Defense of the Post Trib Rapture

[Guest JohnSC]

<previous message deleted>

My apologies to all for my having posted within this thread. I had not taken time to read all of the postings, and without knowledge of the spirit of the discussion, my input produced nothing useful, and inadvertently became a portion of the fuel firing strife. Again, I apologize.

Edited July 27, 2004 by JohnSC

[One Way]

Wow, you folks impress me! During my studies almost 25 years ago, my pet topic was on the tribulation period. I wrote an overly long manuscript length thesis detailing the doctrinal logics that nullify any possible pretribulation rapture idea, which never got published, but recently after trimming its size, it is now published in ebook form. For years I held a standing $1,000.00 reward for anyone who could show me any verse anywhere in the Bible that spoke or even hinted of a pretribulation rapture. Needless to say, no one won the reward.

Maybe because you were the judge.

I've looked over your versed and, as usual, I fear they are simply due to a lack of understanding of the resurrection.

I've commented on this in other threads, but if asked I'll repeat it.

Blessings...

[rollinTHUNDER]

Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day."

John 12:48 : "He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day."

I love how post-tribbers trip over the words "last day." As One Way says, your understanding of the resurrection is terribly lacking, as I'll show using the final (two) verses you quoted pertaining to this last day. Do you not know that this last day will last 1000 years? Read 2 Peter, chapter 3.

All believers will be raised up at the last day to rule and reign for 1000 years. He who humbles himself will be exalted (raised up). Do you not know that the unbelievers will not be raised up and judged until the 1000 years are finished? You post-tribbers assume that this raising up is the rapture, but in reality, it speaks of the resurrection of all believers, of all time. Yes, the rapture is included in the resurrection, but it's only a part of it. There is a certain order that must be followed. You fail to realize that the resurrection began almost 2000 years ago, with Christ, who is the head of the body. And it will not end until He returns.

Take a good look at those two verses again. The unbelievers will not be raised for judgment until the completion of the 1000 years. The jews always believed in the resurrection, so did Job, but they were not taught about the rapture. It was Paul that revealed the mystery, but he wasn't even called into the ministry until Christ had already ascended. The rapture will happen in the twinkling of an eye, where everyone will be caught up together, but in the resurrection, believers will go in there own turn (1 Cor. 15:23), and over a long period of time, biginning with Christ who was first.

That's why post-tribbers are so confused.

[Guest LCPGUY]

Heya Thunder, keep Rollin

[ServingHim]

I agree. We will go through tribulationl

do you think we're going through tribulation now?

33 I have said this to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world." John 16:33

what about immediately after Christ's ascension? Didn't even the apostles go through 'tribulation' even warning of tribulation to come upon those they preached to?

21 When they had preached the gospel to that city and had made many disciples, they returned to Lystra and to Ico'nium and to Antioch, 22 strengthening the souls of the disciples, exhorting them to continue in the faith, and saying that through many tribulations we must enter the kingdom of God. Acts 14:21-22

[One Way]

I agree. We will go through tribulationl

do you think we're going through tribulation now?

33 I have said this to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world." John 16:33

what about immediately after Christ's ascension? Didn't even the apostles go through 'tribulation' even warning of tribulation to come upon those they preached to?

21 When they had preached the gospel to that city and had made many disciples, they returned to Lystra and to Ico'nium and to Antioch, 22 strengthening the souls of the disciples, exhorting them to continue in the faith, and saying that through many tribulations we must enter the kingdom of God. Acts 14:21-22

Yes, but this is another misunderstanding on the end of post-tribbers.

The tribulation that Jesus promised His followers would come from the world, the flesh, and the devil.

The GT period is a time of God's wrath on a Christ rejecting world and the Antichrist.

That is the difference. Jesus did not say that we would be subject to God's wrath,

for Jesus paid it all, all to Him I owe,

though my sins were scarlet, they are now white as snow!

Furthermore, the GT is the 70th week of Daniel that is determined for Israel and Jerusalem, so the Church/Bride of Christ doesn't even fit in... as were nowhere in the first 69 weeks of Daniel that culminated at the Triumphal Entry.

Right now, we are in a very peculiar dispensation between the 69th week and the 70th week, although we are part of neither.

The word "tribulation" cannot just be thrown around to mean the same thing. After all, I've had Mexican friends named "Jesus," but I don't rely on them for salvation

[Kay]

ONE WAY

Love

k

[ServingHim]

Do you not know that this last day will last 1000 years? Read 2 Peter, chapter 3.

All believers will be raised up at the last day to rule and reign for 1000 years. He who humbles himself will be exalted (raised up). Do you not know that the unbelievers will not be raised up and judged until the 1000 years are finished?

"But do not ignore this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slow about his promise as some count slowness, but is forbearing toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. . . . Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of persons ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be kindled and dissolved, and the elements will melt with fire! But according to his promise we wait for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, since you wait for these, be zealous to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace" 2 Peter 3:8

[ServingHim]

Yes, but this is another misunderstanding on the end of post-tribbers.

so who's interpretation of what end times are is correct? and why? It's very intriguing to me...with all the differing 'opinions' of what it is, who's is the right interpretation...I believe that scriptures are not clearly stating what it is, and therefore, I think that all people who believe what they believe think that THEY are right. Why would my question be the 'misinterpretation', and yours the 'right interpretation'? Humbly asked, not to start a 'fight' PLEASE~! Merely a question as I'm sure that others would disagree with you and say that YOU had the 'misinterpretation'. Peace.

[Dad Ernie]

Greetings Serving Him,

Why would my question be the 'misinterpretation', and yours the 'right interpretation'? Humbly asked, not to start a 'fight' PLEASE~! Merely a question as I'm sure that others would disagree with you and say that YOU had the 'misinterpretation'. Peace.

I learned long ago that BEFORE I could get very involved in understanding Revelation and the latter day prophecies that I MUST FIRST get to know Jesus and the rest of the scriptures before I could begin to understand. I recently heard R.C. Sproul say the very same thing and he is a renowned theologian, albeit an amillineast.

So the truth is there for those who truly desire to know it, but it takes a great deal of effort and study to begin to see the "truth". Don't give up the ship just because there are so many varying opinions. Seek it out for yourself and you will be greatly rewarded, even as Revelation promises you.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie