What is your View of the 1,000 year Kingdom?

[Vine Abider]

I was brought up to look at tings in a dispensational way.  Therefore I see the kingdom as a literal, thousand year reign on earth that will be implemented shortly after Christ's return.  Overcoming believers are promised a part in the ruling and reigning over the nations with Him, during this time.

This always seemed to me to be a time of great peace and rest, where all things are made right.  Sinful and selfish things will be no more and basically, all would be calm.  Humans would fulfil God's stated purpose in Genesis 1:26 of being in His image and exercising dominion over all the earth and everything on it.  Hallelujah! 

However, while I believe what I said above is basically true, recently in another thread  @AdHoc presented a few verses that got me to realizing there may be more to the kingdom than what I'd thought.  He brought out that overcomers are to "rule the nations with a rod of iron" (Rev 2:27).  Why does it say this?  The answer goes something like this - the nations and people remaining will not be automatically won over to God's way of doing things.  Therefore, there will be the need for swift, loving and righteous judgment on sinful and rebellious acts and some of the retributions may need to be severe.  That is, the age of grace will be over then, and such things will not be tolerated, not even a little.

Could this mean corporal and capital punishment for heinous acts in the kingdom?  Again I'd not really thought about this aspect so much . . . what do you think?

Edited July 16, 2023 by Vine Abider
Modified title to reflect 1000 Kingdom

[Sower]

What is your View of the Kingdom?

2 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

what do you think?

My wife says the kingdom is in us, now.

Well, I think it is going to be really neat, and so different from our experiences today!

Not to sound unconcerned but, you'll have to find me and then ask when we get there...
It is interesting, yet cloaked in some mystery, above my pay grade (knowledge).
While still dealing with the here and now, getting my house in order, 
I'll wait to see what the answer/conclusions offered here.
Thanks VA. Sorry for lack of input.

[TrueFollowerOfChrist]

3 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

I was brought up to look at tings in a dispensational way.  Therefore I see the kingdom as a literal, thousand year reign on earth that will be implemented shortly after Christ's return.  Overcoming believers are promised a part in the ruling and reigning over the nations with Him, during this time.

This always seemed to me to be a time of great peace and rest, where all things are made right.  Sinful and selfish things will be no more and basically, all would be calm.  Humans would fulfil God's stated purpose in Genesis 1:26 of being in His image and exercising dominion over all the earth and everything on it.  Hallelujah! 

However, while I believe what I said above is basically true, recently in another thread  @AdHoc presented a few verses that got me to realizing there may be more to the kingdom than what I'd thought.  He brought out that overcomers are to "rule the nations with a rod of iron" (Rev 2:27).  Why does it say this?  The answer goes something like this - the nations and people remaining will not be automatically won over to God's way of doing things.  Therefore, there will be the need for swift, loving and righteous judgment on sinful and rebellious acts and some of the retributions may need to be severe.  That is, the age of grace will be over then, and such things will not be tolerated, not even a little.

Could this mean corporal and capital punishment for heinous acts in the kingdom?  Again I'd not really thought about this aspect so much . . . what do you think?

I;m someone who takes scripture literally, and I do the same with Revelation. Since chapter 20 actually says there will be a 1,000 year reign, I accept that Jesus WILL reign for 1,000 years from Jerusalem. There are MANY millennial passages in the bible, so I'm not sure how anyone could possibly argue with it. Those mention lots of peace and prosperity, and are absent any mention of evil people or acts. Therefore I think its pretty easy to deduce that there will be NO crime or violence against people and that even evil thoughts ( for example an unbeliever "thinking" about hurting someone will be dealt with instantly by Jesus, either by death or something else that renders them powerless. 

[Michael37]

3 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

I was brought up to look at tings in a dispensational way.  Therefore I see the kingdom as a literal, thousand year reign on earth that will be implemented shortly after Christ's return.  Overcoming believers are promised a part in the ruling and reigning over the nations with Him, during this time.

