The Book of John- In the Beginning

[BibleWords]

“In the beginning was the Word”.

Talk about the preeminence of God.

Just like Genesis 1:1, God begins everything.  Before everything else, God is.

[Mr. M]

9 hours ago, enoob57 said:

I checked some of the troubling passages for understanding and He seems very solid brother in the Lord...

 

8 hours ago, kwikphilly said:

Thanks Brother,I thought so too..  Praise Jesus!

 

Okay, I'll bite. What are some troubling verses from John chapter 1,

if that isn't too much trouble.

[enoob57]

4 hours ago, Mr. M said:

 

 

Okay, I'll bite. What are some troubling verses from John chapter 1,

if that isn't too much trouble.

No I meant Bible as whole... Gen 6 .... Heb 6... Rom 9 etc.

[kwikphilly]

5 hours ago, Mr. M said:

 

 

Okay, I'll bite. What are some troubling verses from John chapter 1,

if that isn't too much trouble.

I think he meant for those that may find the Bible difficult to understand,as we often hear from seekers,unbelievers and babes...off hand I cannot think of any frequently asked questions about any passages in particular...

I thought the commentator was very thorough,sound Doctrine

[Dennis1209]

On 4/18/2023 at 7:34 AM, kwikphilly said:

Blessings Everyone....

In speaking with many who come from different denominations there are many questions New Believers or "Seekers" have and many of us suggest they begin in the Book of John, commonly referred to as the Love Letter.....I came across a pretty thorough and nicely written commentary that I thought might be a nice way to kick off a Bible Study of the Book of John....

Typically I'm happy to initiate and facilitate a Study but I always try to Encourage others to join in that our Babes may hear the witness of 2,3 and more - that they may Receive what we have in Christ Jesus- it begins with that Measure of Faith to the Glory of God Almighty

It's a long read but imo,well done ...let us begin with John Chapter 1-Enjoy and be Bountifully Blessed!

https://enduringword.com/bible-commentary/john-1/

With love in Christ, Kwik

I just found your thread, excellent Bible study. As you understated, yes, it is a long read, but well worth it. I am close to finishing chapter one and learning a great deal. I must get ready for church shortly.

This is rock solid, in my opinion, and goes into detail. If I were asked which book of the Bible I should read first, it would be the Gospel of John.

I will be taking plenty of notes for my personal use.

ii. “In the first creation, ‘darkness was upon the face of the deep’ (Genesis 1:2) until God called light into being, so the new creation involves the banishing of spiritual darkness by the light which shines in the Word.” (Bruce)

How are you interpreting the above quote from chapter one? I take is as the “gap theory” between Genesis 1:1-2, whereas the earth preexisted the six-day creation account.

With many studies on that topic, not that I am correct, it is the interpretation I now lean towards. Darkness and sin preexisted Adam & Eve; they were not the first created beings to sin.

What ya think?

[kwikphilly]

1 hour ago, Dennis1209 said:

I just found your thread, excellent Bible study. As you understated, yes, it is a long read, but well worth it. I am close to finishing chapter one and learning a great deal. I must get ready for church shortly.

This is rock solid, in my opinion, and goes into detail. If I were asked which book of the Bible I should read first, it would be the Gospel of John.

I will be taking plenty of notes for my personal use.

ii. “In the first creation, ‘darkness was upon the face of the deep’ (Genesis 1:2) until God called light into being, so the new creation involves the banishing of spiritual darkness by the light which shines in the Word.” (Bruce)

How are you interpreting the above quote from chapter one? I take is as the “gap theory” between Genesis 1:1-2, whereas the earth preexisted the six-day creation account.

With many studies on that topic, not that I am correct, it is the interpretation I now lean towards. Darkness and sin preexisted Adam & Eve; they were not the first created beings to sin.

What ya think?

Blessings Brother!

Good Morning Dennis,I hope you had a wonderful start of the day, enjoying a beautiful church service!

Gee Brother,I think if I really wanted to address your question properly as to what I personally think regarding what was between Gen 1:1-2 then we'd be onto a Bible Study on the Written Creation account,which is (imo) another Topic....I'd like to try to stay focused on the Book of John,especially Chapter 1,for now.

But you asked what I think about the prexistence of darkness and sin - the Scriptures are clear that the earth was unformed and void-the darkness was upon the face of the deep,the Spirit of God Hovered over the face of the waters

A void is an empty space,I think the earth was not even the " earth" yet but to understand that empty space or place that will be a formed and structured planet it is called earth as we see later in Chapter 9.....

Its hard to imagine the Existence of our Eternal Almighty God in what we know as " space" or the universe before the universe was made....I certainly cannot wrap my head around that but God's Word Tells me there He IS,the Creator Who Made all things and put order to them

And Adam and Eve were not the first created beings to " sin"..  we know lucifer,the angelic being rebelled first

But the Word of God is Written for man,for no other created by His Word.The Word of God was with God,is God and all things were Made by Him and through Him yet only man can be Saved by Him and through Him...

