Jump to content

Hobie_

Advanced Member
  • Content Count

    379
  • Joined

  • Last visited

Community Reputation

150 Neutral

2 Followers

About Hobie_

  • Rank
    Advanced Member

Profile Information

  • Gender
    Male

Recent Profile Visitors

1,691 profile views
  1. Did I read correctly, the Pope is denying Hell? I came across this exchange between the Pope and the media.. "Your Holiness, in our previous meeting you told me that our species will disappear in a certain moment and that God, still out of his creative force, will create new species. You have never spoken to me about the souls who died in sin and will go to hell to suffer it for eternity. You have however spoken to me of good souls, admitted to the contemplation of God. But what about bad souls? Where are they punished? “They are not punished, those who repent obtain the forgiveness of God and enter the rank of souls who contemplate him, but those who do not repent and cannot therefore be forgiven disappear. There is no hell, there is the disappearance of sinful souls.”..... Is this really what the Pope said. Anybody have more on this?
  2. Lets look at what Jesus said: Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go that I may awake him out of sleep. Then said his disciples, if he sleep he shall do well. Howbeit, Jesus spoke of his death; but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead. John 11:11-14 The disciples were confused and thought Christ meant natural sleep, but He meant the sleep of death. On His arrival Jesus found that Lazarus had already been four days in the tomb. John 11:17 While conversing with Martha, He tried to comfort her by saying, 'Thy brother shall rise again.' Martha saith unto him, 'I know that He shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.' John 11:23,24 Martha knew that life would be restored to Lazarus only in the resurrection at the last day. Jesus demonstrated through the resurrection of Lazarus that He was the One who could resurrect the dead according to His claim: I am the resurrection and the life. John 11:25 The Scriptures in both Old and New Testaments are very clear on this issue. Life to the dead will be restored in the resurrection on the last day. (1 Corinthians 15:51-55, Job 19:25-26; Job 14:10-15; Psalm 17:15; Daniel 12:13) There will be separate resurrections for the righteous and for the wicked. John 5:28-29 states: Marvel not at this; for the hour is coming, in which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil unto the resurrection of damnation. For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ shall rise first.1 Thessalonians 4:16 NKJV But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Revelation 20:5 NKJV That same voice that raised Lazarus from the grave will be heard on that last day of this world's history, calling forth those who have slept in the graves of the earth. Christ will recreate the righteous dead, or "dead in Christ", and breathe into them the breath of eternal life, and they shall enter Heaven. Revelation 20:6: Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. When Jesus called Lazarus from the tomb, ...he cried with a loud voice, 'Lazarus, come forth'. John 11:43 That voice raised dead Lazarus to life. "He that was dead came forth", and Jesus said: Loose him, and let him go. John 11:44 Nothing at all is stated about what transpired during those four days in which Lazarus was dead. Christ made no statement, neither did Martha or even Lazarus himself. The fact, of course, is that there was nothing to report about what happened after he died, no bright lights or gentle clouds or about the realm of the dead, simply because he had experienced the sleep of death which is a state of absolute silence and oblivion.
  3. The early church held to this belief at the time of the apostles as it was the original Christian teaching and later as we can see, theological arguments based on this belief were also used to contest the Roman Catholic doctrine of purgatory and masses for the dead. Now if there was ever a man that deserved to go straight to heaven at the point of death, it was Jesus Christ! Yet on resurrection morning Jesus said to Mary Magdalene, "Touch Me not, for I am not yet ascended to My Father" John 20:17. The Son of God who is our example in all things died, was buried, and then after He was resurrected went to heaven. So it is with the Christians. Death Burial Resurrection Then go to heaven The Apostle Peter who was filled with the Holy Spirit spoke concerning King David; word's to clear to misunderstand. "Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the Patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried and his sepulcher is with us to this day" Acts 2:29. For David is NOT ascended into the heavens. The dead Christians are not ascended into heaven praising God on the streets of gold. "The dead praise not the Lord" Psalms 115:17. According to the prophet David, "In death there is no remembrance of Thee" Psalms 6:5. In fact, the dead have no thoughts or feelings either good or bad while in the grave. "For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing... Also their love and their hatred, and their envy is now perished" Ecclesiastes 9:5,6. "His breath goeth forth he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish" Psalms 146:4. The dead do not communicate with the living! In fact the dead cannot haunt houses either! "He that goeth down to the grave shall come up no more, he shall return no more to his house, neither shall his place know him anymore" Job 7:9,10. They await the resurrection to wake them from the grave, which is the hope of Christians. Martin Luther wrote "“Our Lord has written the promise of resurrection, not in books alone, but in every leaf in springtime.” At death man is asleep in the grave not knowing anything nor having any thoughts until the resurrection. There to awake to either everlasting life, of everlasting destruction. "The hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation." John 5:28,29. The Bible refers to death as a sleep 66 times. Clearly this is what happens at death, but yet there is struggle to accept what the Bible has, and go to the Papal definition, with its tradition or views.