This always seemed to me to be a time of great peace and rest, where all things are made right.  Sinful and selfish things will be no more and basically, all would be calm.  Humans would fulfil God's stated purpose in Genesis 1:26 of being in His image and exercising dominion over all the earth and everything on it.  Hallelujah! 

However, while I believe what I said above is basically true, recently in another thread  @AdHoc presented a few verses that got me to realizing there may be more to the kingdom than what I'd thought.  He brought out that overcomers are to "rule the nations with a rod of iron" (Rev 2:27).  Why does it say this?  The answer goes something like this - the nations and people remaining will not be automatically won over to God's way of doing things.  Therefore, there will be the need for swift, loving and righteous judgment on sinful and rebellious acts and some of the retributions may need to be severe.  That is, the age of grace will be over then, and such things will not be tolerated, not even a little.

Could this mean corporal and capital punishment for heinous acts in the kingdom?  Again I'd not really thought about this aspect so much . . . what do you think?

The Millennial Reign is one aspect of God's Kingdom: 

Quick Search:

"The Kingdom of God is a concept that has different meanings and interpretations among Christians. It can refer to God's reign over all creation, God's spiritual reign over His people, God's future reign in the millennial kingdom, or God's government through divine guidance. The Kingdom of God is also related to God's authority, will, kingship, covenant, and eternity¹.

The teachings of Jesus Christ center on the Kingdom of God. The Kingdom of God can be summarized as the everlasting realm where God is sovereign and Jesus Christ rules forever¹². The phrase occurs frequently in the New Testament, primarily used by Jesus Christ in the first three Gospels³." [Source: Bingo the Chatbot]

 

[Marilyn C]

3 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

I was brought up to look at tings in a dispensational way.  Therefore I see the kingdom as a literal, thousand year reign on earth that will be implemented shortly after Christ's return.  Overcoming believers are promised a part in the ruling and reigning over the nations with Him, during this time.

This always seemed to me to be a time of great peace and rest, where all things are made right.  Sinful and selfish things will be no more and basically, all would be calm.  Humans would fulfil God's stated purpose in Genesis 1:26 of being in His image and exercising dominion over all the earth and everything on it.  Hallelujah! 

However, while I believe what I said above is basically true, recently in another thread  @AdHoc presented a few verses that got me to realizing there may be more to the kingdom than what I'd thought.  He brought out that overcomers are to "rule the nations with a rod of iron" (Rev 2:27).  Why does it say this?  The answer goes something like this - the nations and people remaining will not be automatically won over to God's way of doing things.  Therefore, there will be the need for swift, loving and righteous judgment on sinful and rebellious acts and some of the retributions may need to be severe.  That is, the age of grace will be over then, and such things will not be tolerated, not even a little.

Could this mean corporal and capital punishment for heinous acts in the kingdom?  Again I'd not really thought about this aspect so much . . . what do you think?

Hi VA,

Glad you started this thread. Now we need to remember that the word `kingdom`, means rule. As I`ve said before in other places, God made everything and everyone, and never gave anything away.

`The earth is the Lord`s and all its fullness, the world and those who dwell therein...` (Ps. 24: 1) 

Thus, it is one part of God`s great kingdom rulership that we are looking at here - the millennium on earth. 

King - David. (also called  Prince)

We are told that a man David, will be king in Israel at that time, and he will have children to pass his inheritance on to.

`they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king...` (Jer. 30: 9)

`and my servant David shall be their prince ...` (Ez. 37: 25)

`Thus says the Lord God: "If the prince gives a gift of some of his inheritance to any of his sons, it is their possession by inheritance.` (Ez. 46: 16)

Priest - Levites.

`and I will take some of them for priests and Levites...` (Isa. 66: 21)

No wars but learning God`s ways.

`Man nations shall come and say, "Come let us go up to the mountain of the Lord to the God of Jacob: He will teach us of His ways, and we shall walk in His paths....nations....neither shall they learn war any more. ` (Micah 4: 2 & 3)

`Rod of Iron.` 

`And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain.

