Did the 'dead' rise before Christ did?

[DeighAnn]

19 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

You'll have to answer that one; being the one who posts very long and pointless posts.

Attack??  No, I'm pointing out how unclear your posts are.  There is no clarifying in them.  So how can anyone understand your questions when you don't define the words/terms you use?

For example, "the dead", a phrase you have used quite often.  What are you referring to?  

the dead caucasions?

the dead asians?

the dead Eskimos?

See what I mean?  You have to clarify your terms, since nothing is obvious in your postss.  

Oh, also there are:

the dead saved

the dead unsaved

Well, since you seem to hardly ever make a point in your posts, I just keep looking.

Well, that's funny.  You claim you "put forth the truth" YET you claim there is just one resurrection, even though Rev 20:5 clearly indicates that the FIRST resurrection is 1,000 years before the next one.  And all the verses I've shown that plainly show a resurrection for the saved and a resurrection for the unsaved.

So don't tell me about putting for the truth.  You don't believe the truth as you've shown.

Oh, so now you're being "persecuted" because I can't understand your failure to clarify?   I'm beginning to think you don't know the meaning of words.  That WOULD explain a lot.  Like why you aren't able to clarify.

WHAT does 1 Corinth 15:38 SAY?  

YOU believe the words of God are NON SENSICAL.  

WE have nothing more to discuss. 

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

FreeGrace said: 

Please edit this non-sensical word salad.  Maybe reading it out loud to see how it sounds to your ears.

It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?

So I see that instead of taking my advice, and editing the unintelligible sentence (?), you resort to more irrelevant sentences which have nothing to do with the discussion I'm trying to have with you.

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

26Fear them not therefore: for there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; and hid, that shall not be known.

27What I tell you in darkness, that speak ye in light: and what ye hear in the ear, that preach ye upon the housetops.

28And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Thank you for not including the citation.  And, when you figure out your point for quoting the 3 verses, let me know.

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

In the parable of the RICH MAN AND LAZARUS after they died and they were separated by the gulf but still talking

what BODY do you think they were in, when they were doing all that talking to each other?

God didn't reveal the state of the soul after leaving the physical body.  All I know is what I read in Scripture;  that there are examples of some who have died but were recognizable to living people.  

1 Sam 28:3 Samuel was dead.  Yet, when Saul had a seance with a witch, the Bible SAYS Samuel appeared before Saul and talked with him.  

John SAW souls under the altar speaking in Rev 6.

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

17I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

WOULDN'T THAT BE 'THEIR SPIRITS' IF indeed, they had no bodies?

Why are you even questioning Jesus' prayer?  What would be the benefit?  You question irrelevant things.  

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

16They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

17Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

18As thou hast sent Me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

19And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

20Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on Me through their word;

21That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent Me.

22And the glory which Thou gavest Me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

23I in them, and Thou in Me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that Thou hast sent Me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

24Father, I will that they also, whom Thou hast given Me, be with me where I am; that they may behold My glory, which Thou hast given Me: for Thou lovedst Me before the foundation of the world.

What is your question?  Or point?

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

THEY when we are on the earth THEY when we are in heaven

Jesus was praying for believers, obviously on earth.

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

and do I have to put what happens when the first body dies again? 

The question doesn't make sense.

What have you done already that you don't want to do again?

And what do you mean by "put"?  That confuses the question.

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Non sensical statement?  You never said it?  You don't believe that God gives a body to a bare grain.

Not unless the Bible SAYS it.  Show me.

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Have YOU ever read 1 Corinth 15:38?  Could you tell me WHAT YOUR BIBLE SAYS?

Sure.  Monthly for over 20 years.

This is what my Bible says:

"But God gives it a body as he has determined, and to each kind of seed he gives its own body."

Now, check out the context and you'll understand what Paul was saying.

What the Bible does NOT say is anything about giving a body to a bare grain.

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

FreeGrace said: 

So, do you really believe that believers will never die?  Then please explain Lazarus, who Jesus RAISED from the DEAD.  John 11.