  4. This is not an easy subject, but we must understand what scripture gives us and discern. God cannot reward men with the bliss of heaven or the pain of hell before they are judged, and then resurrected to receive one or the other. The Bible nowhere says that rewards are given at death, but at the end of the world. Yet there arose from within the church, a doctrine of a intermediate state before they are judged even if have to suffer for the interim, and holds that they cannot be stopped from heaven as they are immortal notwithstanding any judgment. On December 19th, 1513 at the Fifth Lateran Council, Pope Leo X issued a Bull (Apostolici regimis) declaring, “We do condemn and reprobate all who assert that the intelligent soul is mortal” (Damnamus et reprobamus omnes assertenes animan intellectivam mortalem esse). This was directed against the growing “heresy” of those who denied the natural immortality of the soul, and the avowed conditional immortality of man. The Bull also decreed that those who adhere to such erroneous assertions should be shunned and punished as heretics. This view further suggests that at the resurrection of the righteous, the body and the soul are reconnected and salvation is now complete in a glorified state. This caused a elevation of a controversy that went far beyond what the papacy would have wanted, lets see what happened beforehand. "The event that would propel Martin Luther into historic prominence was his attempt to invite debate on the abuse of the doctrine of indulgences by the papal emissary Johan Tetzel on October 31, 1517. But indulgences cannot be understood without understanding purgatory. This was a scholastic doctrine invented by the medieval church to explain how God deals with those who are good but are not good enough to merit immediate entry into heaven. Catholicism taught that Christ’s atonement on the cross (collectively) and the sacrament of baptism (individually) freed humans from “original” sin and made it possible to gain access to heaven. However, because of human’s continuing propensity to commit “mortal sins,” this created a further barrier. Fortunately the church on earth has delegated authority to forgive sins through the sacrament of penance. The medieval authorities made a distinction between guilt attached to a mortal sin and the penalty or satisfaction that was still due to God even when the guilt was removed. The priest through penance could only remove a small fraction of that satisfaction due so that the remainder (along with the punishment for less serious or venial sins) would have to be paid off after death in purgatory. The time in this prison of purgatory would be measured in tens, hundreds, or thousands of years. So when the church began to issue indulgences (certificates remitting part or all of the satisfaction due for sin), they were expressed in terms of “days” and “years” equivalent to earthy penances so that the perception was that the experience of purgatory was a temporary one. Indulgences were first made available to assist souls in purgatory by a papal bull of 1476.... The immediate cause of Luther’s stand on soul sleep was the issue of purgatory, with its focus on the conscious sufferings of anguished souls. In his famous 95 theses, which he posted at the church door at Wittenberg, Luther addresses purgatory from the viewpoint of a believing Catholic. Martin Luther’s first essay, Die Sieben Puszpsalm appeared in the spring of 1517, and according to Heinz Bluhm was met with instantaneous success. Martin Luther would go on to be one of the most read and beloved German writers. Some even consider him to be the greatest master of the German language. His 95 theses would capture the imagination of 17 the German people and spark the flame of the Reformation."http://digitalcommons.andrews.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1118&context=jats There are generally two views concerning the state of the dead among Christians. The first view asserts that when a person dies, his soul survives death and continues to exist in some place. For those who are saved, they go straight into paradise. For those who are not so righteous, they go into some halfway house called purgatory (the Catholic view) where they are purified and made ready for paradise. Catholic teaching explicitly affirms the immortality of the soul, but its not supported by scripture. The second view is that the soul is not a separate entity from the body. The body is a soul. We are all living souls. At death there is no surviving entity called the soul. The soul is dead; it is not immortal. In other words, the soul is simply the person, not a part of the person. It does not and cannot survive death. The person in this state is totally unaware of anything; the Bible calls it a sleep. It is the whole man who lives, the whole man who dies, and the whole man who is resurrected. At the resurrection the person is raised again from the dead and becomes a living soul. God's plan provides for the total eradication of sin and sinners from God's universe. After the judgment at the end, the wicked are cast in the Lake of Fire for the final punishment, and sinners will be no more. Eternal punishment means complete and final separation from God, a eternal exclusion from the privilege of life. In the Old Testament much was revealed by God concerning the specifics of the afterlife. Believers died in hope of what God in his mercy would yet do for them. Their trust was in God who would ultimately redeem them, and we see their faith took concrete shape, as in Psalm 49... Psalm 49:15 15 But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receive me. Selah. or in Job 19... Job 19:25-27 25 For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: 26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God: 27 Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me. The future resurrection is spoken of in Daniel 12... Daniel 12:2 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. We also see it in the New Testament... Luke 14:14 And thou shalt be blessed; for they cannot recompense thee: for thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just. John 5:28-29 28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. In the New Testament, Jesus affirms the certainty of the coming resurrection which, of course, requires the existence of an intermediate state. These passages shed light on it. In Matthew 22:31, Jesus affirms the coming resurrection of the dead, but then you have this. Matthew 22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living. So how is He the God of the living, well we know God can raise anyone from the grave and made alive, as Lazarus was. Christ by His By death paid the ransom for us so we might live again. But who are the ones who will be with God and have eternal life, its not the wicked. So what is the intermediate state of the dead as they await the resurrection at the Second Coming of Christ, let look at what scripture says.
  5. Its nothing but the old ancestor worship and pagan veneration of the dead... "Ancestor worship is found in many forms in cultures throughout the world, Veneration of ancestors is regarded as a means through which an individual can assure his or her own immortality. Children are valued because they could provide for the spirits of their parents after death. Family members who remained together and venerated their forebears with strict adherence to prescribed ritual find comfort in the belief that the souls of their ancestors are receiving proper spiritual nourishment and that they are insuring their own soul's nourishment after death. * Ancestor worship is perhaps the world's oldest religion. Some anthropologists theorize that it grew out of belief in some societies that dead people still exist in some form because they appear in dreams. Ancestor worship involves the belief that the dead live on as spirits and that it is the responsibility of their family members and descendants to make sure that are well taken care of. If they are not they may come back and cause trouble to the family members and descendants that have ignored or disrespcted them.