I Believe what is Written,that does not mean I understand all the hows,when's,where's or whys but for some reason I no longer try to rationalize,God Said it,it is so...but that's just me( after many decades of brain cramps,lol now there's Peace)

Be happy to join a Topic all about Genesis Study❤️

With love in Christ, Kwik

[BibleWords]

6 hours ago, Dennis1209 said:

I just found your thread, excellent Bible study. As you understated, yes, it is a long read, but well worth it. I am close to finishing chapter one and learning a great deal. I must get ready for church shortly.

This is rock solid, in my opinion, and goes into detail. If I were asked which book of the Bible I should read first, it would be the Gospel of John.

I will be taking plenty of notes for my personal use.

ii. “In the first creation, ‘darkness was upon the face of the deep’ (Genesis 1:2) until God called light into being, so the new creation involves the banishing of spiritual darkness by the light which shines in the Word.” (Bruce)

How are you interpreting the above quote from chapter one? I take is as the “gap theory” between Genesis 1:1-2, whereas the earth preexisted the six-day creation account.

With many studies on that topic, not that I am correct, it is the interpretation I now lean towards. Darkness and sin preexisted Adam & Eve; they were not the first created beings to sin.

What ya think?

I don’t believe the gap theory has any credibility at all.

There is no scriptural evidence for it.

C. I. Scofield was wrong in his assessment of the beginning.

He was good on a lot of other things, including dispensationalism and the rapture, but I think he completely missed it on the doctrine of the beginning.

[Dennis1209]

6 hours ago, kwikphilly said:

Blessings Brother!

Good Morning Dennis,I hope you had a wonderful start of the day, enjoying a beautiful church service!

Gee Brother,I think if I really wanted to address your question properly as to what I personally think regarding what was between Gen 1:1-2 then we'd be onto a Bible Study on the Written Creation account,which is (imo) another Topic....I'd like to try to stay focused on the Book of John,especially Chapter 1,for now.

But you asked what I think about the prexistence of darkness and sin - the Scriptures are clear that the earth was unformed and void-the darkness was upon the face of the deep,the Spirit of God Hovered over the face of the waters

A void is an empty space,I think the earth was not even the " earth" yet but to understand that empty space or place that will be a formed and structured planet it is called earth as we see later in Chapter 9.....

Its hard to imagine the Existence of our Eternal Almighty God in what we know as " space" or the universe before the universe was made....I certainly cannot wrap my head around that but God's Word Tells me there He IS,the Creator Who Made all things and put order to them

And Adam and Eve were not the first created beings to " sin"..  we know lucifer,the angelic being rebelled first

But the Word of God is Written for man,for no other created by His Word.The Word of God was with God,is God and all things were Made by Him and through Him yet only man can be Saved by Him and through Him...

I Believe what is Written,that does not mean I understand all the hows,when's,where's or whys but for some reason I no longer try to rationalize,God Said it,it is so...but that's just me( after many decades of brain cramps,lol now there's Peace)

Be happy to join a Topic all about Genesis Study❤️

With love in Christ, Kwik

I meant this to be a study of John. I was referencing this from David Guzik in chapter one and his interpretation. ii. “In the first creation, ‘darkness was upon the face of the deep’ (Genesis 1:2) until God called light into being, so the new creation involves the banishing of spiritual darkness by the light which shines in the Word.” (Bruce)

In other words, I was trying to get a feel for his doctrines from the get-go, such as old Earth vs. new Earth. But, thus far, it is excellent and worth reading and discussing. I do not think I have ever heard of him before.

[Dennis1209]

1 hour ago, BibleWords said:

I don’t believe the gap theory has any credibility at all.

There is no scriptural evidence for it.

C. I. Scofield was wrong in his assessment of the beginning.

He was good on a lot of other things, including dispensationalism and the rapture, but I think he completely missed it on the doctrine of the beginning.

See my comment above.

[HAZARD]

5 hours ago, BibleWords said:

I don’t believe the gap theory has any credibility at all.

There is no scriptural evidence for it.

C. I. Scofield was wrong in his assessment of the beginning.

He was good on a lot of other things, including dispensationalism and the rapture, but I think he completely missed it on the doctrine of the beginning.

There were two great floods on the Earth, 1. we shall call Lucifer's flood brought upon the Earth because of Lucifer's rebellion, and 2. Noah's flood caused by the rebellion of man. Many Scriptures show there was a great difference between them, all we need do is read every one and believe what we read.

 

The first where God destroyed His original creation because of Lucifer's rebellion, and the second, Noah's flood because of mans rebellion.

Lucifer's flood, everything was destroyed, all life, no light, the earth made empty and void.

