THE NEW COVENANT

[jeremiah1five]

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

I understand your sentiments. Paul, in Romans 9, was ready to trade his salvation for "his brethren according to the FLESH." There is however a series of events that you did not mention and which casts a different light on the matter. Israel's story does not start at Pentecost and 3,000 Jews. And nor does the narrative of the "Ekklesia" - commonly called the Church of Christ begin there.

Yes, that's true. More comprehensively the ekklesia began in the desert at the time of the Tabernacle after God "called out" His people out of Egypt. They were known as the "Great Congregation" of over 3 million descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob/Israel.

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

From Adam to Noah the people of this earth were one nation.

There were two peoples. The covenant sons of God and the non-covenant daughters of men.

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

At Babel God divided them in to THE Nations by langauge. The only thing they had in common was their ORIGIN - Adam. Some centuries later, God separated a Syrian for His purposes of recovering man, and because this Syrian's wife was barren, God had to intervene. She bore a son and in God's Covenant with Syrian Abraham, this was the line to which the Covenant applied. "IN Isaac shall your seed be called": That is, ORIGIN was everything when it comes to being part of God's plan. Isaac, via Jacob, sired a special nation of 12 Tribes from four women. As you have rightly pointed out, they are the only Nation to have the Covenants and Words of God. (You forgot Noah's Covenant with all flesh - Gen.9:17, but it has little bearing on your posting, so let's let it slide). The main point is achieved - ORIGIN is everything.

Abram was known as Abram the Hebrew, purportedly from the loins of Eber.

13 And there came one that had escaped, and told Abram the Hebrew; Gen. 14:13.

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

Israel, brought forth a Man via a Israelite woman. But since this woman was a virgin, God had to again intervene. God took the male part and this resulted in that special Man being fully Man and fully God. This is because of a very strict law of the Creator in genesis 1:11-12, which says that every KIND must bring forth its OWN KIND. During His short life, this Man, Jesus, fulfilled the Covenant of Law and went further than Law to die for the guilty - that is, all men.

Christ died for Israel His Church and Bride. And all men are not Israel:

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; Eph. 5:25.

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

Being the Creator, when He died, he released what was IN him. John 12:24 says that He is symbolized by a grain of Wheat, and in accordance with the Law of KINDS, He brought forth a great company of grains of wheat. In reality the Ekklesia is NEW CREATURE. It's ORIGIN is in the Holy Spirit. It is completely New and has NO PAST. It had its ORIGIN on Golgotha via the Holy Spirit.

The ekklesia began in the desert at the time of the Tabernacle except they were called the "Great Congregation" of over 3 million people from the loins of Jacob.

8 Also at the same time Solomon kept the feast seven days, and all Israel with him, a very great congregation, from the entering in of Hamath unto the river of Egypt. 2 Ch 7:8.

      18       I will give thee thanks in the great congregation:
      I will praise thee among much people. Ps 35:18.

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

Reality is real and not to be denied. Practically, the New Creature is made of men and women via a New Birth by the same Holy Spirit. Ephesians 2 says that to make up the New Creature, God took men OUT OF the Nations, and OUT OF the Nation of Israel, and made OUT OF these TWO, ONE NEW MAN (v.15).

Making two (Jew and Gentile) into one will be done when His elect all get to glory. 

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

The first attribute of this New Man s that being born out of death, He had NO PAST. "All things are new" (2nd Cor.5:17). The word "ALL" in the Bible means "ALL". And so, among other things, ETHNICITY IS GONE. Galatians 3:28 and Colossians 3:11-12 categorically state that in the New Man there are no Jews and no Greeks. Etnicity doesn't exist. The second attribute of the New Man is that the Law of Moses was crucified with Christ.

First, Saul is writing to Jewish Christians in the region of Galatia. Thus, his words must be taken in context to who he is writing to: Jewish Christians.