  6. Martin Luther himself had much struggle on this issue, and I came across several explanations, but this one seems to capture it.. "Luther's beliefs on purgatory evolved over time...Any investigation into what Luther believed about purgatory, must start at the beginning of the Reformation - Luther's composition of 95 Theses against corruption in the Catholic Church in 1517. Among the 95 points, more than a dozen are about purgatory, including: Hell, purgatory, and heaven seem to differ the same as despair, fear, and assurance of salvation. (#16) Furthermore, it does not seem proved, either by reason or by Scripture, that souls in purgatory are outside the state of merit, that is, unable to grow in love. (#18) As a matter of fact, the pope remits to souls in purgatory no penalty which, according to canon law, they should have paid in this life. (#22) They [the papacy] preach only human doctrines who say that as soon as the money clinks into the money chest, the soul flies out of purgatory. (#27)".... In Confession Concerning Christ's Supper (1528), explicitly stated for the first time that purgatory was a false teaching. Two years later, in "Exhortation to All Clergy Assembled at Augsburg" Luther condemned the doctrine of purgatory and wrote that falsely claiming the ability to free souls from purgatory had brought great shame but "lots of money" for the church. Also in 1530, he wrote Revocation of Purgatory, a tract denouncing the doctrine of purgatory." So it took time even for Luther to understand what a falsehood this was and to reject it.
  7. We have this 'doctrine' put out from the Roman Catholic Church.... "III. THE FINAL PURIFICATION, OR PURGATORY 1030 All who die in God's grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified, are indeed assured of their eternal salvation; but after death they undergo purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven. 1031 The Church gives the name Purgatory to this final purification of the elect, which is entirely different from the punishment of the damned.606 The Church formulated her doctrine of faith on Purgatory especially at the Councils of Florence and Trent. The tradition of the Church, by reference to certain texts of Scripture, speaks of a cleansing fire:607 As for certain lesser faults, we must believe that, before the Final Judgment, there is a purifying fire. He who is truth says that whoever utters blasphemy against the Holy Spirit will be pardoned neither in this age nor in the age to come. From this sentence we understand that certain offenses can be forgiven in this age, but certain others in the age to come.608 1032 This teaching is also based on the practice of prayer for the dead, already mentioned in Sacred Scripture: "Therefore [Judas Maccabeus] made atonement for the dead, that they might be delivered from their sin."609 From the beginning the Church has honored the memory of the dead and offered prayers in suffrage for them, above all the Eucharistic sacrifice, so that, thus purified, they may attain the beatific vision of God.610 The Church also commends almsgiving, indulgences, and works of penance undertaken on behalf of the dead: Let us help and commemorate them. If Job's sons were purified by their father's sacrifice, why would we doubt that our offerings for the dead bring them some consolation? Let us not hesitate to help those who have died and to offer our prayers for them.611" ...(Catechism of the Catholic Church III. The Final Purification, or Purgatory.) This is one of the false doctrines that led Martin Luther to take a stand against the Papacy. Purgatory as a doctrine teaches that a Christian's soul must burn in purgatory after death until all of their sins have been purged. To speed up the purging process, money could be paid to a priest so he could pray and have special masses for an earlier release, and much money was made with this doctrine. Purgatory is given as a way that no matter how sinful or unbelieving, when you die, you go to Purgatory and get things sorted out and finally get to heaven, so no acceptance of Christ is needed, you can buy your way in. But is it in the Bible, if you look it doesnt show, so where did it come from. It comes as no surprise to see it is a corrupt pagan doctrine, which was allowed into the church. This pagan idea began creeping into the church around the end of the sixth century, and it has no scriptural support. In fact, Jesus warned us about this pagan practice in Matthew 23:14 when He spoke of those who devoured widows houses and made long prayers for a pretence. Psalm 49:6-7 tells us that a person couldn't redeem a loved one, even if such a place did exist: "They that trust in their wealth, and boast themselves in the multitude of their riches; None of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:" Peter addresses this issue in Acts 8:20 when he says, "Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money." God's word is clearly against the doctrine of purgatory. The Greeks, as in some measure the Egyptians before them, created myths of the afterlife which spread throughout the Hellenistic world, and even into words which were used when the Hebrew text was translated into the Greek. Scripture clearly rejects the Greek notion of the immortality of the soul disembodied from the here and now as spirit beings, and early Christians affirmed the resurrection of the body just as Lazuras was resurrected by Christ. So there is no place for a underworld depicted in Greek myths or place of cleansing by fire such as purgotary where spirit beings are left till they are ready to be reunited with God, it comes from other origins which we shall see. Purgatory as a transitional condition has from many sources, a origin from the pagan belief of caring for the dead and praying for them, and to the belief that prayer for the dead contributed to their afterlife purification. Pagan tradition created this place of purgatory which leaves hope after death for the wicked, who, at the time of their death, are unrepentant and cling to their love of sin. In Egypt, substantially the same doctrine of purgatory was taught as in modern times and its priests created grand funerals and masses for the dead, along with celebration of prayer and other services for the soul of the dead. The priest who officiated at the burial service was selected from the grade of Pontiffs who wore the leopard skin; but various other rites were performed by one of the minor priests to the mummies, previous to their being lowered into the pit of the tomb after that ceremony. They practiced elaborate ceremonies to prepare the pharaohs for their next life, constructing massive pyramids and other elaborate tombs filled with luxuries the deceased were supposed to need in the hereafter. The famous Book of the Dead, a collection of ancient Egyptian funerary and ritual texts, describes in great detail how to meet the challenges of the afterlife. The pagan Egyptian belief was when the body died, parts of its soul known as ka (body double) and the ba (personality) would go to the Kingdom of the Dead. While the soul dwelt in the Fields of Aaru, Osiris demanded work as restitution for the protection he provided. Statues were placed in the tombs to serve as substitutes for the deceased. The Egyptian belief in the immortality of the soul existed centuries before Judaism, Hellenism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity, and Islam. According to Herodotus, eventually the Greeks adopted from the Egyptians the belief in the immortality of the soul. He wrote: The Egyptians also were the first who asserted the doctrine that the soul of man is immortal . . . This opinion, some