Get Ready For The Tribulation There Isn't a Pre-Rapture

[The Light]

7 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

In likewise those things mentioned in Revelation won't be poured out on true believers.

The Church won't be on earth during the tribulation. The twelve tribes will be on earth during the tribulation. They are the ones that go through the tribulation. However, they do not go through the wrath of God. Only those that flee as instructed in the nation of Israel and unbelievers go through the wrath of God. Those in the nation of Israel that flee go to a place provided for them. None of Gods people are appointed to wrath.

 

7 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

As like Egypt God will make a difference. The blood that was over the doorpost saved Gods people in the Passover. So during the trib while Christians are on earth they'll have Jesus representing his blood. Jesus sacrificed his blood to save us. God will see this upon believers during the trib. They will not receive any bowls or trumpets etc. Only they that are evil and or unbelieving people. .

This is not correct brother. The Church will not go through the tribulation. They are in heaven in Rev 5 before the tribulation begins. The tribulation, occurs during the 70th week of Daniel. The 70th of Daniel is when God turns His attention to the 12 tribes across the earth. They will realize that the Church has been raptured in the early summer harvest and they will still be on earth. 

Jer 8

20 The harvest is past, the summer is ended, and we are not saved.

Through the Jews fall, salvation is come unto the Gentiles for the purpose of the provoking the Jews to jealously. God will keep his promise to His Chosen.

Rom 11

11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?

7 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

Example Rev. 3:10 The word keep in this verse is an ancient word meaning to guard or to watch. So God is actually watch or keep guard over you in that hour.

Job the most dedicated man of God tested by the devil wasn't taken up. Even John the Baptist wasn't taken before his death. .

How then can Christians believe they're more special than all of these mentioned?. . As they were tested then. Christians will be tested during the trib. .

Rev 3

10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

The Christians will not be on earth during the tribulation. They are in heaven in Rev 5.

Rev 3

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

In Rev 4 we can see that the elders are already before the throne in heaven and are casting their crowns before the throne. This is before the seals are opened. The seals occur during the 70th week of Daniel when God has turned His attention to His Chosen. The Church is already in heaven. The Church will not experience the tribulation and will be kept from the hour of testing...which we can prove by the supporting scriptures.

Rev 4

10 The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,

7 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

Here are some scriptures.. 

Many Christian leaders teach from their pulpits that “the Church” will NOT go through Earth’s final “tribulation,” but will instead be “raptured” or taken to heaven before the final crisis takes place. This teaching is comforting to those that accept it. But is that what the Bible teaches?

Throughout the ages believers have without a doubt suffered “tribulation” and the Scriptures teach that this will continue till the Second Coming of Jesus Christ at the end.

The word “tribulation” in the New Testament, almost every verse applies to what faithful believers go through, rather than what they escape from. Let’s examine these references:

“Jesus said there would be “great tribulation” which His followers (the “elect”) must endure. Yet for “the elects sake, those days shall be shortened” (Matthew 24:21,22).“Jesus Christ said to His followers, “In the world YOU shall have tribulation, but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world” ( John 16:33). Paul told Christians, “WE through much tribulation must enter the kingdom of God” (Acts 14:22). “True Christians are to “glory in tribulations” because “tribulation works patience” and develops Christian character” (Romans 5:3). Paul wrote of the many “persecutions and tribulations” which “the churches of God” were enduring in the first century (Christians were thrown to the lions in the coliseum, eaten by wild dogs, burned at the stake and lit up as torches in Nero’s garden)-2 Thessalonians 1:4. John was our “companion in tribulation” (Revelation 1:9). To His church, Jesus said, “I know your works and tribulation…” (Revelation 2:9). Again to His church, Jesus said, “YOU shall have tribulation…” (Revelation 2:10). God’s final people “came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb” (Revelation 7:14). They did not escape it, but endured through it, being purified.

 

7 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

The Scriptures reveal that believers have at all times gone through “tribulation” and will suffer tribulations until the end. But the good news is that, believers need not be afraid for Christ promised, “Lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the world” (Matthew 28:20).

Through the gift of the Holy Spirit, Christ would be closer to His faithful children even more than when He was living on this earth (John 16:7). And He will strengthen them to overcome all the powers of darkness (Luke 10:19).

 

 

We can PROVE MULTIPLE WAYS, that the Church is in heaven before the tribulation. Those are the facts. All we need do is read exactly what the Word says.

[The Light]

9 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

I also notice pre trib keep skipping over Matthew 24 and jump into some other book. Read Matt. 24 Find any pre trib rapture mentioned?

