Did the 'dead' rise before Christ did?

[DeighAnn]

2 hours ago, Buzzard3 said:

In that case, what's the difference between a soul and a resurrected human?

the body

 

2 hours ago, Buzzard3 said:

In that case, what's the difference between a soul and a resurrected human?

???

Whatever form Moses and Elijah took on that occasion, they weren't resurrected, since no one was resurrected before Jesus was.  

Moses and Elijah could have appeared as visions, or they could have been given temporary bodies like those given to the angels who visited Abraham and ate with him (Gen 18).

So it was just DECEPTION on the part of God.  

I don't buy it

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, Buzzard3 said:

Yes.

Because they're alive as souls in Heaven (awaiting the resurrection when Christ comes again at the end of time).

If they are IN HEAVEN THEN THEY HAVE BEEN RAISED UP.  

AND HOW ARE THE DEAD RAISED UP AND WITH WHAT BODY DO THEY COME?

it is sown in corruption it is raised in incorruption, sown a natural body raised a spiritual body. 

That is what I believe.  Is that what you believe? 

I BELIEVE it EXACTLY AS IT IS WRITTEN.  You don't.  


YOU BELIEVE 

WE ARE NOT RAISED UP IN A BODY AT ALL BUT BODY LESS,

AND THEN

WE RETURN AND ARE SOMEHOW JOINED TO A DEAD BODY AND ???? BORN AGAIN, FORMED AGAIN, BUT PUT INTO A BODY THAT IS RAISED UP WITHOUT A SOUL????




 

[DeighAnn]

QUESTION

when THE BODYLESS SOUL RETURNS with Christ

does it go into the grave and the body reform around it

or does the corpse rise up and then the soul posses the corpse which makes it alive again?


AND WHERE IS ANY OF THIS WRITTEN  or is it just a THEORY OR DOCTRINE BASED UPON

AND THE DEAD RISE FIRST?  

 

[Shilohsfoal]

59 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Do NOT PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH.  

JUST BECAUSE YOU CAN ONLY SEE IT ONE WAY DOESN'T MEAN THAT IS THE WAY I SEE IT.  JUST BECAUSE I BELIEVE ONE THING DOESN'T MEAN I BELIEVE SOMETHING ELSE

THAT IS YOU PUTTING WHAT I BELIEVE INTO THE MIDDLE OF YOUR BELIEFS

DON'T DO IT AGAIN OR I WILL REPORT YOU

 

You said the great tribulation in Daniel 12 took place in 27 ad.- 30ad.

That is when Daniel says the king of the north dies.

 

You can't seem to keep your stories straight.

 

 

[Shilohsfoal]

56 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

WHAT IS SAID it there was GREAT TRIBULATION that took place during the time of Jesus

I did not say it was the trib of the end time

I did not say the man of sin came

I did not say the beast rose up

I said there was great tribulation signs in the sun, an earthquake and that the GRAVES WERE OPENED  a prophecy given in of the old test and the scroll Jesus read from the Isa 61 speaking to the of setting free the captives...

THAT is what I said.  That is what I meant.  I have not be discussing the last days except to say the GRAVES WERE opened as stated in dan 12 was about those days and not the resurrection of the dead in the future.   

 

So you admit the resurrection of Daniel 12:1-2 did not take place between 27ad -33 ad.

 

Thank you for admitting that.

[DeighAnn]

And in answer to a question from earlier as to IF all the saints from the OLD test rose up or not and if there were any stragglers left...

I go back to   

Those who came out of the Babylonian captivity to rebuild the temple.  

By the time Jesus walked the earth, the Rulers and Chief Priests for the most part were NOT of those who gone into the captivity but of those who had come out of Babylon and those appointed by Rome. 

The reason the CHIEF PRIESTS wanted Jesus killed was because they were rapidly losing their congregations aka THE TRUE BLOOD LINE/those who heard His voice, and feared they would soon would lose their nation.   

So, by the time of His ministry, it wasn't the JEWS of the bloodline but the "Jews" of THE SYNAGOGUE of Satan claiming to be JEWS an evil generation, and the generation that would see the temple destroyed who were in charge.     




So YES, Dan 12 resurrection was all them that slept, and those who were of the bloodline converted to GRACE before they died. 




  


Ezra

1Now in the first year of Cyrus king of Persia, that the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah might be fulfilled, the LORD stirred up the spirit of Cyrus king of Persia, that he made a proclamation throughout all his kingdom, and put it also in writing, saying,

2Thus saith Cyrus king of Persia, The LORD God of heaven hath given me all the kingdoms of the earth; and he hath charged me to build him an house at Jerusalem, which is in Judah.

3Who is there among you of all his people? his God be with him, and let him go up to Jerusalem, which is in Judah, and build the house of the LORD God of Israel, (he is the God,) which is in Jerusalem.

2

43The Nethinims: the children of Ziha, the children of Hasupha, the children of Tabbaoth,

44The children of Keros, the children of Siaha, the children of Padon,

45The children of Lebanah, the children of Hagabah, the children of Akkub,

46The children of Hagab, the children of Shalmai, the children of Hanan,

47The children of Giddel, the children of Gahar, the children of Reaiah,

48The children of Rezin, the children of Nekoda, the children of Gazzam,

49The children of Uzza, the children of Paseah, the children of Besai,

50The children of Asnah, the children of Mehunim, the children of Nephusim,

51The children of Bakbuk, the children of Hakupha, the children of Harhur,

52The children of Bazluth, the children of Mehida, the children of Harsha,

53The children of Barkos, the children of Sisera, the children of Thamah,

54The children of Neziah, the children of Hatipha.