among the Greeks have at different periods of time adopted as their own. The Greek philosopher Socrates (470-399 B. C.) traveled to Egypt to consult the Egyptians on their teachings on the immortality of the soul.Upon his return to Greece, he imparted this teaching to his most famous pupil, Plato....... In Greece the doctrine of a purgatory was spread through the Greek mystery religions and even was spoken by one of its major philosophers. Plato, speaking of the future judgment of the dead, holds out the hope of final deliverance for all, but maintains that, of "those who are judged," some must first "proceed to a subterranean place of judgment, where they shall sustain the punishment they have deserved." The ancient Greeks sacrificed on the thirteenth day (after death) to Mercury as the conductor of the dead, they also had sacrifice which, according to Plato, "was offered for the living and the dead, and was supposed to free them from all the evils to which the wicked are liable when they have left this world. In ancient Rome, the pagan priests also picked up and spread purgatory to the pagans, but as a belief in the early church it was not immediately picked up. From earliest times Greek religious beliefs were a strong influence in Italy, and the Graeco-Roman world was essentially one in its religious and philosophic views of the afterlife.There was no mention of the doctrine during the first two centuries of the church, it has no basis in scripture, the apostles did not teach it, nor did Christ. In all pagan religions you will find a similar description of a place after death where everyone can be absolved of their sin, not in any way connected to what the Bible says. In the pagan purgatory, fire, water, wind, were represented as combining to purge away the stain of sin, and has its roots in the Babylonian belief of Tammuz or Zoroaster, the great God of the ancient fire-worshippers. The doctrine of purgatory is purely pagan, and in no way from scripture as those who die in Christ no purgatory is or can be needed as it teaches that Christs blood cleanseth true believers from all sin, not purgatory. Scripture does not tell us of at death being put through altered spiritual states of immortality till we are cleansed by purgatory fires and then go to eternal life or heaven, but clearly teaches that immortality is not an innate human possession, but a conditional gift of eternal life given to believers at the resurrection. Now some people point to Jesus' enunciation of the unpardonable sin as proof for Purgatory. Let us quickly review this Scripture. "And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come." [Matthew 12:32] This reference to two worlds is held to be proof of Purgatory in the Bible, but that has nothing about purgartory. The expression "either in this world or in the world to come" does not imply that some sins are forgiven after death; however, it is a strong way of stating the truth that the unrepentant sinner will never be forgiven, as we see from the parallel passages of this Scripture (Luke 12:10, especially Mark 3:29).. The doctrine of Purgatory is not only without Biblical proof, but it is against the clear and consistent teaching of Scripture. the Bible nowhere speaks of a temporary place of punishment after death for believers; however, it does clearly state that when the believer dies, he rests in the grave and becomes dust, a place that no living loved one can effect in any way. "Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours ..." [Revelation 14:13] Others point to Matthew 5:25-26 as the basis for Purgatory. Let us review that Scripture: "Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison. Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, until thou hast paid the uttermost farthing." Matthew 5:25-26. This "prison" thus implied in this Scripture is supposed to be Purgatory. The implication in this Scripture is also that, eventually, the prisoner will pay his final bill and be set free. This implication is held to be consistent with the teaching of Purgatory, that it is not eternal, and eventually, everyone will get out of it, and go on to Heaven, perfectly purified. But it was a literal prison the verse refers to not purgatory by any stretch of the imagination, or whatever the pagan mystery religions tried to come up with. In fact, neither the word nor the concept of sin-purifying fire is found in Scripture or worse paying to cleanse a dead person of sin as a way to heaven. Scripture leaves absolutely no possibility for sin to be purged away by anything other than the blood of Jesus Christ. The apostle John wrote with irrefutable clarity, "The blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin" and "all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:7, 9). John did not say "some" sins or "most" sins, but all sin. The Roman church was confronted with this in the 16th century when the Reformers protested its practice of buying and selling of God's grace through indulgences. Backed into a corner, the Council of Trent tried to tie it to the apocryphal books not part of the canon of Scripture. These were a collection of uninspired books by writers influenced by the Greek belief in the immortality of the soul, prayer for the dead, and denial of the resurrection, who put these teachings what in what was known as the Apocrypha. The council ignored the fact that the Jewish scribes never recognized the apocryphal books as inspired or part of the Hebrew Scriptures and it was rejected outright in 90 A.D. at the Council of Jamnia (Jabneh). Clearly they saw the danger as it was obviously pagan myths and beliefs mixed into these apocryphal books and they clearly saw that God did not inspire the writers of the Apocrypha. This is why the Apocrypha was never included in the original canon of 66 books.
  8. Many people know about God, but how many Christians actually are converted and follow God. As Christ did at Gethsemane we must set aside all and follow Gods will. Jesus came across someone who asked this same question: Matthew 19:16-17 "16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.' This young ruler obviously lived “a good life.” He’d convinced himself that he had “made it” in both before others and in his spiritual life. Yet, for all that, he sensed something was missing. Was Jesus telling the rich young ruler to do something meritorious when He told him to keep the commandments? Obviously not, for salvation is "not of works, lest any man should boast." But was Jesus telling this man plainly what the condition of salvation was? If we will enter into eternal life, what is necessary? What was Christ saying to the rich young ruler. Was obedience a condition or a requirement that we must meet before God can save us? If we look, Christ wanted more than obedience, Christ was showing that true obedience includes our outward deeds, but it is not just our outward deeds. True obedience is both the outward deed and the inner motive that prompts the deed. We see Christ get to this with the rich young ruler: Matthew 19:20-22 "20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? 21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. 22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions." In order to be saved a person must be converted, and conversion is what makes true obedience possible. Unconverted people cannot truly obey God, they can "talk" about God, but not fully "walk" with Him. The condition or the basis for our salvation is faith. The result of our salvation is obedience. Those who aren't really converted and will be lost at the end, can’t obey. The truly converted or saved at the end, will obey.
