Hell

[RV_Wizard]

How much better than to wonder what awaits us in Hell than to accept Christ and worship the one true God; creator of all that exists?  How great will it be on the day of rapture to leap into the air and be swept up with Christ in the sky?  How great to close our eyes in death and have them open in Glory, surrounded by absolute peace and absolute love in the presence of the Father?

I have ideas of what awaits the non-believer and the unsaved, but frankly, I wish to never know that answer.  The only thing that matters is that the Lord Jesus Christ paid the price for our sins so that we don't ever have to find out.  The kingdom of Heaven is offered freely to all who will accept it.  Wealth cannot buy salvation.  A lifetime of self-sacrifice cannot pay our entrance.  We'll pay $500 or more to take our family to Disney World, but adamantly refuse free admission to Paradise.  Is it any wonder we incur the wrath of God?  Is it any wonder that dishonoring Christ's sacrifice is so egregious?

A ;loving God doesn't send people top Hell.  People choose to separate themselves from God in this world.  They separation is eternal in the next.

[Starise]

6 hours ago, RV_Wizard said:

How much better than to wonder what awaits us in Hell than to accept Christ and worship the one true God; creator of all that exists?  How great will it be on the day of rapture to leap into the air and be swept up with Christ in the sky?  How great to close our eyes in death and have them open in Glory, surrounded by absolute peace and absolute love in the presence of the Father?

I have ideas of what awaits the non-believer and the unsaved, but frankly, I wish to never know that answer.  The only thing that matters is that the Lord Jesus Christ paid the price for our sins so that we don't ever have to find out.  The kingdom of Heaven is offered freely to all who will accept it.  Wealth cannot buy salvation.  A lifetime of self-sacrifice cannot pay our entrance.  We'll pay $500 or more to take our family to Disney World, but adamantly refuse free admission to Paradise.  Is it any wonder we incur the wrath of God?  Is it any wonder that dishonoring Christ's sacrifice is so egregious?

A ;loving God doesn't send people top Hell.  People choose to separate themselves from God in this world.  They separation is eternal in the next.

I can't entirely not feel bad for those people who will go there. Even the worst of sinners. Focusing on those souls who will be condemned with no way out is a tragic thought for me and it motivates me to want to share the gospel with them in any way I can, even though I can't save them. Only God can do that. 

Since we still live in the saving age where men can come to the Lord let's pray for all men.

[Hobie_]

On 1/26/2022 at 3:55 PM, missmuffet said:

The Bible tells us that those in hell will be tormented by the fire forever and ever. That is for an eternity never ending. Just like those who are believers will be with God for an eternity. Those in hell with suffer for an eternity as well just in a different place. 

No, they suffer the second death which is they perish, and it is for eternity, so it is a eternal death...

[missmuffet]

57 minutes ago, Hobie_ said:

No, they suffer the second death which is they perish, and it is for eternity, so it is a eternal death...

That is not what the Bible teaches us but suit yourself.

What is the second death?

https://www.gotquestions.org/img/print.svghttps://www.gotquestions.org/img/volume.svg

ANSWER

The second death is mentioned on multiple occasions in the book of Revelation and is synonymous with the lake of fire. It is a “death” in that it is a separation from God, the Giver of life. It is called the “second” one because it follows physical death.

Revelation 21:8 explains the second death in the most detail: “The cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars – their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”

Three other places in Revelation also mention the second death. The first is Revelation 2:11: “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt at all by the second death.” In this verse, Jesus promises that believers (“overcomers”; see 1 John 5:4) will not experience the lake of fire. The second death is exclusively for those who have rejected Christ. It is not a place believers in Christ should fear.

Revelation 20:6 speaks of the second death in relation to a future period called the Millennium: “Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.” This verse notes three important facts. First, those who die for their faith in Jesus during the Tribulation will later be resurrected to enter the Millennium and live with Him. Second, these martyrs will escape the lake of fire or second death. Third, they will reign with Christ.

The second death is also mentioned in Revelation 20:14-15: “Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. If anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.” At the end of time, even death and the grave (Hades) will be thrown into the lake of fire. In addition, every person not included in the book of life will be thrown into the lake of fire. This condition will be final; the destination is permanent.

In summary, the second death is a reference to the lake of fire where those who are separated from God by their sin will dwell for eternity. This judgment was recorded in Scripture as a warning to unbelievers to seek the salvation that Jesus Christ provides. The coming judgment should also challenge believers to share their faith. There is a vast difference between the final destination of those who know Christ and those who do not.

Edited February 12, 2022 by missmuffet

[Hobie_]

11 hours ago, missmuffet said:

That is not what the Bible teaches us but suit yourself.