55The children of Solomon's servants: the children of Sotai, the children of Sophereth, the children of Peruda,

56The children of Jaalah, the children of Darkon, the children of Giddel,

57The children of Shephatiah, the children of Hattil, the children of Pochereth of Zebaim, the children of Ami.

58All the Nethinims, and the children of Solomon's servants, were three hundred ninety and two.

59And these were they which went up from Telmelah, Telharsa, Cherub, Addan, and Immer: but they could not shew their father's house, and their seed, whether they were of Israel:

60The children of Delaiah, the children of Tobiah, the children of Nekoda, six hundred fifty and two.

61And of the children of the priests: the children of Habaiah, the children of Koz, the children of Barzillai; which took a wife of the daughters of Barzillai the Gileadite, and was called after their name:

62These sought their register among those that were reckoned by genealogy,

but they were not found: therefore were they, as polluted, put from the priesthood.

 5411. nethinim ►
Strong's Concordance
nethinim: temple servants
Original Word: נָתִין
Part of Speech: Noun Masculine
Transliteration: nethinim
Phonetic Spelling: (naw-theen')
Definition: temple servants
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from nathan
Definition
temple servants
NASB Translation
temple servants (16).

Brown-Driver-Briggs
נְתִינִים noun masculine plural Nethinim (properly those given to the service of the sanctuary, as Levites are called נְתוּנִים Numbers 3:9; Numbers 8:16,19); — only 1 Chronicles 9:2 (where distinguished from priests and Levites) + 16 t. Ezra Nehemiah (often distinguished from priests, Levites and porters; Ezra 8:17 Kt has הנתונים, Qr הַנְּתִינִים), namely: Ezra 2:43,58,70 = Nehemiah 7:46; Nehemiah 7:60; Nehemiah 7:72 (so Baer, Ginsb; van d. H. Nehemiah 7:73), Ezra 7:7; Ezra 8:17,20 (appointment ascribed to David, compare 1 Chronicles 9:2), 1 Chronicles 9:20; Nehemiah 10:29; Nehemiah 11:3; living on the Ophel Nehemiah 3:26; Nehemiah 11:21; with their own overseers Nehemiah 11:21, having a house known (in part) by their name Nehemiah 3:31. — On ׳נ see further BauPriesterthum 100, 142 f.




EZRA 8:15
And I gathered them together to the river that runneth to Ahava; and there abode we in tents three days: and I viewed the people, and the priests,

and found there none of the sons of Levi.

 Long story short, even by the time they came out of the captivity, those who went to build and serve in the temple  had already begun to take over the PRIESTLY DUTIES for the tribe of LEVI.   

by the time Jesus walked the earth they had succeeded taking over the priesthood and that is why Jesus called them out as He did.  

 

[DeighAnn]

23 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

You can't seem to keep your stories straight.

I'm not the one having the problem keeping my story straight.  

[DeighAnn]

21 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

So you admit the resurrection of Daniel 12:1-2 did not take place between 27ad -33 ad.

 

Thank you for admitting that.

I didn't admit that, YOU SAID I DID.  You don't seem to be able to read and comprehend.  

Start back at the beginning of the thread and see if you can follow the conversation.  

[Shilohsfoal]

36 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

I didn't admit that, YOU SAID I DID.  You don't seem to be able to read and comprehend.  

Start back at the beginning of the thread and see if you can follow the conversation.  

So you are still insisting that the resurrection that takes place at the time of the end in Daniel 12:1-2 took place in 27 ad or not?

Make up you mind already.

Daniel lists these things taking place at that time. The son of perdition dies in Daniel 11:45,The great tribulation takes place in Daniel 12:1 and the resurrection of Daniels people ,everyone who names are written in Daniel 12:1-2.

 

And you never mentioned the son of perditions name by the way.

 

Daniel 11:45-12:2

And he shall pitch the tabernacle of his palace between the seas in the holy mountain of beauty: but he shall come to his portion, and there is none to deliver him.

And at that time Michael the great prince shall stand up, that stands over the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of tribulation, such tribulation as has not been from the time that there was a nation on the earth until that time: at that time thy people shall be delivered, even every one that is written in the book.

And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to reproach and everlasting shame.
 

 

I'd really like to know when your saying Michael blew that trumpet.

 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Guest AFlameOfFire]

 

I didn't read the whole thread, but here were two errors in the works at that time. One that is shown in the gospels and then Paul appears to adress the same leaven or doctrine in 1 Co 15:12

Acts 23:8 For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, neither angel, nor spirit: but the Pharisees confess both.

Mat 16:6 Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.

Acts 23:8 or the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection

As with the leaven of Sadducees the same leaven  started among them

1Cr 15:12 Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead? 

So the one says there is "no resurrection" (the Sadducees) and that same leaven begins to take root in the early church, Paul pointing out the same saying, how say some among you there is no resurrection of the dead

Then on the other hand there were these two, Hymenaeus and Philetus,

2Ti 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past; and overthrow the faith of some.