  9. Well one of the thing we need to understand, is the Antichrist entity has been right in front of us, but covered itself well. If you look in prophecy about the Roman Empire in Daniel 7, the fourth kingdom, is represented by a powerful beast with iron teeth and 10 horns. The 10 horns represent the 10 kings or kingdoms into which pagan Rome was eventually split. These 10 kingdoms are the same as the 10 toes of the image described in Daniel 2. So what happens next, the “little horn” power appears which is the antichrist of prophecy and history, and it doesn't take much to see what religious/political power came out of the Roman Empire. The little horn would come “up among them” that is, from among the 10 horns that were the kingdoms of Western Europe (Daniel 7:8). It would have a man at its head who could speak for it (Daniel 7:8). It would pluck out or uproot three kingdoms (Daniel 7:8). It would be different from the other 10 kingdoms (Daniel 7:24). It would make war with and persecute the saints (Daniel 7:21, 25). It would emerge from the pagan Roman Empire, the fourth kingdom (Daniel 7:7, 8). God’s people (the saints) would “be given into his hand” for “a time and times and half a time” (Daniel 7:25). It would “speak great words against” or blaspheme God (Daniel 7:25). In Revelation 13:5, the Bible says the same power speaks “great things and blasphemies.” It would “intend to change times and law” (Daniel 7:25). All these identification points come directly from the Bible, and its not just one point but many that show who is this Antichrist power, and history tells us. Here is a study I came across on the estimates of the destructive persecution this power did..."Here are some of the places where figures about religious persecutions are given. Dowling in his History of Romanism says: "From the birth of Popery in 606 [Boniface III, see also William Branham, The Pergamean Church Age, p. 277:280] to the present time, it is estimated by careful and credible historians, that more than fifty millions of the human family, have been slaughtered for the crime of heresy by popish persecutors, an average of more than forty thousand religious murders for every year of the existence of popery." — "History of Romanism," pp. 541, 542. New York: 1871. Commenting on this quote, a fundamental Baptist web site says the following: For example, it has been estimated by careful and reputed historians of the Catholic Inquisition that 50 million people were slaughtered for the crime of "heresy" by Roman persecutors between the A.D. 606 and the middle of the 19th century. This is the number cited by John Dowling, who published the classic "History of Romanism" in 1847 (book VIII, chapter 1, footnote 1). Only seven years after its first printing, it could be said of Dowling's book, "it has already obtained a circulation much more extensive than any other large volume ever published in America, upon the subject of which it treats; or perhaps in England, with the exception of Fox's Book of Martyrs." Clark's Martyrology counts the number of Waldensian martyrs during the first half of the 13th century in France alone at two million. From A.D. 1160-1560 the Waldensians which dwelt in the Italian Alps were visited with 36 different fierce persecutions that spared neither age nor sex (Thomas Armitage, A History of the Baptists, "Post-Apostolic Times—The Waldensians," 1890). They were almost completely destroyed as a people and most of their literary record was erased from the face of the earth. From the year 1540 to 1570 "it is proved by national authentic testimony, that nearly one million of Protestants were publicly put to death in various countries in Europe, besides all those who were privately destroyed, and of whom no human record exists" (J.P. Callender, Illustrations of Popery, 1838, p. 400). Catholic historian Vergerius admits gleefully that during the Pontificate of Pope Paul IV (1555-1559) "the Inquisition alone, by tortures, starvation, or the fire, murdered more than 150,000 Protestants." These are only small samples of the brutality which was poured out upon "dissident" Christians by the Roman Catholic Church during the Inquisition. Concerning the figure of two million killed, Bourne writes Bertrand, the Papal Legate, wrote a letter to Pope Honorius, desiring to be recalled from the croisade against the primitive witnesses and contenders for the faith. In that authentic document, he stated, that within fifteen years, 300,000 of those crossed soldiers had become victims to their own fanatical and blind fury. Their unrelenting and insatiable thirst for Christian and human blood spared none within the reach of their impetuous despotism and unrestricted usurpations. On the river Garonne, a conflict occurred between the croisaders, with their ecclesiastical leaders, the Prelates of Thoulouse and Comminges; who solemnly promised to all their vassals the full pardon of sin, and the possession of heaven immediately, if they were slain in the battle. The Spanish monarch and his confederates acknowledged that they must have lost 400,000 men, in that tremendous conflict, and immediately after it-but the Papists boasted, that including the women and children, they had massacred more than two millions of the human family, in that solitary croisade against the southwest part of France. — Bourne, George, The American Textbook of Popery, Griffith & Simon, Philadelphia, 1846, pp. 402-403. In only one crusade, two million Albigenses were killed. How many must there have been altogether, and how many millions more must have been killed during the entire Middle Ages! Another source writes The Catholic crusade against the Albigenses in Southern France (from 