Is "The Law" a Curse?

[adamjedgar]

6 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

@adamjedgar the facts about the sins of the children of Jacob are listed in the bible. I do not need to posted them because you have not deny that did not happened. 

You know who they are, the twelve Patriarchs of the Nation of Israel.

I asked if you know why they were not punished and why the Almighty God whose children they were he did not confronted them about and he did not punish them? 

If you respond in a way I do not know and I am puzzled why that happened and it is quite difficult for me to accept it and I wish their sins did not happened, I want them to be Holy, I need them to be Holy.

I will understand your need for that... and if you say "I do not know and then ask "do you know why" then I may surprise you. 

You just have to ask WHY, DO YOU KNOW WHY? 

Because if you ask this question it is also an admission that they have committed those sins, and then when that argument is out of way, and it is established that they committed those sins (unheard sins, very serious sins) and were not punished and the Almighty God, their God , only their God and not the God of anyone else did not confront them...and at that time the only children God had , well most of them, the majority of them but not Joseph and Benjamin were in fact big sinners. If you ask me why I have something to say. 

this is all irrelevant rubbish...that has absolutely nothing to do with the claim that the law is a curse!

 

the curse is the wages of sin...i have already explained this...here is the "self evident " bible verse that tells us this ...Romans Chapter 6:

15What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law, but under grace? Certainly not! 16Do you not know that when you offer yourselves as obedient slaves, you are slaves to the one you obey, whether you are slaves to sin leading to death, or to obedience leading to righteousness? 

23For the wages of sin is death [this is the curse], but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord [this is the salvation].

Edited January 1, 2022 by adamjedgar

[adamjedgar]

let me also add the following... you can also check the relevance of this in the beatitudes found in the new testament in Matthew 5:3-12, and luke 6:20-23 (these are cross references for Psalms 1)

Psalm 1:

1Blessed is the man

who does not walk in the counsel of the wicked,

or set foot on the path of sinners,

or sit in the seat of mockers.

2But his delight is in the Law of the LORD,

and on His law he meditates day and night.

3He is like a tree planted by streams of water,

yielding its fruit in season,

whose leaf does not wither,

and who prospers in all he does.

4Not so the wicked!

For they are like chaff driven off by the wind.

5Therefore the wicked will not stand in the judgment,

nor sinners in the assembly of the righteous.

6For the LORD guards the path of the righteous,

but the way of the wicked will perish.

Edited January 1, 2022 by adamjedgar

[Dennis1209]

1 hour ago, Your closest friendnt said:

I like your line of reasoning, and reading the scriptures It can been seen that from Abraham till the worship of the Golden Calf there was not judgment of the children of Abraham. Non of them was punished for their sins, it was something like that they were under some immunity. 

Cain was punished but they did the same thing like Cain and they were unpunished. 

Don't you find this interesting and the fact that attempts have been made persistently to silence any voice that brings this up.

Any thoughts. 

Yes, it is very interesting. I'm not convinced that my thoughts are correct though? It's open for discussion. Happy New Year!

[Your closest friendnt]

52 minutes ago, adamjedgar said:

this is all irrelevant rubbish...that has absolutely nothing to do with the claim that the law is a curse!

 

the curse is the wages of sin...i have already explained this...here is the "self evident " bible verse that tells us this ...Romans Chapter 6:

15What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law, but under grace? Certainly not! 16Do you not know that when you offer yourselves as obedient slaves, you are slaves to the one you obey, whether you are slaves to sin leading to death, or to obedience leading to righteousness? 

23For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

If this is what you want to discuss very well, you only need to make that clear.

So what you want to discuss is Number one

" the course is the wages of sin". 

In support of that you list Roman 6: 23

"For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God in eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

The last word in Romans 6:23 are in Christ Jesus OUR LORD.

That makes it obvious that the Apostle Paul is addressing believers.

The Apostle Paul begins in verse twenty three by reciting from the Old testament 

Ezekiel 18:4
" Behold, all souls are Mine;
The soul of the father
As well as the soul of the son is Mine;
The soul who sins shall die. 

And through the events in the between the Lord and the people who were part of the Sinai Covenant were subject to that principle and we should not ignore the fact that some times the Lord punish with death all the family for the sins of the Patriarch of the family as it happened in the dessert the man who disobey God to hide the garments in his tent...

The son of David was punished for the sin of David.

He had to die so David can live.

The children of Saul died the same day with him even though they did not comit any sin, because of the sin of their Father. 

The children of Sodom and Gomora died because of the sins of the people in their city.

The same with Noah's flood.

Twenty tree thousand Israelites died for the sin of David so David lived this another strange situation the sinner lived and the innocent died 23.ooo thousand young men.

In Ezekiel 18:4 the Lord said no more, it will never happen this again and from now on THE SINNER WILL DIE.

And this is between the Israelites and Lord God.

Paul in Romans 6:23 is telling us that we need to thank God that in Christ Jesus things have changed that not only the sinner does not died but he remains in the eternal Life the gift of the eternal Life, because he also has the imputed robe of righteousness in Jesus Christ. 

No more the sinner dies in the new covenant which was ratified with the blood of Jesus Christ.  

Edited January 1, 2022 by Your closest friendnt

[adamjedgar]

3 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said:

If this is what you want to discuss very well, you only need to make that clear.

So what you want to discuss is Number one

" the course is the wages of sin". 

In support of that you list Roman 6: 23

"For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God in eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

The last word in Romans 6:23 are in Christ Jesus OUR LORD.

That makes it obvious that the Apostle Paul is addressing believers.

