Unclean Spirits, Divine Healing and Modern Medicine

[RdJ]

On 3/27/2024 at 4:14 AM, The Barbarian said:

King David wites:

Psalms 30:1 I will exalt you, Lord, for you lifted me out of the depths and did not let my enemies gloat over me.  ² Lord my God, I called to you for help, and you healed me.
³ You, Lord, brought me up from the realm of the dead; you spared me from going down to the pit.

This does not mean King David died, and it does not mean that Jonah died.   You merely added that idea to His word for your own desires.   C'mon.

Do you not see that the whale saved him from drowning?   

He had fallen to the depths of the sea about to drown,when the whale came in and saved him.    God was not done with him and had a job for him to do in Nineveh.   God was determined that the people of Nineveh would repent, and Jonah was His instrument.   He would not cast aside the instrument until his purpose was fulfilled.

And when Jonah called on the Lord for help, the whale safely returned him to land.

Which is how we know Jonah did not die.   He used exactly the words David used.

David didn't die, but he made Psalms about Jesus, who did die and that was called the sign from Jonah, which makes some and me too think that Jonah also died.

 You have brought Me to the dust of death. For dogs have surrounded Me; The congregation of the wicked has enclosed Me. They pierced My hands and My feet; They divide My garments among them, And for My clothing they cast lots. 

But You, O Lord, do not be far from Me;
O My Strength, hasten to help Me!
20 Deliver Me from the sword,
My precious life from the power of the dog.
21 Save Me from the lion’s mouth
And from the horns of the wild oxen!

You have answered Me.

Psalms 22:14‭-‬16‭, ‬18 NKJV
https://bible.com/bible/114/psa.22.14-21.NKJV

Psalm 16

Therefore my heart is glad, and my glory rejoices;
My flesh also will rest in hope.
10 For You will not leave my soul in Sheol,
Nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption.

Psalm 30 says: You brought me up from sheol. Sounds like that is also about Jesus. Both. Figurative for David and literal for Jesus.

[The Barbarian]

1 hour ago, RdJ said:

David didn't die, but he made Psalms about Jesus, who did die and that was called the sign from Jonah, which makes some and me too think that Jonah also died.

It comes down to what was written.    If Jonah died and was resurrected, so was David, who said the same thing Jonah said.

1 hour ago, RdJ said:

Psalm 30 says: You brought me up from sheol. Sounds like that is also about Jesus. Both. Figurative for David and literal for Jesus.

Figurative for Jonah and David.  Literal for Jesus.

 

[The Barbarian]

2 hours ago, RV_Wizard said:

Jonah's body was in the belly of the great fish, but since that is not a place where people can set up residence for an extended period and thrive, the likelihood of him surviving without divine intervention is the exact same as the likelihood of God pulling him out of Shoel; zero.

God wasn't done with Jonah.   He had work to to in Nineveh.   So God kept him alive and sent him on to his work.    God wasn't done with David.   So God kept him alive and sent him on to his work.

2 hours ago, RV_Wizard said:

You should watch this explained on YouTube. 

I get God's word from his Bible, not YouTube.   Some of that stuff, by professed Christians, couldn't even be linked here.

 

[The Barbarian]

2 hours ago, RV_Wizard said:

By the way.  Where the spirit goes after death, the body does not follow.  His body never left the great fish regardless of where Jonah went.

God says otherwise.

Jonah 2:11 And the Lord spoke to the fish: and it vomited out Jonas upon the dry land.

Jonah 3:1 And the word of the Lord came to Jonas the second time, saying:  2 Arise, and go to Ninive the great city: and preach in it the preaching that I bid thee.  3 And Jonas arose, and went to Ninive, according to the word of the Lord: now Ninive was a great city of three days' journey.  4 And Jonas began to enter into the city one day's journey: and he cried, and said: Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed.  5 And the men of Ninive believed in God: and they proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth from the greatest to the least.

 

[RdJ]

If he really died and got raised from the dead his response is extra stupid:

 

But it displeased Jonah exceedingly, and he became angry. 2 So he prayed to the Lord, and said, “Ah, Lord, was not this what I said when I was still in my country? Therefore I fled previously to Tarshish; for I know that You are a gracious and merciful God, slow to anger and abundant in lovingkindness, One who relents from doing harm. 3 Therefore now, O Lord, please take my life from me, for it is better for me to die than to live!”

[RV_Wizard]

10 hours ago, RdJ said:

But it displeased Jonah exceedingly, and he became angry. 2 So he prayed to the Lord, and said, “Ah, Lord, was not this what I said when I was still in my country? Therefore I fled previously to Tarshish; for I know that You are a gracious and merciful God, slow to anger and abundant in lovingkindness, One who relents from doing harm. 3 Therefore now, O Lord, please take my life from me, for it is better for me to die than to live!”

Jonah did not want the city of Nineveh to repent.  He wanted it destroyed.   Nineveh was the capital city of Assyria, a ruthless and warlike people who were enemies of Israel. The Assyrians used to skin captives alive, impale them on stakes and burn children to death.  They were a vile and evil people.  Jonah wanted them destroyed.  He carried out the mission he promised God he would do when he was in Shoel, but when God did not destroy the city he was greatly dismayed.  

[RV_Wizard]

10 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

I get God's word from his Bible, not YouTube.   Some of that stuff, by professed Christians, couldn't even be linked here.

So you don't attend church services either?  That does explain your lack of understanding of the Bible.  The point is that the argument can be made either way.  Both pastors, using the same verses, came to a different conclusion; one because the body never left the great fish, and the other because Jonah described his descent into the earth; where Shoel was believed to be located.  "I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God."  The bars of the earth were about him forever; not the ribs of the fish. His body was in the fish.  His soul was in Shoel.

When one died and went to Shoel, there was generally speaking no escape.  It was a place of torment for the wicked and rest for the righteous.  When Jesus died he took the righteous from Shoel back with Him to Heaven.  He had to do this, because nobody could get to Heaven but by Him.  God took Noah from Shoel because he had a mission to accomplish.  

[The Barbarian]

I get God's word from his Bible, not YouTube.   Some of that stuff, by professed Christians, couldn't even be linked here.

On 3/28/2024 at 8:06 PM, RV_Wizard said:

So you don't attend church services either? 

Most of us attend church in person, not on You Tube.   Try it.   You might get something out of it.

On 3/28/2024 at 8:06 PM, RV_Wizard said:

The point is that the argument can be made either way. 

Like a literal or non-literal creation week.   You're wising up.

[RV_Wizard]

5 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

Like a literal or non-literal creation week.   You're wising up.

What does that have to do with the death or comatose state of Jonah in the belly of the great fish?