If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the Lord strikes the nations who do not come up to keep the feast of Tabernacles. ` (Zech. 14: 17 & 18)

`No rain,` means drought, famine, sickness, plagues, death.

[AdHoc]

3 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

I was brought up to look at tings in a dispensational way.  Therefore I see the kingdom as a literal, thousand year reign on earth that will be implemented shortly after Christ's return.  Overcoming believers are promised a part in the ruling and reigning over the nations with Him, during this time.

This always seemed to me to be a time of great peace and rest, where all things are made right.  Sinful and selfish things will be no more and basically, all would be calm.  Humans would fulfil God's stated purpose in Genesis 1:26 of being in His image and exercising dominion over all the earth and everything on it.  Hallelujah! 

However, while I believe what I said above is basically true, recently in another thread  @AdHoc presented a few verses that got me to realizing there may be more to the kingdom than what I'd thought.  He brought out that overcomers are to "rule the nations with a rod of iron" (Rev 2:27).  Why does it say this?  The answer goes something like this - the nations and people remaining will not be automatically won over to God's way of doing things.  Therefore, there will be the need for swift, loving and righteous judgment on sinful and rebellious acts and some of the retributions may need to be severe.  That is, the age of grace will be over then, and such things will not be tolerated, not even a little.

Could this mean corporal and capital punishment for heinous acts in the kingdom?  Again I'd not really thought about this aspect so much . . . what do you think?

It really boils down to the question;

Do the Nations who survive the Great Tribulation get a new nature or not?

If "Yes", then we must be able to show when they received it and what nature it is. Within this answer you'll have to explain why it suddenly reverses itself for Magog's rebellion.

If "No", then the carnal mind is at enmity with God. Romans 7 continues to be valid so that even under threat of death the Nations will be unable to keep any Laws.

The rod of iron will have a major effect though. I lived in a Middle Eastern monarchy for six years and the draconian sentences were a great deterrent. You could mostly leave your house and car unlocked and women were safe to be out alone. But this was no guarantee, and every now and again there was a heinous crime committed. Man is hopelessly fallen.

Romans 5:12-17 is still valid and Adam's nature will still be passed from man for those not in resurrection. Israel gets three effective helps to keep the Law. 1. It is written inside of them, not on stone tables. 2. The receive a new heart. 3. They receive a new spirit (Jer.31:31-33, Ezek.11:19, 36:26). Those of the Nations don't have this advantage.

[AdHoc]

2 hours ago, Sower said:

What is your View of the Kingdom?

My wife says the kingdom is in us, now.

Well, I think it is going to be really neat, and so different from our experiences today!

Not to sound unconcerned but, you'll have to find me and then ask when we get there...
It is interesting, yet cloaked in some mystery, above my pay grade (knowledge).
While still dealing with the here and now, getting my house in order, 
I'll wait to see what the answer/conclusions offered here.
Thanks VA. Sorry for lack of input.

Briefly, your wife is correct. But it is not the whole matter.

A Kingdom, by definition, is an area or sphere which is ruled by a king who can make his laws stick.

God, being All-mighty, and being the author of the universe, is rightful owner and has the power to make His rules stick. But He put a restriction on Himself. He made the area of the earth dependent on a partner - man. This man has failed in his duties and so while there is no trouble in heaven and the rest of the universe, earth does not have a record of keeping His rules. Added to this, even if the king can make his rules stick, any uprising in thought word and/or deed is a blemish and needs dealing with.

In the past, Israel was, for a while, invincible. But they succumbed to Law-breaking and God took away their "sphere" - the Land of Canaan. After Nebuchadnezzar deported Judah, God is called only the "God of heaven", not "The God of Heaven and Earth". It is not that He has lost ownership, but that His partner has failed and God's House was destroyed.

At the moment, God is king in the Church. He gave the keys to us. He expects man to govern the Church according to His rules. So John can say in Revelation 1:9 that he is in the Kingdom.

God dwells in a Christian and so His Kingdom is "within" us.

