Is the Church Christ?

[Vine Abider]

3 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi VA,

Good to again focus on the topic.

`God the Father....gave Him as Head over all things to the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.` (Eph. 1: 22 & 23)

`till we all come to the unity of the faith and the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ.` (Eph. 4: 13)

I believe that to be the very divine nature of Christ as 2 Peter 1: 4 speaks of. The well known international Bible teacher from last century, C.J. Rolls likens Christ life to `bread.`

Bread is bought to nourish those who are alive; but Christ, the Bread of God imparts life eternal. The physical bread we eat is from wheat or other grains, grown in the ground from whence our bodies are derived. The calcium, silicon, iodine, iron, phosphates etc in an organic form are packed into the wheat in order to build up our strength.

In like manner, if we are to become partakers of spiritual life and immortality we must eat the Bread of God, which is made up of righteousness, goodness, lovingkindness, graciousness, perfectness, holiness and such like which result in Christ likeness.

To believe Christ and receive Him is to appropriate and partake of the Bread of God , (Christ`s character)  which came down from Heaven. In doing so the result is life everlasting, because these divine virtues are imperishable. Therefore the gift (reward) of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

"He that eats Me, even he shall live by Me." John 6:57

As the saying goes, we are what we eat!

Edited February 4, 2023 by Vine Abider

[Your closest friendnt]

7 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

You're a good brother. You know that I hold you in the highest esteem! 

I'm not worried about disagreements. I'm not concerned by detractors in the least, for there will always be one or more who come our way. I don't mind explaining myself, but it's good to remember that I can't "make" anyone agree with me. Why would I even try? It's not my place and besides, I don't view my opinions that highly. I've been wrong or mistaken a number of times!

Which brings me to a subject which our sister @Marilyn C has addressed on this forum in topics and in her blog (I intend upon reading it all), and that's the Bride of Christ. To be honest, I've never given the matter much thought. I've never had a need to do so before, but now I'm doing that.

I always speak to you with a great respect because I have similar experiences in life or with my walk with the Devil and do not be surprised if I say that because it was while I was a believer but entangled in this permissive world...and then seeking Jesus because I had known since I was a child that in the situation I was in only Jesus could help me....And the most strange thing that happened it was that someone walked in the place where I was working and he knew about the dire situation I was in...because he was in the gifts of the Holy Spirit...

And he invited me in the group he was part of....

Very charismatic with the gifts of the Holy Spirit....

The Lord guided me with visions even in broad daylight.. so I value what you say very much and I connect to them...I remember the first time when I read about one of your post....the Lord took hold of me and he would not let me go unless I respond to your post and say something like "what Jesus said in his prayer in the Garden".... that's what I wrote in my post to you...without not knowing anything about you and that you were in the Cross roads of decision....now I think that I should let you know about that...at that time I knew that you were very special to him...

[Michael37]

1 hour ago, Dead Orthodoxy said:

The mere fact that Marathoner said ANYTHING about what he saw in heaven, is contrary to Scripture.  This is clear from Paul's writing II Cor 12:ff

² I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or out of the body I do not know, God knows—such a man was caught up to the third heaven. ³ And I know how such a man—whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, God knows— ⁴ was caught up into Paradise and heard inexpressible words, which a man is not permitted to speak. ⁵ On behalf of such a man I will boast; but on my own behalf I will not boast, except in regard to my weaknesses. ⁶ For if I do wish to boast I will not be foolish, for I will be speaking the truth; but I refrain from this, so that no one will credit me with more than he sees in me or hears from me.

He Paul himself is translated into the heaven, but he is very careful how he speaks about this.  He distances himself from this unusual event by referring to himself in the third person.  He is not saying "I as the great Paul, went to heaven!"  Quite the opposite.   But what he heard and saw HE WAS NOT PERMITTED BY GOD TO SPEAK  ABOUT.  Marathoner doesn't keep is mouth shut, he speaks about a farm and living stones.

Paul is giving us an example on how to evaluate people who claim they went to heaven.   If they speak about what they are not permitted to do, they are sinning and therefore their claim is bogus.

But it gets worse for Paul.  Because God allowed him to be in heaven, God himself is going to allow afflictions to be place upon him to instill humility and not exalt himself.

Paul writes in the next verses ⁷ Because of the surpassing greatness of the revelations, for this reason, to keep me from exalting myself, there was given me a thorn in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to torment me—to keep me from exalting myself!

Paul will never reveal what he saw in heaven because of this "thorn" in the flesh to remind him. HE IS NEVER PERMITTED TO TALK ABOUT WHAT HE SAW IN HEAVEN.

Marathoner exalts himself and only speaks about what he saw.

 

No, what my friend Marathoner described was a vision he was given. If you can directly quote him saying he was taken to heaven please do so.

Please do not attack members of Worthy.

[Vine Abider]

We had the (somewhat interesting/definitely distracting) rapid-fire sidebar, so can we please now get back on topic?  That is, "Is the church Christ?"

From what I'm seeing posted here, most, if not all seem to agree that answer is in the affirmative.  Going once . . . going twice . . . 

[Dead Orthodoxy]

4 minutes ago, Michael37 said:

No, what my friend Marathoner described was a vision he was given. If you can directly quote him saying he was taken to heaven please do so.

Please do not attack members of Worthy.

You accuse me of "attacking?"  This MIGHT be considered "bearing false witness against they neighbor."   In my response to Maratholer, I said "I disagree."  Seems "woke" mentality is permeation WCF if where you if you disagree with a person it is "attacking."  