What is the second death?

https://www.gotquestions.org/img/print.svghttps://www.gotquestions.org/img/volume.svg

ANSWER

The second death is mentioned on multiple occasions in the book of Revelation and is synonymous with the lake of fire. It is a “death” in that it is a separation from God, the Giver of life. It is called the “second” one because it follows physical death.

Revelation 21:8 explains the second death in the most detail: “The cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars – their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”

Three other places in Revelation also mention the second death. The first is Revelation 2:11: “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt at all by the second death.” In this verse, Jesus promises that believers (“overcomers”; see 1 John 5:4) will not experience the lake of fire. The second death is exclusively for those who have rejected Christ. It is not a place believers in Christ should fear.

Revelation 20:6 speaks of the second death in relation to a future period called the Millennium: “Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.” This verse notes three important facts. First, those who die for their faith in Jesus during the Tribulation will later be resurrected to enter the Millennium and live with Him. Second, these martyrs will escape the lake of fire or second death. Third, they will reign with Christ.

The second death is also mentioned in Revelation 20:14-15: “Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. If anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.” At the end of time, even death and the grave (Hades) will be thrown into the lake of fire. In addition, every person not included in the book of life will be thrown into the lake of fire. This condition will be final; the destination is permanent.

In summary, the second death is a reference to the lake of fire where those who are separated from God by their sin will dwell for eternity. This judgment was recorded in Scripture as a warning to unbelievers to seek the salvation that Jesus Christ provides. The coming judgment should also challenge believers to share their faith. There is a vast difference between the final destination of those who know Christ and those who do not.

When you are separated from God, that means for eternity, He will never bring you back because He has the power. But to be separated is the end of any chance of life, and you will not be brought back. We see the saints that are given eternal life as their reward:

Revelation 20:4-5

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

There shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the saints to eternal life in the first resurrection at the Second Coming, then after the 1000 years of the wicked to damnation in the lake of fire....

John 5:29
And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

The first resurrection is of the saints to eternal life, then the wicked as the verses make clear. The wicked are going to suffer the second death which is damnation in the lake of fire.

Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The 'second death' is the one you are not appointed to, but you choose by rejecting Christ and eternal life. The wicked suffer the true eternal separation from God as they will be consumed in the lake fire which is the second death.

Edited February 12, 2022 by Hobie_

[Starise]

On 2/12/2022 at 9:35 AM, Walter Goraj jr said:

So, you don't believe that hell is a place of eternal, fiery torture,  for ever and ever?

I believe the bible says  hell is eternal for the fallen angels. Most of the texts I read on men as it pertains to hell point me to an eventual end in hell for those wicked unbelievers. They will be judged individually, found wanting not covered under the blood of Christ, escorted to the edge of it and thrown in and burned up.

Several texts seem to support an eternal place of torment for men until I dig deeper into the meanings of those texts comparing them to others.

I might have said this in the OP, there is some confusion in scripture between punishment for men .vs punishment for fallen angels. Hell was originally made for the fallen angels. Then there is the matter of differing words used in translations for Hell coupled with an overlay of Greek thought and teachings at the time.

[Hobie_]

On 1/24/2022 at 5:26 PM, Josheb said:

Do you mean, "How do we know for certain we have all of scripture?"? 

 

Because the Bible was compiled long after the scriptures were completed. Scripture and the Bible are not the same thing. The Bible is a record fo what was spoken/written by God and those He inspired to record it. The Bible is simply a bunch of manuscripts compiled long afterward. For example, we know from the two letters to Corinth that there are at least two other letters, maybe three. The missing letters are likely lost to time but who knows, maybe so cache of manuscripts dating closer the originals than the manuscripts we now possess wil be unearthed and maybe that cache will include the missing epistles. Maybe a copy (or the original?) of Matthew in Aramaic will be discovered? 

 

We have all of the Bible. We definitely do not have all the apostles wrote in the NT era. Maybe not all letters were inspired. Maybe God saw fit to lose what was lost. We have what we have. 

I think those things that were not of God, were seen and kept out, as we see in the Apocrypha. Many false doctrines came into the church supported by the writings of the Gnostics as we see in the Alexandria Manuscripts and by the Apocrypha.

Edited February 14, 2022 by Hobie_

[Starise]

Yes.

[Hobie_]

On 1/26/2022 at 3:01 PM, Riverwalker said:

The lake of fire COMES AFTER judgment day

¹³ The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. ¹⁴ Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second ^[d]death.

What in this case would you consider 'hades', the Greek meaning or the original meaning... See the problem..

[Riverwalker]

Because it refers to death an hades.... I seems to be what we call Hell