I don't need to skip over Matthew 24. It is the coming of Jesus for the gathering from heaven and earth. We can see that that event occurs at the sixth seal. The twelve tribes across the earth are gathered from the earth before the wrath of God. The Church is gathered from heaven where they have been during the 70th week of Daniel when the tribulation occurs.

Mark 13

27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

9 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

You won't find any. No. Jesus isn't referring only to the Jews. This chapter is for all believers. If you say it's only for Jews you have made a distinction. Remember this verse. KJV Gal. 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

We can't say Matthew or the NT is partly for Jews and Orthodox pastors are for Christians and or Gentiles. . So the entire NT is for any Christians any people where they live. . Matthew 24 will show Christians will go through this as Israel will.

There is no distinction between Greek and Jew when all are one in Jesus Christ. However, right now Christians are in Christ Jesus and the Jews are not. The Jews can't have their eyes opened until the fulness of the Gentiles comes in. That won't happen until the pre 70th week rapture. It is only when event happens that part of Israel will have it's blindness removed.

Rom 11

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

9 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

 

 

Edited September 2, 2021 by The Light

[The Light]

8 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

We can't say Matthew or the NT is partly for Jews and Orthodox pastors are for Christians and or Gentiles. . So the entire NT is for any Christians any people where they live. . Matthew 24 will show Christians will go through this as Israel will.

Why did God only warn Israel in Matt, 24 and not the rest of us? Answer. Because the Antichrist will reside only in Jerusalem Israel or Judea. Only this place will become an abomination of desolation. They have to flee to the wilderness.

Since in America or Thailand for example the Antichrist will not physically be near them. .Therefore each situation for us may vary from one person and one place to another. Judea however can't get around the Antichrist who'll be going after the Jews directly with his army of men. .

 

The events of the false Christs, nations coming against nations and famine, pestilence and the fleeing in Jerusalem is the things that the Jews will experience during the 70th week of Daniel (the first 6 seals). But the chapter is for all to read. The word says to learn the parable of the fig tree. FYI, the fig tree has two harvests. Let that FACT not be cast aside.

Additionally Jesus tells us exactly when He is coming. There is no question when He is coming. We can pinpoint it.

Matt 24 

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

And yet we are told to be ready, we will not know when He is coming.

Matt 24

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

Yeah, He is coming immediately after the tribulation. We can be sure He is coming after the tribulation, post tribulation, no question about it. And yet, He is coming IN AN HOUR THAT WE THINK NOT. Let that FACT sink in.

[The Light]

9 hours ago, truecrosstrueshield said:

Lastly this. Hal lyndsay wrote a book called 88 reasons why Jesus will return in 1988. His book of course is wrong. He's a pre trib teacher still. Do you believe in someone already being wrong? John Hagee wrote a book a few years ago about the blood moons. Saying these may lead to a pre trib rapture for the church. John Hagee was wrong years ago from now. He's a pre trib rapture teacher. .

Jack van Impe announced he believes in UFO's. Not kidding. I stopped watching him after that very episode. He teaches pre trib rapture. .

Tim Lahayes takes people quotes. A number of times he'll take those quotes off. He'll insert his own lines not noticeable. Sometimes he'll change its meaning to shift to his own pre trib teaching . . plus as I got letters from Tim Lahayes along with Ed Hindson. In every letter they're always asking for money. I have a witness here who saw these letters. She couldn't believe how greedy Tim Lahayes and Ed Hindson are . . They said they can't give me all updates unless each person to donate $100 or more a month. . Because I was on SSI I could give $25 to $40 a month. That's not good enough for Tim Lahayes and Ed Hindson end times ministry. Guess they don't like the poor. More pre trib teachers. .

None of the post trib teachers asked for anything except a book. That was it. Who is fair and honest to us?

I'm a concerned Christian. So that Christians would be ready. You don't want to be stuck having no water or food to save. Also you'll have to time to have shelter. The devil doesn't want you to have food or water ready. He wants Christians to believe they won't be here. So Christians won't resist or protest against the Antichrist. If you get ready instead the tribulation that's ahead of us.

 

 

 

It is wise to be prepared. I have food and water ready because the Church will see these events begin to come to pass.  The word also says that we can escape ALL THE THINGS that will come to pass. Do you notice that we can escape and STAND BEFORE THE SON OF MAN. The Church will not be going through the tribulation (70th week of Daniel) We can be worthy to stand before the Son of Man.

Luke 21

36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

As for these pastors and book writers, DON'T FOLLOW MEN. They see things in the word that tells them that there is a pretribulation rapture. However, we can prove that there is a post tribulation rapture. That FACT does not prove that there will not be a pretribulation rapture.