Noah's flood, all life was not destroyed. Noah, his wife, his sons and their wives were left alive, plus all animals and the sun and moon was not prevented from giving light.

Here are all the Scriptures proving this occurred, read them for yourself then believe them or not??

Noah's flood which I will post as . 'N.F.' Lucifer's flood, L.F.

L.F. Earth made waste (Gen. 1:2; Jer. 4:23-26; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Earth not made waste (Gen. 8:11-12, 22 ; Heb. 11:7 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. Earth made empty (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23).
N.F. Earth not made empty (Gen. 6:18-22 ; 8:16).

L.F. Earth made totally dark (Gen. 1:2-5 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Not made totally dark (Gen. 8:6-22)

L.F. No light from heaven (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Light from heaven (Gen. 8:6-22).

L.F. No day and night (Gen. 1:2-5).
N.F. Day and night (Gen. 8:1-22).

L.F. All vegetation destroyed Gen. 1:2 ; 2:5-6 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Vegetation not destroyed (Gen. 8:11, 21 ; 9:3, 20).

L.F. No continued abating of the waters off the earth (Gen. 1:6-12).
N.F. Continued abating of the waters from the earth by evaporation (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. Waters taken off the earth in one day (Gen. 1:10).
N.F. Months of waters abating off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. God supernaturally takes waters off the earth (Gen. 1:6-12).
N.F. Natural work of evaporation of the waters off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. No rebuke or miraculous work in fled away (Gen. 1:6-12 ; Ps. 104:7).
N.F. No rebuke or miraculous work is taking waters off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. The waters on earth in Gen. 1:2, hasted away when rebuked (Gen. 1:6-2 ; Ps. 104:9).
N.F. The bounds already eternally set for waters in Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. All fish were totally destroyed in flood of Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. No fish were destroyed of created again after Noah's flood (Gen. 1:20-23 ; 6:18-22).

L.F. No Fowls left on the earth after (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Fowls were left after Noah's flood (Gen. 6:20 ; 8:7-17).

L.F. No animals left after (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Some of all animals kept alive (Gen. 6:20 ; 8:17 ; 9:2-4, 10-16).

L.F. No man left on earth in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Eight men and women left after Noah's flood (Gen. 6:18 ; 8:15-22 ; 9:1-16 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. No social system left at all in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. A social system left after Noah's flood (Gen. 8:15-22 ; 9:1-16 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. No ark made to save men in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. An ark made to save men and animals alive (Gen. 6:8-8 : 22 ; 9:1-16 ; Heb. 11:7).

L.F. Cause: fall of Lucifer, now Satan (Isa. 14:12-14; Jer. 4:23-26; Ezek. 28:11-17 ; Luke 10:18).
N.F. Cause: wickedness of men (Gen. 6:5-13) ; and fallen angels (Gen. 6:1-4; Jude 6-7 ; 2 Pet. 2:4).

L.F. Result: became necessary to make new life on earth (Gen. 1:3-2 : 25 ; Isa. 45:18 ; Eph. 3:11).
N.F. Results: no new creation made, for all men and animals were not destroyed (Gen. 6:18-8 : 22 ; 9:1-16).

The original creations of God include the heavens and the Earth and all things therein as first brought into being. This period is summed up in Gen. 1:1. thus: "In the beginning God created the heaven [Hebrew, heavens] and the earth." This refers to the dateless past, and takes in only a part of the creative ages, that is, from the beginning of creation until the chaotic period of Gen. 1:2 when the Earth and its first inhabitants were destroyed by the first flood. Notice during Noah's flood not all inhabitants , vegetation, animals, day, night were destroyed.

There are many other passages in Scripture that refer to that period (Job. 38; Ps. 8:3-8; 19:1-6; Prov. 8:22-31; John 1:3,10; Acts 17:24-26; Col. 1:15-18; Heb. 1:1-12; 11:3; Rev. 4:11).

Rev. 4:11).

In Scripture, all instances of obscuring the sun and bringing darkness are the result of judgment, not creation-which is also true of the two universal floods (Genesis 6:8-8:22; Exodus 10:21-23; Isaiah 5:30; Jeremiah 4:23-26).

All predictions of future darkness depict judgment (Matthew 8:12; Matthew 24:29-31; Rev. 6:12-17; Rev. 8:12; Rev. 9:2; Rev. 16:10; Isaiah 13:10; Joel 2:30-3:16; Amos 5:18-20).

Could we say that Genesis 1:2 is the only place in Scripture where darkness and a universal flood are not an act of judgment? If it isn't an option, then Genesis 1:2 proves that there was a pre-Adamite world destroyed by darkness and flood.

No one questions that Noah's flood was an act of judgment, or doubts the existence of free moral agents before the flood actually came. Why then doubt the existence of a pre-Adamite world which was destroyed by the darkness and flood of Genesis 1:2?