WHY do you insist on me teaching you the whole bible?

Again you FAIL to answer my question and come up with an irrelevant question of your own.  Why?

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

DID YOU MISS VERSE 4?

No.  Why do you ask?

"When he heard this, Jesus said,  “This sickness will not end in death. No, it is for God’s glory so that God’s Son may be glorified through it.”"

Fact:  Laz DID physically die.  

I guess you missed v.39 - “Take away the stone,” he said. “But, Lord,” said Martha, the sister of the dead man, “by this time there is a bad odor, for he has been there four days.”

So, was Jesus just really confused or was lying?  Do you know?

What Jesus meant in v.4 what that "it will end in God's glory".  You see, Laz came back from the dead.  In his physical body.  And therefore, he physically died again.

That is implied from 12:9 Meanwhile a large crowd of Jews found out that Jesus was there and came, not only because of him but also to see Lazarus, whom he had raised from the dead.  10 So the chief priests made plans to kill Lazarus as well,

If Laz was immortal, it would have been obvious.

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

a being is body and soul made in our image not immaterial

This is confused.  A "body and soul" is NOT "made in our image".  Where in the world did you get that?

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

all the rest of your responses have been answered even if not understood.  

In your mind only.

[DeighAnn]

12 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

So I see that instead of taking my advice, and editing the unintelligible sentence (?), you resort to more irrelevant sentences which have nothing to do with the discussion I'm trying to have with you.

Thank you for not including the citation.  And, when you figure out your point for quoting the 3 verses, let me know.

God didn't reveal the state of the soul after leaving the physical body.  All I know is what I read in Scripture;  that there are examples of some who have died but were recognizable to living people.  

1 Sam 28:3 Samuel was dead.  Yet, when Saul had a seance with a witch, the Bible SAYS Samuel appeared before Saul and talked with him.  

John SAW souls under the altar speaking in Rev 6.

Why are you even questioning Jesus' prayer?  What would be the benefit?  You question irrelevant things.  

What is your question?  Or point?

Jesus was praying for believers, obviously on earth.

The question doesn't make sense.

What have you done already that you don't want to do again?

And what do you mean by "put"?  That confuses the question.

WHAT does 1 Corinth 15:38 SAY?  

YOU believe the words of God are NON SENSICAL.  

WE have nothing more to discuss. 

[FreeGrace]

18 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

WHAT does 1 Corinth 15:38 SAY?

I answered that.

18 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

  YOU believe the words of God are NON SENSICAL.

Nonsense.  Not His words, but YOUR words.

18 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

  WE have nothing more to discuss. 

You make no sense, you have no point, so we will agree to agree that there is nothing more to discuss.

[DeighAnn]

9 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Not unless the Bible SAYS it.  Show me.

Sure.  Monthly for over 20 years.

This is what my Bible says:

"But God gives it a body as he has determined, and to each kind of seed he gives its own body."

Now, check out the context and you'll understand what Paul was saying.

What the Bible does NOT say is anything about giving a body to a bare grain.

WHAT does 1 Corinth 15:38 SAY?  

YOU believe the words of God are NON SENSICAL.  

WE have nothing more to discuss. 

2 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Again you FAIL to answer my question and come up with an irrelevant question of your own.  Why?

No.  Why do you ask?

"When he heard this, Jesus said,  “This sickness will not end in death. No, it is for God’s glory so that God’s Son may be glorified through it.”"

Fact:  Laz DID physically die.  

I guess you missed v.39 - “Take away the stone,” he said. “But, Lord,” said Martha, the sister of the dead man, “by this time there is a bad odor, for he has been there four days.”

So, was Jesus just really confused or was lying?  Do you know?

What Jesus meant in v.4 what that "it will end in God's glory".  You see, Laz came back from the dead.  In his physical body.  And therefore, he physically died again.

That is implied from 12:9 Meanwhile a large crowd of Jews found out that Jesus was there and came, not only because of him but also to see Lazarus, whom he had raised from the dead.  10 So the chief priests made plans to kill Lazarus as well,

If Laz was immortal, it would have been obvious.

