Will the Lord find faith upon the earth?

[Your closest friendnt]

On 8/4/2021 at 12:46 AM, JohnR7 said:

He is speaking about people who cry out to Him day and night. Do they continue to have faith and believe until they receive their request for justice or do they lose hope when the answer to prayer is delayed. 

We are discussing Luke 18:v.7 and v.8

We are having a discussion for discovery. 

We seek to understand what was the message Jesus had in his mind when he spoke the words in v.7 and v.8.

"What he had in his mind" as in what context he had consider and what messages he wanted to communicate. 

One more time Jesus speaks like he speaks in a manner that only he knows what he meant to say, keeping the meaning lock to himself.

Is not the first time Jesus is secretive, hiding from the people what he wanted to say. 

Jesus spoke beyond their understanding, beyond their comprehension. 

When he finished talking no one asked him any questions. 

To answer the why they did not asked questions we need to speculate because there is more than one possible answer and perhaps there is one that we have not thought about it.

The fact remains that on what we have they were no questions asked.

We cannot say that they did not asks Jesus questions about what he said at a later time.

*** we also have problems with the translations.

For that reason we need to check the Greek. 

ΚΑΤΑ ΛΟΥΚΑΝ 18:7 Greek NT: Nestle 1904
ὁ δὲ Θεὸς οὐ μὴ ποιήσῃ τὴν ἐκδίκησιν (the English word is  "revenge")

τῶν ἐκλεκτῶν αὐτοῦ τῶν βοώντων αὐτῷ ἡμέρας καὶ νυκτός, καὶ μακροθυμεῖ ἐπ’ αὐτοῖς;

ΚΑΤΑ ΛΟΥΚΑΝ 18:7 Greek NT: Westcott and Hort 1881
ὁ δὲ θεὸς οὐ μὴ ποιήσῃ τὴν ἐκδίκησιν τῶν ἐκλεκτῶν αὐτοῦ τῶν βοώντων αὐτῷ ἡμέρας καὶ νυκτός, καὶ μακροθυμεῖ ἐπ' αὐτοῖς; 

***will not God do something to avenge his elect who cry to him day and night, because he keeps them waiting. While he is waiting for the right time. Does that mean that he does not want to do it? 

 Jesus knowing God's avenging plan, and the timing for this to happen he said in v.8.

V.8 God will avenge them and speedily. 

***what we can get from v.7 without any doubt is: 

The elect of God are crying to God to do good to his promise to avenge them. 

***As this has not happened yet Jesus knew something and he said it will happen speedily. 

Only God was able to take revenge on their behalf that's why the promise to his elect that he will be the one to revenge on their behalf. 

 God had promised to the elect he will be the one to do the revenge on their behalf? 

The elect seems that they know what they are asking God to do. 

Crying day and night shows anxiety as to why God has not done it yet.

That shows that they are in that situation for a long period of time.  

Abraham and his descendants they also knew about the promise of God but they patiently were waiting for God to fulfill his promise to them. 

Then the people in v.7 must be the elect of God before Abraham. 

As Jesus called them the elect of God and not the children of God. 

Jesus made the distinction between his people from Abraham and his seed, and from his elect people before the arrival of Abraham. 

The distinction is that the elect were alive to God as long as they lived. 

(elect within the context of v.7).

But Abraham and his descendants according to the election of God were alive to God always.

When they lived and when they died. 

They were not together with their God but they were alive to their God. God was still their God while they were in the place of the dead. 

What is the act of revenge God had to do on  behalf of the elect to do good to his promise? 

PS

Get into my mind , because I am speeking like I know the answer, and I am giving you hints, or clues. 

Clues which you know and are familiar with and they will guide you to the answers. 

Edited August 8, 2021 by Your closest friendnt

[luigi]

Will the five virgins who are excluded from the marriage feast have faith in Christ upon His return? I don't think so. Their faith in love, truth, and justice, will have fallen asleep.

[JohnR7]

On 8/7/2021 at 12:07 PM, Your closest friendnt said:

Get into my mind

We are to have the mind of Christ. Why would I want to get into your mind and your thinking? We are to be of one mind and one accord (Philip2:2)

God has made it clear that He is a God of absolute and perfect justice. What I do not understand is when Jesus asks if He will find faith. He must know the answer but what point was He trying to make. What is the lesson for us here? 