1209-1229), under Popes Innocent III., Honorius III. and Gregory IX., was one of the bloodiest tragedies in human history . . . The number of Albigenses that perished in the twenty years' war is estimated at from one to two millions. — Cushing B. Hassell, History of the Church of God, Chapter XIV. W. E. H. Lecky says: "That the Church of Rome has shed more innocent blood than any other institution that has ever existed among mankind, will be questioned by no Protestant who has a competent knowledge of history. The memorials, indeed, of many of her persecutions are now so scanty, that it is impossible to form a complete conception of the multitude of her victims, and it is quite certain that no power of imagination can adequately realize their sufferings." — "History of the Rise and Influence of the Spirit of Rationalism in Europe," Vol. II, p. 32. London: Longmans, Green, and Co., 1910. The following quotation is from The Glorious Reformation by S. S. SCHMUCKER, D. D., Discourse in Commemoration of the Glorious Reformation of the Sixteenth Century; delivered before the Evangelical Lutheran Synod of West Pennsylvania, by the Rev. S. S. Schmucker, D.D., Professor of Theology in the Theological Seminary at Gettysburg. Published by Gould and Newman. 1838. Need I speak to you of the thirty years' war in Germany, which was mainly instigated by the Jesuits, in order to deprive the Protestants of the right of free religious worship, secured to them by the treaty of Augsburg? Or of the Irish rebellion, of the inhuman butchery of about fifteen millions of Indians in South America, Mexico and Cuba, by the Spanish papists? In short, it is calculated by authentic historians, that papal Rome has shed the blood of sixty-eight millions of the human race in order to establish her unfounded claims to religious dominion (citing Dr. Brownlee's "Popery an enemy to civil liberty", p. 105). Estimates range up to 7 to 12 million for the number who died in the thirty years' war, and higher: This was the century of the last religious wars in "Christendom," the Thirty Years' War in Germany, fomented by the Jesuits, reducing the people to cannibalism, and the population of Bohemia from 4,000,000 to 780,000, and of Germany from 20,000,000 to 7,000,000, and making Southern Germany almost a desert, . . . — Cushing B. Hassell, History of the Church of God, Chapter XVII. Concerning the Irish rebellion, John Temple's True Impartial History of the Irish Rebellion of 1641, written in 1644, puts the number of victims at 300,000, but other estimates are much smaller. Some estimates are larger: In addition to the Jesuit or Catholic atrocities of this century already enumerated with some particulars, they massacred 400 Protestants at Grossoto, in Lombardy, July 19th, 1620; are said to have destroyed 400,000 Protestants in Ireland, in 1641, by outright murder, and cold, and hunger, and drowning . . . — Cushing B. Hassell, History of the Church of God, Chapter XVII. In fact, the population of Ireland is estimated to have decreased from 2 million in 1640 to 1.7 million in 1672, according to R.F. Foster, Modern Ireland 1600-1972 (1988). However, this could have resulted from British reprisals to some extent and from emigration, forced or voluntary. The population should have increased by about 200,000 during this period, assuming a 30 percent growth rate per century. This implies that 500,000 people in excess of normal either died or left Ireland during this time, and is consistent with 300,000 or more Protestants being killed in 1641. The figure of 68 million appeared in Schmucker's talk in 1838, in Brownlee's book of 1836, and also in a book "Plea for the West" by Lyman Beecher (Cincinnati, Truman and Smith, 1835), pp. 130-131: And let me ask again, whether the Catholic religion, in its union with the state, has proved itself so unambitious, meek, and unaspiring so feeble, and easy to be entreated, as to justify-a proud, contempt of its avowed purpose and systematic movements to secure an ascendancy in this nation? It is accidental that in alliance with despotic governments, it has swayed a sceptre of iron, for ten centuries over nearly one-third of; the population of, the globe, and by a death of violence is estimated to have swept from 'the' earth about sixty-eight millions of its inhabitants, and holds now in darkness and bondage nearly half the civilized world? The exact quote of Brownlee referenced above is as follows: In one word, the church of Rome has spent immense treasures and shed, in murder, the blood of sixty eight millions and five hundred thousand of the human race, to establish before the astonished and disgusted world, her fixed determination to annihilate every claim set up by the human family to liberty, and the right of unbounded freedom of conscience. — Popery an enemy to civil liberty, 1836, pp. 104-105. Also, in another work Brownlee states Papal Rome has shed the blood of fifty millions of Christians in Europe! — The Roman Catholic Religion viewed in the light of Prophecy and History, New York, Charles K. Moore, 1843, page 60. And later in the same work, The best writers enumerate fifty millions of Christians destroyed by fire, and the sword, and the inquisition; and fifteen millions of natives of the American continent and islands; and three millions of Moors in Europe, and one million and a half of Jews. Now, here are sixty-nine millions and five hundred thousands of human beings, murdered by "the woman of the Roman hills, who was drunk with the blood of the saints." And this horrid list does not include those of her own subjects, who fell in the crusades in Asia, and in her wars against European Christians, and in South America!" .....and just continues...
