How do we Become like Jesus?

[Selah7]

1 hour ago, Vine Abider said:

Yes, and may I add that in learning all about Him in the written word, we constantly ask Him to illuminate our thinking and to live through us?

Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. "He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me. "These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.

- John 14:23-26 

[com7fy8]

On 1/2/2023 at 12:29 PM, Vine Abider said:

this working is a result of His indwelling Spirit.

8 hours ago, Mije said:

Isn’t faith without works dead?

2 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

Good works are the evidence of Christ living through us.

"But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?" (James 2:20)

So, yes God's works are evidence, but > I can see that, if faith is "dead" without God's works, then works of God are more than only outward evidence; because during the works of God in us, we are being affected by God in our character while we are worked by God to do things. And if God has works always while He is working, then works which He wants and does are essential and not only some gesture of outward evidence.

For example, Mary giving birth to Jesus was a work. Was that essential? Has giving birth to Jesus ministered grace which is essential?

And our Apostle Paul says > 

"Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus. To this end I also labor, striving according to His working which works in me mightily." (Colossians 2:28-29)

Here I see how Paul is talking about at least three basic kinds of works being done . . . in order to minister for people to be conformed to the image of Jesus. There are works of preaching, the works of warning, and works of teaching. And grace is ministered in the process of these works. And then grace affects a person in one's character to become like Jesus.

The works are spiritual, then, mainly . . . deeper than any outward words and actions of ministering.

The labor and works are done by God. And then He spreads the effect . . . giving the "increase" > 1 Corinthians 3:6-7.

So, the works are not only outward evidence, in any case. But they are included in God's working. So, they are essential, if God wants them and He is doing them. Whatever God desires and does is essential, I would say. But what matters mainly is how we are affected spiritually while we do a work, and how others are deeply affected by grace or not.

Therefore, like you have said already, what causes people to change to become like Jesus is the working of the Holy Spirit in us. But with this changing there are works . . . included. And there can not be the character of Jesus without His actions coming from how He is in God's love. And this spreads. The cup runs over. Others will be affected by the grace flowing through a person who is like Jesus. 

So there are works, therefore unescapable, plus how others become affected also to become like Christ. So, how we are affected spiritually in our character is included in the "evidence" of a Christian's ministry. And example is included, not only things we do outwardly, but how we are good example in the sight of God > we see how this can work, for Christian wives, "without a word" > 1 Peter 3:1-4.

But ones look only at the outward show of a church . . . of outward showing of God's word, and outward practices, and outward claiming of what beliefs people have. And then what can happen in Bible claiming churches is people can make a project of criticizing Catholics, and making up ideas and practices which mainly are for showing they are not Catholic!! And they can get so busy with that and congratulating themselves that they are not Catholic. But this keeps their attention to only certain things of the Bible, and to outward things giving them their identity, not to scriptures about how to become and to love like Jesus. 

Or if they do talk about scriptures in a way not to criticize Catholics, they might make a project of using a scripture mainly or only to criticize Pentecostals or to promoting a few Pentecostal ideas, but not talk about how God is able to have us doing a scripture. 

For one example > 

"Test all things; hold fast what is good." (1 Thessalonians 5:21)

Certain people will only talk about testing if a church is Pentecostal or not or things are Catholic or not. But they say not a word about how only God at each moment can know what is "good"; and so, in order to test at every moment, we need to stay attentive to how God has us testing and holding to what He at any time knows is good and is His will 

"Therefore submit to God." (in James 4:7)

"And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body; and be thankful." (Colossians 3:15)

"and you will find rest for your souls." (in Matthew 11:28-30)

If we constantly submit to God in His peace and rest in Him, this tests what He desires. And He guides us according to all He knows is really true about ourselves and other people, and what He knows is going on.

And when things come to test us . . . we do not allow Satanic stuff to control our attention, but we test a problem first by seeing where God guides our attention, versus just answering to the problem > answer to God first! Plus we test the problem by seeing how God uses it for His good, in case He has us dealing with something. So we stay on top of things . . . like Jesus on the cross was on top of things. And then we come to resurrections to more and better than whatever problems might take or threaten to take from us. 