[JohnR7]

On 8/8/2021 at 11:41 AM, luigi said:

Will the five virgins who are excluded from the marriage feast have faith in Christ upon His return? I don't think so. Their faith in love, truth, and justice, will have fallen asleep.

They are still virgins. They are pure and innocent before God. They have saved themselves for marriage and the Groom. Only it would appear they do not understand what marriage is all about. 

[Your closest friendnt]

3 hours ago, JohnR7 said:

We are to have the mind of Christ. Why would I want to get into your mind and your thinking? We are to be of one mind and one accord (Philip2:2)

God has made it clear that He is a God of absolute and perfect justice. What I do not understand is when Jesus asks if He will find faith. He must know the answer but what point was He trying to make. What is the lesson for us here? 

It's like when we are watching a movie and the script writer knows how it ends, but he want tell us, and in stand he is giving clues that leads to understand how the movie will ends. 

So I have come to understand something about the questions you asked, but I decided to give out the clues that will lead someone to what Jesus had in his mind when he said those things. 

If I have come to understand then somebody else can also come to the same understanding without me spelling it out. 

***Jesus in Luke 18:v.7 he is referring to God's elect who are crying day and night about something that only God can do to bring about a change in their sircumstances. 

They elect of God they are not happy where they are. 

The picture Jesus gave us it is that the elect of God they are away from God and they are asking God to do something that he had promised them that he will do so they can be together. 

They are asking him to rescue them from where they are. 

The question is Jesus referring to God's chosen people who have died already and they are not with him and that is because of not fault of their own but because that's how it had to be till God takes revenge on the one who had the right to take them upon their death because of that one had taken the first couple of Adam and Eve and by DEFAULT their descendants. 

They are asking God to take revenge on him and rescue them, because that what he had promised and he has not done it yet and they are crying out to him, still hoping and still believing that God will do good to his promise but why he is still waiting and waiting for what?

Is God waiting for the appointed one? The one who will take revenge upon the one who is holding them CAPTIVES? 

Was God waiting for the promise Savior to come who will avenge his elect ones and bring them to him? 

Is Jesus talking in a way that he knows that he is the seed of the woman in the promise God made at the time right after the fall of Adam and Eve? 

Jesus knew that he had to be bruise first and suffer till his death on the Cross because that's was the only way to destroy the DEFAULT authority upon all the people because death rein upon all people. Jesus Christ knew that he was the life giver, that his mission was to remain in the Life till he dies. 

Jesus Christ knew that upon his death on the Cross that the DEFAULT Inheritance of death upon humanity will be destroyed, gone, no more as it was nailed on the Cross. 

It stoped when upon his death on the Cross Jesus was declared by God as the Judge upon all the people of the world. 

Jesus knew that he will be the Judge of all the people of the world, first of all those who had died before him and they were in the place of the dead. 

He knew that he will Judge them on the principle of faith in him first, faith in the Life giver. The works and anything else follows each and everyone, faith in him comes first. 

That's why Jesus Christ preached the Gospel to the dead first. His mission was that everyone who had died before him to have the chance to hear the good news of the Gospel of Jesus Christ so they can be Judged according to their faith in him. Jesus Christ began first with the Judgment of the dead because they were the first ones who heard the Gospel and the first who believed in him and recieved the forgiveness of their sins and the Life and that is before the living. 

The dead before Jesus Christ had three days to make up their minds to believe in him, and each one of us have our life time if we are among those who have heard the Gospel. But there still are those who did not have the chance to hear the Gospel while they lived and before they died.,

For them God will make for them to hear the Gospel after they died. 

Because everyone must hear the Gospel and be Judge according to their faith in him.

Jesus said to the Jews who were under the obedience to the Law, that they too will be judge according to their faith in him. The same thing for everyone because the Life comes upon everyone not from the Law but only from believing in him.

That's why Jesus Christ said to the jews who were in obedience to the Law, that if they do not believe in him that they will die in their sins. 

There are will be only one way for the forgiveness of sins for the whole world and this is only by faith in him. 

Edited August 13, 2021 by Your closest friendnt

[luigi]

20 hours ago, JohnR7 said:

They are still virgins. They are pure and innocent before God. They have saved themselves for marriage and the Groom. Only it would appear they do not understand what marriage is all about. 

True that the five virgins who have no oil left are still virgins. But they are now outside and not to become one with God, and are therefore to become one with Satan and the faithless.