  10. But look deeper, we see in Revelation the beast that speaks blasphemies against God and make war on His saints. Revelation 13 1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. 2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority. 3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. 4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? 5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. 6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. 7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. In Daniel 7 we are told that the little horn also speaks blasphemies against the Most High. Daniel 7 1 In the first year of Belshazzar king of Babylon Daniel had a dream and visions of his head upon his bed: then he wrote the dream, and told the sum of the matters. 2 Daniel spake and said, I saw in my vision by night, and, behold, the four winds of the heaven strove upon the great sea. 3 And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another. 4 The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it. 5 And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh. 6 After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it. 7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns. 8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things. We see repeatedly Roman Catholic sources refer to the popes as vicars of Christ, vice-regents of Christ, representatives of Christ, Vicars of the Son of God, etc. Furthermore, the popes have claimed the right to exercise the power and prerogatives that belong only to God. But even more, they claim to have the right to forgive sins, to set up and remove kings, to be bowed down to, to be called Holy Father, to execute the death penalty or make war upon dissenters, to change the Sabbath, to change God’s prophetic calendar, to be the supreme judges of heaven, earth and hell whose decision cannot be appealed, and to be infallible expositors in matters of faith and morals. Look what scripture says.. Mark 2:7 7 Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only? Daniel 2:21 21 And he changeth the times and the seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings: he giveth wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know understanding: Revelation 19:10 10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. Matthew 23:9 9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. Daniel 7:25 25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. John 5:22 22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: James 1:17 17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
  11. But the real issue is why the believers/churches of the Reformation still are following the changes it claims it had the authority to make, that is at the heart of the matter. Yes, Paul, in the second letter to the Thessalonians, foretold the apostasy which would come into the church. He declared that before the return of Christ would, "come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; who exalteth himself above all that is called God;" Even at that early date he saw, creeping into the church, errors in belief that would prepare the way for the false teachings to come in. Little by little, and then more openly as it increased in strength and gained control of believers, paganism and idol worship came into the church. The customs of heathenism began to find their way into the early Christian church and compromise and conformity to paganism was held back for a time by the fierce persecutions by the Roman Emperors. But as persecution ceased, and Christianity was accepted and entered the courts and palaces of the Emperors and Kings, the true church laid aside the humble simplicity of Christ for the pomp and pride of priests and pagan leaders and in place of the truth from God, it substituted human theories, rites and traditions. It started slowly, a change here a compromise there, but the then with acceptance the floodgates to apostasy were fully opened by Emperor Constantine, who tried to politically not to leave out or alienate those who practiced paganism after he claim to convert to Christianity. He declared the bishop of Rome as the enforcer of truth and forced the merger of paganism into the church, and the heathen religion now cloaked with a form of righteousness, walked into the church. Paganism, while appearing to be vanquished by the church, became the conqueror. Pagan doctrines, ceremonies, and superstitions were incorporated into the faith and worship of the professed followers of Christ. This compromise between paganism and Christianity resulted in the development of "the man of sin" foretold in prophecy who clearly we see opposing and exalting himself above God. So we see the changes, against what God has set as His times and law, made by the "man of sin", and yet how can the churches of the Reformation just go along with it?
  12. True but that is not what is being claimed... https://www.papalencyclicals.net/leo13/l13praec.htm If you check the around the fifth paragraph down it says "But since We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty" And there are many others..... "All names which in the Scriptures are applied to Christ, by virtue of which it is established that He is over the church, all the same names are applied to the Pope." On the Authority of the Councils, book 2, chapter 17 "The Pope and God are the same, so he has all power in Heaven and earth." Pope Pius V, quoted in Barclay, Chapter XXVII, p. 218, “Cities Petrus Bertanous” “The Pope takes the place of Jesus Christ on earth…by divine right the Pope has supreme and full power in faith, in morals over each and every pastor and his flock. He is the true vicar, the head of the entire church, the father and teacher of all Christians. He is the infallible ruler, the founder of dogmas, the author of and the judge of councils; the universal ruler of truth, the arbiter of the world, the supreme judge of heaven and earth, the judge of all, being judged by no one, God himself on earth.” Quoted in the New York Catechism. These words are written in the Roman Canon Law 1685: “To believe that our Lord God the Pope has not the power to decree as he is decreed, is to be deemed heretical.” Father A. Pereira says: “It is quite certain that Popes have never approved or rejected this title ‘Lord God the Pope,’ for the passage in the gloss referred to appears in the edition of the Canon Law published in Rome in 1580 by Gregory XIII.” Writers on the Canon Law say, "The Pope and God are the same, so he has all power in heaven and earth." Barclay Cap. XXVII, p. 218. Cities Petrus Bertrandus, Pius V. - Cardinal Cusa supports his statement. Pope Nicholas I declared: "the appellation of God had been confirmed by Constantine on the Pope, who, being God, cannot be judged by man." Labb IX Dist.: 96 Can. 7, Satis evidentur, Decret Gratian Primer Para "The Pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, he is Jesus Christ himself, hidden under the veil of flesh." Catholic National, July 1895 Roman Catholic Canon Law stipulates through Pope Innocent III that the Roman pontiff is "the vicegerent upon earth, not a mere man, but of a very God;" and in a gloss on the passage it is explained that this is because he is the vicegerent of Christ, who is “very God and very man.” Decretales Domini Gregorii translatione Episcoporum, (on the transference of Bishops), title 7, chapter 3; Corpus Juris Canonice (2nd Leipzig ed., 1881), col. 99; (Paris, 1612), tom. 2, Devretales, col. 205
  13. And does he have the authority to change times and laws of God? In prophecy in Daniel we read how this would arise and would have "eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things."Lets see what is claimed: "Not the Creator of Universe, in Genesis 2:1-3,-but the Catholic Church can claim the honor of having granted man a pause to his work every seven days." (S. C. Mosna, Storia della Domenica, 1969, pp. 366-367) "The Pope is of great authority and power that he can modify, explain, or interpret even divine laws... The Pope can modify divine law, since his power is not of man, but of God, and he acts as vicegerent of God upon earth." (Lucius Ferraris, Prompta Ribliotheca, Papa, art. 2, translated) "The Pope has the power to change times, to abrogate laws, and to dispense with all things, even the precepts of Christ. The Pope has the authority and often exercised it, to dispense with the command of Christ." (Decretal, de Tranlatic Episcop. Cap. (The Pope can modify divine law.) Ferraris' Ecclesiastical Dictionary) "Had she not such power, she could not have done that in which all modern religionists agree with her; --she could not have substituted the observance of Sunday the first day of the week, for the observance of Saturday the seventh day, a change for which there is no Scriptural authority." (Rev. Stephan Keenan, A Doctrinal Catechism, On the Obedience Due to the Church, chap. 2, p. 174. (Imprimatur, John Cardinal McCloskey, archbishop of New York) "The authority of the church could therefore not be bound to the authority of the Scriptures, because the Church had changed...the Sabbath into Sunday, not by command of Christ, but by its own authority." (Canon and Tradition, p. 263) "Is not yet too late for Protestants to redeem themselves. Will they do it?... will they indeed take the written word only, the Scripture alone, as their sole authority and their sole standard? Or will they still hold the indefensible, self contradictory, and suicidal doctrine and practice of following the authority of the Catholic church and wear the SIGN of her authority? Will they keep the Sabbath of the Lord, the seventh day, according to Scripture? Or will they keep the Sunday according to the tradition of the Catholic church." (Ibid, page 31) Daniel 7:25 25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. Describing a “little horn power” Daniel says, "And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws:" . Paul made a similar prediction: 2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. Paul warned that this blasphemy was already at work, and that it would come not from an outside influence, but from within the church: 2 Thessalonians 2:7 7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. Acts 20:28-30 28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. 29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. 30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them. And we clearly see it makes claims that is has the authority to say these things and to make these changes....