But people are looking for evidence of if some body conforms to their group's stuff, not getting into how God is able to have us doing His word.

We need to exercise in order to stay healthy. Like this, our bodies need to be doing love's works so our bodies stay healthy better than for only worldly reasons. So, works are very important, for exercising in God's love which grows us in Jesus and thereby has us discovering how we can become healthy; and so works of God's love are much more than only being evidence. His resurrection power in this love can affect how our bodies are doing, now, as well as in the resurrection.

Edited January 4, 2023 by com7fy8

[Mije]

I believe that the verse from James is in response to those who would say they have nothing left to do but be saved- James wanted them to see that their faith was to be strengthened by their works; it would wither otherwise.
If we want to truly be like God then we must be about His business. We have to get up and DO things like clothe the one who is naked and cold and feed the one who is hungry. We can wait on the Spirit and we can depend on God to move us but we also have to move ourselves toward Him.

 

[steve morrow]

BY  LISTENING  TO  HIM  AND  NOT  TO  THE  WORLD

 

COLOSSIANS 1:2  to the saints and --faithful brethren in  CHRIST-- which are at colosse grace be unto you and peace --from  GOD  OUR  FATHER  AND  THE  LORD  JESUS  CHRIST--

PSALM 31:23  O  LOVE  THE  LORD  ALL  YOU  HIS  SAINTS   --FOR  THE  LORD  PRESERVETH  THE  FAITHFUL-- and plentifully rewardeth  --THE  PROUD  DOER--

 

1 CORINTHIANS 4:1  let a man so account of us as of the ministers of --CHRIST-- and stewards of the mysteries of  GOD

*******4:2-- moreover --IT  IS    --REQUIRED--    in stewards that a man be found   --FAITHFUL*******

 

2 THESSALONIANS 3:3  but  THE  LORD  is faithful who shall establish you

 

Psalm 119:138  thy testimonies that thou hast commanded are righteous  --and very  FAITHFUL--

PSALM 119:86  all thy commandments are faithful they persecute me wrongfully help thou me

TITUS 3:8 this is a faithful saying and these things I will that thou affirm constantly that they which have believed in  GOD  might be careful to --maintain good works-- these things are good and profitable unto men 

 

LOVING  THE  LORD  JESUS  CHRIST 

[Vine Abider]

So the question is, "How do we become like Jesus?"  To be clear - we don't become like Jesus by our works.  Rather, this is the work of the Spirit of Christ IN us.  The good works are then the outflow of this relationship we have with Him.  That is, experiencing the transforming of His indwelling as per 2 Corinthians 3:18: "But we all, with unveiled faces, looking as in a mirror at the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit."

[Mije]

8 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

The good works are then the outflow of this relationship we have with Him. 

You do agree though that we must intend to do good works- they do not just ‘flow’ out of us naturally? Our nature is to selfishness, and we must fight that nature and choose to sow to the Spirit.

That is why James’ message is so important. Both are necessary- faith and works.

Edited January 7, 2023 by Mije
Darn capitalization

[Vine Abider]

6 hours ago, Mije said:

You do agree though that we must intend to do good works- they do not just ‘flow’ out of us naturally? Our nature is to selfishness, and we must fight that nature and choose to sow to the Spirit.

That is why James’ message is so important. Both are necessary- faith and works.

Yes, agreed - and that's always the mysterious relationship, isn't it!?  That is, how much are we to do and what does He do?  Brothers here have likened it to an automobile.  There is this great power in the engine, a transmission system and wheels on the ground all ready to take you to exciting places.  But nothing happens until we turn the key and put it in gear!  The amazing power just sits there idle, but it can't work unless we take the relatively very small action of turning it on & engaging it!

"Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling - for it is God who operates in you both the willing and the working for His good pleasure." (Phil 2:12-13)