WHAT does 1 Corinth 15:38 SAY?  

YOU believe the words of God are NON SENSICAL.  

WE have nothing more to discuss. 

1 minute ago, FreeGrace said:

This is confused.  A "body and soul" is NOT "made in our image".  Where in the world did you get that?

In your mind only.

WHAT does 1 Corinth 15:38 SAY?  

YOU believe the words of God are NON SENSICAL.  

WE have nothing more to discuss. 

[FreeGrace]

2 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

WHAT does 1 Corinth 15:38 SAY?

I answered that.

2 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

YOU believe the words of God are NON SENSICAL.

No, not God's words, but YOUR own words.

2 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

 

 

[DeighAnn]

5 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

6 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Why is GOD giving a BODY to a BARE GRAIN if as you say THIS BODY will be raised up?

I never said God gives a body to a bare grain.  That isn't even a sensical statement.  But yes, God did say our physical bodies will be raised up.  That is the resurrection that occurs at the Second Advent.

6 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

FREEGRACE replied 

 

I never said God gives a body to a bare grain. That isn't even a sensical statement. But yes, God did say our physical bodies will be raised up. That is the resurrection that occurs at the Second Advent.





 the original on page 16 BECAUSE here I am going to TRY to make it LESS CONFUSING BECAUSE that is 100% THE OPPOSITE OF WHAT GOD SAYS.    

 

The common death
the death of the first body
the death we are not to fear
the as in Adam all die death

 

THAT is the ONLY DEATH

and what happens at the sowing/dissolving/death of this body? 



 

Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.

34Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

35But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?

36Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

37And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:

 

38But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.



Why is GOD giving a BODY to a BARE GRAIN if as you say THIS BODY will be raised up?


 

39All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds.

40There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

41There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.

42So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

43It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

44It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I ASKED THAT ONE QUESTION IN THE MIDDLE OF SCRIPTURE.  



I call you out on your answer of IT BEING non sensical.



So, YOU GO back to A REPLY I MADE TO SOMEONE ELSE, THAT CONTAINED A TYPING MISTAKE EASY TO FIGURE OUT FROM THE CONVERSATION IT WENT TO

BUT TAKEN OUT OF THAT CONTEXT, LIKE YOU DID

WASN'T

and SURE ENOUGH make it all about that.....

             It was either that or ADMIT you had NO IDEA what was written.  



 MUST NOT HAVE EVER PLANTED A SEED YOURSELF.  

THE SEED ITSELF DIES, AND THE PLANT SPRINGS FORTH FROM THE DEAD SEED. 


THE DEAD SEED NEVER DOES ANYTHING EVER AGAIN BUT DECOMPOSE. 



IT NEVER 'BECOMES A SEED' AGAIN.  

BASIC BOTANY.  


 

New International Version
Very truly I tell you, unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds.

New Living Translation
I tell you the truth, unless a kernel of wheat is planted in the soil and dies, it remains alone. But its death will produce many new kernels—a plentiful harvest of new lives.

English Standard Version
Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains alone; but if it dies, it bears much fruit.

Berean Standard Bible
Truly, truly, I tell you, unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a seed; but if it dies, it bears much fruit.

Berean Literal Bible
Truly, truly, I say to you, unless the grain of wheat, having fallen into the ground, should die, it abides alone; but if it should die, it bears much fruit.

King James Bible
Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.


our BODY is the OUTER SHELL OF THE BARE GRAIN (SPIRITUAL BODY) THAT RISES UP FROM IT.  

GOD USES these simple things of the world to describe things for us to understand how HE works.  

WHY YOU INSIST 

THE ACTUAL SEED COMES BACK TO LIFE  

is beyond me.  Maybe go talk with some farmers, or scientists ASK ANY OF THEM IF THE SEED HAVING PRODUCED EVER COMES BACK TO BEING A SEED OR IF IT JUST BECOMES A PART OF THE EARTH.