  14. and makes assertions that he has the authority to say these things and to make changes, which if you read prophecy in scripture says would be done. So lets look. In his encyclical, "The Reunion of Christendom" (1885), Pope Leo XIII stated that the pope holds "upon this earth the place of God Almighty." In the Catechism, can be found the following: "The Pope takes the place of Jesus Christ on earth...by divine right the pope has supreme and full power in faith and morals over each and every pastor and his flock. He is the true Vicar of Christ, the head of the entire church, the father and teacher of all Christians He is the infallible ruler, the founder of dogmas, the author of and the judge of councils; the universal ruler of truth, the arbiter of the world, the supreme judge of heaven and earth, the judge of all, being judged by one, God himself on earth." and also "The Pope can make and unmake laws for the entire Church; his authority is supreme and unquestioned. Every bishop, every priest, every member of the Church is subject to him." Here are some others…"The Pope is not simply the representative of Jesus Christ. On the contrary, he is Jesus Christ Himself, under the veil of the flesh." (Evangelical Christendom, January 1, 1895, pg. 15, published in London by J. S. Phillips) "Against this background of love towards Holy Church, 'the pillar and bulwark of the truth' (1 Tim 3:15), we readily understand the devotion of Saint Francis of Assisi for 'THE LORD POPE', the daughterly outspokenness of Saint Catherine of Siena towards the one whom she called 'SWEET CHRIST ON EARTH'." (Pope John Paul II, Apostolic Exhortation on the Consecrated Life and Its Mission in the Church and in the World, to the bishops and clergy, religious orders and congregations, societies of apostolic life, secular institutes, and all the faithful, given in Rome, at Saint Peter's, March 25, 1996) "The Pope is of so great dignity, and so exalted that he is not a mere man, but as it were God and the vicar of God." (Ferraris Ecclesiastical dictionary) "All names which in the Scriptures are applied to Christ, by virtue of which it is established that He is over the church, all the same names are applied to the Pope." (On the Authority of the Councils, book 2, chapter 17) "The Pope and God are the same, so he has all power in Heaven and earth." (Pope Pius V, quoted in Barclay, Chapter XXVII, p. 218, "Cities Petrus Bertanous) "To believe that our Lord God the Pope has not the power to decree as he is decreed, is to be deemed heretical." (the Gloss "Extravagantes" o.f Pope John XXII *** inter, Tit. XIV, Cap. IV. Ad Callem Sexti Decretalium, Paris, 1685) "Hence the Pope is crowned with a triple crown, as king of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions." (Ferraris, «Prompta Bibliotheca», 1763, Volume VI, 'Papa II', p.26) "The Saviour Himself is the door of the sheepfold: 'I am the door of the sheep.' Into this fold of Jesus Christ, no man may enter unless he be led by the Sovereign Pontiff; and only if they be united to him can men be saved, for the Roman Pontiff is the Vicar of Christ and His personal representative on earth." (Pope John XXIII in his homily to the Bishops and faithful assisting at his coronation on November 4, 1958) "This is our last lesson to you: receive it, engrave it in your minds, all of you: by God's commandment salvation is to be found nowhere but in the Church; the strong and effective instrument of salvation is none other than the Roman Pontificate." (Pope Leo XIII, Allocution for the 25th anniversary of his election, February 20, 1903; Papal Teachings: The Church, Benedictine Monks of Solesmes, St. Paul Editions, Boston, 1962, par. 653) He calls himself the Supreme ruler of heaven and earth, the Supreme Pontiff, the Holy Father, which belong only to God and "God himself on earth". No such terms were given to a mere man anywhere in scripture and the term "Holy Father" is used only by Jesus in John 17:11 as He prayed to God the Father. For a sinful man to assume the authority and titles which belong only to God, seems the height of blasphemy. So the Pope has laid claim to take the place of God with infallible authority and we find the Council of Trent declared: "Sitting in that chair in which Peter, the Prince of the Apostles, sat to the close of life, the Catholic Church recognizes in his person the most exalted degree of dignity, and the full jurisdiction not based on constitutions, but emanating from no less authority than from God Himself. As the Successor of St. Peter and the true and legitimate Vicar of Jesus Christ, he therefore, presides over the Universal Church, the Father and Governor of all the faithful, of Bishops, also and of all other prelates, be their station, rant, or power, what they may be." So its not just the Pope, the councils have also laid claim that the Pope holds of himself what can only be termed as "God on Earth".
  15. Yes, many say that but yet deep down are in bondage to sin, so have not put on the robes of Christ righteousness He offers.. Titus 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate. Matthew 22 King James Version (KJV) 22 And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, 2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, 3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come. 4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage. 5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise: 6 And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. 7 But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city. 8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy. 9 Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage. 10 So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests. 11 And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment: 12 And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless. 13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness, there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 14 For many are called, but few are chosen.
×
×
  • Create New...