The Apostle Paul begins in verse twenty three by reciting from the Old testament 

Ezekiel 18:4
" Behold, all souls are Mine;
The soul of the father
As well as the soul of the son is Mine;
The soul who sins shall die. 

And through the events in the between the Lord and the people who were part of the Sinai Covenant were subject to that principle and we should not ignore the fact that some times the Lord punish with death all the family for the sins of the Patriarch of the family as it happened in the dessert the man who disobey God to hide the garments in his tent...

The son of David was punished for the sin of David.

He had to die so David can live.

The children of Saul died the same day with him even though they did not comit any sin, because of the sin of their Father. 

The children of Sodom and Gomora died because of the sins of the people in their city.

The same with Noah's flood.

Twenty tree thousand Israelites died for the sin of David so David lived this another strange situation the sinner lived and the innocent died 23.ooo thousand young men.

In Ezekiel 18:4 the Lord said no more, it will never happen this again and from now on THE SINNER WILL DIE.

And this is between the Israelites and Lord God.

Paul in Romans 6:23 is telling us that we need to thank God that in Christ Jesus things have changed that not only the sinner does not died but he remains in the eternal Life the gift of the eternal Life, because he also has the imputed robe of righteousness in Jesus Christ. 

No more the sinner dies in the new covenant which was ratified with the blood of Jesus Christ.  

You are personally attempting to make that correlation based on errant premise...the premise that "the perfect law of God is a curse".

Paul states in the book of Romans in Chapter 4 (long before chapter 6 btw)

Romans 4:13For the promise to Abraham and his offspring that he would be heir of the world was not given through the law, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.

Romans 4:16Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may rest on grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.

Romans 4:9Is this blessing only on the circumcised, or also on the uncircumcised? We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness. 10In what context was it credited? Was it after his circumcision, or before? It was not after, but before.

 

Your point about us being saved in Jesus....this has nothing to do with keeping the law...I state it again (ive done this so many times now it should be like a traffic light for you)...WE ARE NOT SAVED BY THE LAW!

Gods first commandment was given in Genesis chapter 2 (please read this in your bible)...

THIS COMMAND WAS GIVEN BEFORE SIN EVER ENTERED THIS WORLD.

16And the LORD God commanded him [Adam], “You may eat freely from every tree of the garden, 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; for in the day that you eat of it, you will surely die.”

 

Now i am going to throw your own logic straight back at you, and from that (without a single bible text quoted below) even you have to admit your conclusion is in gross error...

You claim Gods law is a curse

You claim the law maker is fallible and created a errant law

you claim the law maker (God) is both fallible and cursed.

The most fundamental theme of the bible proves both your logic here and therefore your claim is 100% false!!!

 

The problem with developing a theology is that you cannot simply pluck out a random hypothesis, then seek to prove the hypothesis true when said hypothesis has a significant fundamental flaw in it..."that God's perfect law is a curse". I say again, in seeking to prove the errant hypothesis, you are seeking to prove God makes mistakes and that he is in fact fallible. 

 

I do not believe God makes mistakes...I do not believe God is fallable,

I do believe God is perfect and all knowing

I do believe that every command God makes is a reflection of himself and his character... perfect,

I believe Gods 10 commandments are perfect

 

so, its only logical based on my above premises, Gods law is not a curse!. It is Satan who has attempted to make that claim...that was the entire point of his treachery in the first place...that Gods law was not just and therefore God was not just!

Now i am going to supplement that conclusion with another well known bible truth...I am not saved by the law...my works cannot save me. My works are but filthy rags. I am saved by grace through faith in Jesus dying on the cross for my sins.

Jesus paid the price "for the wages of sin is death" for me...for the consequences of breaking Gods eternal law must be paid in full. I can now come bodly before the throne and be deemed righteous because i wear the cloak of Jesus Righteousness. Jesus attained that because He, and only He lived a perfect life according to the law!

 

So the wages for my sin, remembering sin is transgression of Gods eternal law (10 commandments), have been paid in full by my saviour! 

Edited January 1, 2022 by adamjedgar

[appy]

18 hours ago, Josheb said:

 

First, just for the sake of clarification and context, would you please list the requirements of the new covenant God has established? 

The greatest thing in our lives is knowing Jesus personally. Our responsibility is to exercise faith and trust in Christ, for we are saved by God's grace and not by our own merits. We remain conscious of the fact that God has fully accepted each of us, as his son or daughter, making us a new creation and one in him, filled with the Holy Spirit.

If we walk in the spirit, trusting him with our lives we are abiding in Jesus, and he in us; and thus,  we bear much fruit. Love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. These are the things we should be striving for. Against such there is no law. And those who are in Christ have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

[appy]

18 hours ago, Josheb said:

Second, how did you get the two columns of your post set up? 

Years ago, I used to ask my hub how he did some things and he would say..... “very carefully”. Arrrrgh, that wasn't helpful !!

Getting the columns was not easy. I had to go back and forth editing my post a lot. A bit of a pain and time consuming to do.

[Alive]

22 minutes ago, appy said:

Years ago, I used to ask my hub how he did some things and he would say..... “very carefully”. Arrrrgh, that wasn't helpful !!

Getting the columns was not easy. I had to go back and forth editing my post a lot. A bit of a pain and time consuming to do.

Try it first in a writing program and then cut and paste. Not sure if the formatting would hold, but it might make it easier to square away.

[appy]

I did try that, still had to go back and edit the post.  I use a writing program  to precompose my posts, in case they get lost in cyberland, in that way I don't have to retype my post.

[other one]

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