But God has not instituted His Kingdom on the earth - YET. Jesus, Son of Man, is busy preparing a replacement government. While He does that, the Gentiles rule. When the New Man of Ephesians 2 is ready, God will, through the Man Jesus and His Overcomers, take the earth by force (Dan.2, Rev.19). This is the everlasting Kingdom, the first 1,000 years of which are for subduing enemies, having the Wedding Feast and rewarding or chastising the Church. Christ and His Overcomers will uphold God's will on earth and the Kingdom will be assertive among all men and over the whole earth.

[Vine Abider]

22 minutes ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi VA,

Glad you started this thread. Now we need to remember that the word `kingdom`, means rule. As I`ve said before in other places, God made everything and everyone, and never gave anything away.

`The earth is the Lord`s and all its fullness, the world and those who dwell therein...` (Ps. 24: 1) 

Thus, it is one part of God`s great kingdom rulership that we are looking at here - the millennium on earth. 

King - David. (also called  Prince)

We are told that a man David, will be king in Israel at that time, and he will have children to pass his inheritance on to.

`they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king...` (Jer. 30: 9)

`and my servant David shall be their prince ...` (Ez. 37: 25)

`Thus says the Lord God: "If the prince gives a gift of some of his inheritance to any of his sons, it is their possession by inheritance.` (Ez. 46: 16)

Priest - Levites.

`and I will take some of them for priests and Levites...` (Isa. 66: 21)

No wars but learning God`s ways.

`Man nations shall come and say, "Come let us go up to the mountain of the Lord to the God of Jacob: He will teach us of His ways, and we shall walk in His paths....nations....neither shall they learn war any more. ` (Micah 4: 2 & 3)

`Rod of Iron.` 

`And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain.

If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the Lord strikes the nations who do not come up to keep the feast of Tabernacles. ` (Zech. 14: 17 & 18)

`No rain,` means drought, famine, sickness, plagues, death.

Thanks Marilyn.  You made a statement right at the beginning about God never giving anything away, which I wonder how that lines-up with this verse: "The highest heavens belong to the LORD, but the earth he has given to mankind."  Psalm 115:16

And in John 17:22 we see: "The glory that you have given me I have given to them." 

The Psalms also ask (in two places), "What is man that You are mindful of him?"  (8:4 & 144:3; also quoted in Hebrews 2:6) Hebrews)

Indeed, what is man that God gives us these things!?

[Vine Abider]

1 hour ago, Michael37 said:

The Millennial Reign is one aspect of God's Kingdom: 

Quick Search:

"The Kingdom of God is a concept that has different meanings and interpretations among Christians. It can refer to God's reign over all creation, God's spiritual reign over His people, God's future reign in the millennial kingdom, or God's government through divine guidance. The Kingdom of God is also related to God's authority, will, kingship, covenant, and eternity¹.

The teachings of Jesus Christ center on the Kingdom of God. The Kingdom of God can be summarized as the everlasting realm where God is sovereign and Jesus Christ rules forever¹². The phrase occurs frequently in the New Testament, primarily used by Jesus Christ in the first three Gospels³." [Source: Bingo the Chatbot]

 

You are saying the kingdom of God is forever, right?  I remember verses that state this. (Psalm 145:13, Dan 4:3, 2 Pet 1:11) So you are saying that it is clearer to instead say the "thousand year kingdom reign" or "millennial reign" when speaking of the 1,000 year period between His 2nd coming and the new heaven/new earth? 

FYI - for clarity I modified the title of this thread to reflect the 1,000 year period

[Michael37]

1 minute ago, Vine Abider said:

You are saying the kingdom of God is forever, right?  I remember verses that state this. (Psalm 145:13, Dan 4:3, 2 Pet 1:11) So you are saying that it is clearer to instead say the "thousand year kingdom reign" or "millennial reign" when speaking of the 1,000 year period between His 2nd coming and the new heaven/new earth? 

Either or. Interchangeable, like Kingdom of Heaven and Kingdom of God.