I can tell that you have a heart of gold brother. You are honestly concerned that there are people that are in trouble because they believe in a pretribulation rapture. You think this because you can prove that there is a post tribulation rapture. But does that prove that Jesus is not coming before the tribulation? No, it doesn't. In fact, Jesus directly says that He is coming in an hour that you think not. There will be two raptures, one pretrib (pre 70th week) and one post trib. We can prove this if we just read EXACTLY what the scriptures say. We don't need any smoke and mirrors, we don't need to dream anything up, all we have to do is read what is written and accept what is written.

There is much more danger to the person that trusts that there will not be a pretribulation rapture. What happens to the person that is not ready?

Matt 24

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

There is a reason that Noah is in the ark 7 days before the flood and there is a reason that the very day Lot left Sodom destruction came.

Edited September 2, 2021 by The Light

[missmuffet]

The weaknesses of the post tribulation belief is:

There is clear teaching in Scripture that those who are in Christ are not under condemnation and will never experience the wrath of God Romans 8:1. If believers go through the tribulation they will suffer the wrath of God. No one will be protected. The word "Church" is absent in all biblical passages related to tribulation.The tribulation is only targetted for the unsaved. 

 

[The Light]

4 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

If believers go through the tribulation they will suffer the wrath of God.

This statement is not correct. The tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins. The Church will not be here for the tribulation. However, the twelve tribes will be on the earth during the tribulation. They will be removed from the earth at the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal, which is IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION.

4 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

 

No one will be protected.

Actually, the those in the nation of Israel that flee as instructed will go through the wrath of God in a place of protection that is prepared for them. None of God's people are appointed to wrath.

4 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

The word "Church" is absent in all biblical passages related to tribulation.The tribulation is only targetted for the unsaved. 

 

The Church will not be here for the tribulation. However the twelve tribes across will be on earth during the tribulation. The tribulation occurs during the 70th week of Daniel when God turns His attention to the people of Daniel. Additionally, the tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins.

[missmuffet]

8 minutes ago, The Light said:

This statement is not correct. The tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins. The Church will not be here for the tribulation. However, the twelve tribes will be on the earth during the tribulation. They will be removed from the earth at the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal, which is IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION.

Actually, the those in the nation of Israel that flee as instructed will go through the wrath of God in a place of protection that is prepared for them. None of God's people are appointed to wrath.

The Church will not be here for the tribulation. However the twelve tribes across will be on earth during the tribulation. The tribulation occurs during the 70th week of Daniel when God turns His attention to the people of Daniel. Additionally, the tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins.

The tribulation will be over before the wrath of God begins? Where have you gotten that from? The book of Revelation sure doesn't tell you that. Please give me Scripture for the above belief. 

[The Light]

35 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

The tribulation will be over before the wrath of God begins? Where have you gotten that from? The book of Revelation sure doesn't tell you that. Please give me Scripture for the above belief. 

The tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins. In Matt 24 we can see that immediately after the tribulation Jesus comes.

Matt 24

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Jesus tells us about end times in Matt 24. John tells us about end times in Revelation. All you need to do is find the signs of Jesus coming that Jesus talked about in the book of Revelation. We can see the coming of Jesus and the signs of His coming at the 6th seal.

Rev 6

12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

When we match up with what Jesus tells with what John tells us we can conclude that immediately after the tribulation, Jesus comes and the wrath of God begins.

 

[missmuffet]

1 minute ago, The Light said:

The tribulation is over before the wrath of God begins. In Matt 24 we can see that immediately after the tribulation Jesus comes.

Matt 24

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Jesus tells us about end times in Matt 24. John tells us about end times in Revelation. All you need to do is find the signs of Jesus coming that Jesus talked about in the book of Revelation. We can see the coming of Jesus and the signs of His coming at the 6th seal.

Rev 6

12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

When we match up with what Jesus tells with what John tells us we can conclude that immediately after the tribulation, Jesus comes and the wrath of God begins.

 

The world and the unbelievers goes through the 7 year tribulation and at the end we have the second coming and Jesus Christ comes to this earth to rule. Although many unbelievers will come to Christ during the 7 year tribulation. They will be the tribulation saints. 

[The Light]

Just now, missmuffet said:

The world and the unbelievers goes through the 7 year tribulation and at the end we have the second coming and Jesus Christ comes to this earth to rule. Although many unbelievers will come to Christ during the 7 year tribulation. They will be the tribulation saints. 

The Church will be raptured before the tribulation. The tribulation is the 70th week of Daniel and has nothing to do with the Church. The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened.

It is the 12 tribes across the earth that go through the tribulation. The tribulation occurs during the 70th week of Daniel. 

Dan 9

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

The tribulation saints will mostly be of the 12 tribes as the Church is already in heaven.