terms such as "Likeness" referring to physical stature.

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

3. Humans tragically chose their own way, rather than following God's specific instructions. This not only affected Adam and Eve (which I believe to be real people, and not just literary archetypes), but the rest of humanity. We are doomed to sin and its consequences.

So, you're not buying that Satan in the form of a serpent beguiled Eve?

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

4. God promised a way of deliverance. This was not spelled out in detail in Genesis 3, but it foretold of the coming Messiah.

But the Tree of Life has always represented the future Cross and Christ as Savior.   And we know the Tree of Life existed in the Garden before Adam was placed there.

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

The Gospel of Jesus Christ is His choice to take on human form and limitations, lead a perfect and sinless life, die in order to overcome the power of sin and death, and come back to life to offer a new, spiritual life to all those that would receive Him.

I can agree with this.  I might choose different wording and explanation but I like what you've added.

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

This Gospel is not predicated on what we believe about the age of the earth. That topic is of much lower importance.

Agreed!

On 6/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, one.opinion said:

So having now given this introduction, let's talk! I'll be very happy to discuss any objections, but do hope we can keep the conversation calm and considerate.

Your turn!

[Sparks]

1 hour ago, one.opinion said:

Not eisegesis, just interpretation in full context of the Bible.

You mean misinterpretation.  Like your friend Teddy said, the Bible is silent about evolution.  You are the one who interprets evolution as being in there based on your own personal subjective biases. 

Should I just start teaching that God was sipping a Strawberry Milkshake as He made the universe?  The Bible is strangely silent on the topic, but everyone knows that Strawberry Milkshakes go hand-in-hand with universe making.  So, it must be so.

See how silly it is to inject things into the Bible that are not there based on personal bias?  That's eisegesis.

[one.opinion]

30 minutes ago, Sparks said:

See how silly it is to inject things into the Bible that are not there based on personal bias? 

Except that John 4 really is in the Bible. You are not making an argument that makes sense.

[Sparks]

21 minutes ago, one.opinion said:

Except that John 4 really is in the Bible. You are not making an argument that makes sense.

There is a John 5, too.  There are Johns all over the place, but none mention Neanderthal. 

Do you plan to discount the Trinity to make your point, or add Neanderthal man again?  That's eisegesis. 

1 John 5:7  (KJV) “For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.”