It is a no brainier.  Marathoner states no where in his post that he was in the presence of Jesus in heaven.  This is true.  Heaven is not mention in his  post. 

But where is Jesus after his ascension?  On Mt. Everest?  The Moon?  Saturn?  No.  The right hand of God.  Where?  In heaven.  Hello Mcfly!  By omission of the word "heaven" he claimed he saw Jesus in heaven.  Hello McFly!

You didn't respond to Paul's example, that people who claim to go to heaven, are not to speak about it.  Was Paul wrong here?

Charismatics and Pentecostals always love to claim they go to heaven.  Alot of money and fame can be made claiming so. 

 

[Marilyn C]

1 hour ago, Vine Abider said:

We had the (somewhat interesting/definitely distracting) rapid-fire sidebar, so can we please now get back on topic?  That is, "Is the church Christ?"

From what I'm seeing posted here, most, if not all seem to agree that answer is in the affirmative.  Going once . . . going twice . . . 

Hi VA,

yes, would be good if we could all attend to the topic. Yes, all agree that the church the Body of Christ is (of) the Lord. However, many think that we are also a female, a wife, a bride.

Now, I do have a few more thoughts regarding this. Over our way here in OZ I know of a lady, (divorced) who believes that Jesus is her husband, because she told me. This thought is very soulish as it is all about `me.`

And that has been a focus of many of the Pentecostal denominations & Charismatics. They tend to read God`s word as all about me/us. `Who we are in Christ,` What is your gifting,` `What is your dream...` and so on.

Now, while there is some truth there it is an unbalanced focus. The Lord is always our focus and it is He we read of in God`s word. We are only part of His great eternal purposes.

The difficulty has come about when believers have taken the symbol to be literal. Now let`s look at a few symbols -

The Lord is my rock - does that mean He is a real rock? No, but it denotes, strength.

The Lord is the Lamb of God - is He a real lamb? No, but it denotes His vulnerable sacrifice.  

The Lord is the bridegroom and will marry the bride - is that a real marriage? (as on earth?) No, but denotes the union, the becoming one, in harmony.

`and they shall become one...` (Gen. 2: 24)

`that they may be one as we are.` (John 17: 11)

`for we are members of His body, of His flesh and of His bones.` (Eph. 5: 30)

 

There is not closer or greater relationship than Christ the Head and His BODY.

[coheir]

6 hours ago, Rosie1jack2pauline3 said:

I’ve already spoken with my Son, he deals with reserved copyright ,it’s part of his profession..as you say I’m not violating their copyright, unless as my Son said, it’s for financial gain, then you best watch out, plus our copyright laws are different in the UK....thanks for posting Brother...I was pretty frantic and immediately phoned my Son ,anyway as you say it’s George call.....

All credit to God who introduced me to GOT.any scripture questions I have I go straight to got....I love how they present answers orderly and comprehensive for my understanding.

Love you got!!...💗💗💗

they are not clear on the New covenant imo 

[Your closest friendnt]

1 hour ago, Michael37 said:

No, what my friend Marathoner described was a vision he was given. If you can directly quote him saying he was taken to heaven please do so.

Please do not attack members of Worthy.

Why the plurality "attack members" (s) of Worthy...

This is a serious accusation....it must be against the tos....

If he a new member and without support from other members...is more serious.  

We cannot say that he attack the member....he put himself in a position to be corrected and he was humble enough to accept the correction and that is commendable.  .

There is no past history between the members no strong words were exchanged...

There is nothing to suggest that there was any intention to discredit....not fair to put motive in his comments...

Any way he was responding to my question...and I was ready to bring it to his attention..

I hope is all good for everyone...

Edited February 4, 2023 by Your closest friendnt

[Michael37]

1 hour ago, Dead Orthodoxy said:

You accuse me of "attacking?"

If you knew Marathoner here you would know he is a very humble and sincere person who gives very worthy and edifying testimonies. The way you are coming at him is quite discomforting for me.

1 hour ago, Dead Orthodoxy said:

You didn't respond to Paul's example, that people who claim to go to heaven, are not to speak about it.

You are making an edict out of something relevant to Paul, who suffered numerous humbling trials and tribulations as well as a barrage of criticisms and accusations.

Many Christians have spiritual dreams and visions and relating them is not forbidden, nor does it automatically imply they are prideful or self-exalting.

We are the body of Christ, so think about it . . . spiritual gifts and divine interventions . . . yes or no?

[1to3]

1 hour ago, Marilyn C said:

Yes, all agree that the church the Body of Christ is (of) the Lord. However, many think that we are also a female, a wife, a bride.

 

1 hour ago, Marilyn C said:

The Lord is my rock - does that mean He is a real rock? No, but it denotes, strength.

Exactly, no one is taking literally that Jesus is a rock any more than a believer will start having branches come our their bodies bearing fruit like grapes, or that we all become of the female sex and end up  consummating our relationship with Christ Jesus  ( God forbid) in a sexual manner  or that we become a literal branch or a vine or for that matter that Christ Jesus is a bleating bah bad farm animal waking on four legs.

My goodness, were are you coming up with ideas like that?

No one on this thread has made any such claims as you seem to be alluding to. .

Perhaps you where the one who misinterpreted what your friend from the land of oz was referring too? unless of course she was clicking her heals and taking about Munchkin Country.lol.

 

Did you read @George post? Do you think @George thinks Christ Jesus is a literal rock or that >the bride means we all become of the female sex and end up sexually consummating (God forbid) our relationship with our Lord and Savior ChristJesus?

 

https://www.worthydevotions.com/christian-devotional/prepare-to-be-married#respond

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by 1to3