Second, Jews that became born again were concerned about the effect their Messiah had on the Abrahamic and Mosaic Covenants. Saul's letter describes Abraham, Moses, the covenants, the promises, the prophecies, the history of the Jewish people, their culture, their religion, their rituals and practices, and overall, Jewish issues and concerns. All of these things he writes about the Gentile would be oblivious to being carried away by their dumb idols. Case in point:

 23 But before faith came, we [Jews] were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. 24 Wherefore the law was our [Jews] schoolmaster to bring us [Jews] unto Christ, that we [Jews] might be justified by faith. 25 But after that faith is come, we [Jews] are no longer under a schoolmaster. 26 For ye [Jews] are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you [Jews] as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye [Jews] are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye [Jews] be Christ’s, then are ye [Jews] Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise. Gal. 3:22–29.

One main theological belief and prayer of the Jewish men was they would pray God "I thank thee, O' God/Yahweh, that I was not born a Gentile, or a slave, or a woman."

But in one sentence the Pharisee in Saul destroys that theology before establishing that if you are Christ's/Messiah's then it's perfectly well and good because your relationship as a son of Abraham in covenant is maintained. And that question was one that the born-again believers in the Jewish Church had to address as in the beginning they muddled through the New Covenant and Messiah's effect on their covenant and religion. It was Saul's way of comforting those worried about their standing in the Abrahamic Covenant.

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

The reasons for this are; (i) that Christ had fulfilled the law and could impute its righteousness to any man, (ii) Christ had fulfilled it perfectly and God only approved Christ's standard, and (iii) the Law forbade Jews to have relations with Gentiles. Thus, the Law was "at enmity" with the UNITY that God wanted among His Ekklesia. It was a "PARTITION", and had to be abolished. The only remaining thing for God to do was to create the legal basis for ex-Gentiles to be made partakers of the Covenant made with Abraham.

Actually, it is the Ministry of the Holy Spirit to impute Christ's Righteousness to only those whose names are in the book of life of the lamb slain from [before] the foundation (creation) of the world.

God still command His New Covenant Jews to maintain separation from the world of non-covenant anyone:

15 Love not the world [unbelievers], neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.  1 Jn 2:15.

4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

 James 4:4.

God wants His covenant people to maintain their purity and conversation.

There is no such thing as ex-Gentiles. After the destruction of the Temple - and even before - Gentiles never were and never today are in Covenant with God when they become born-again. If God wanted Gentiles in Covenant with Him, He would have made covenant with them but there is nowhere in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets (Jewish Scriptures) of God making any covenant with Gentiles nor the seed of Gentiles. The New Covenant is with the House of Israel and the House of Judah, and if God wanted covenant with Gentiles, He would have included them in the New Covenant found in Jeremiah 31:31-34. But He didn't. God is saving Gentiles without covenant.

On 10/19/2023 at 9:20 AM, AdHoc said:

This, God very cleverly does by (i) the Ekklesia coming out of Jesus - Himself a seed of Abraham, (ii) "adopting" the ex-gentiles. Adoption makes a man HEIR without being the bloodline, and (iii) making a "Commonwealth of Israel". The word "Commonwealth" is a legal arrangement where member states enjoy the trading rights of the leading Nation WITHOUT LOSING THEIR SOVEREIGNTY. That is, a New Zealander may travel and trade on the back of Great Britain without giving up his New Zealander citizenship and local laws.

There is a New Man. ORIGIN is EVERYTHING: He comes from the Holy Spirit. He comes out of the death of Jesus. He is totally New. There are no Jews nor are there Gentiles in the New Man. Israel is of the earth. The New Man is of heaven. But the New Man enjoys the Covenant of Promise made with Abraham by three legal maneuvers of a profoundly clever God. At he same time, the New Man has nothing to do with Israel, does not partake of its citizenship, and is not bound by the law of Moses.

Israel is both from below and from above. That is the covenant they have and the prophecies of Israel's identity before God is maintained and not mixed in this world. God has covenant with the House of Israel not Gentiles. God has maintained distinction:

32 Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:

1 Co 10:32.

And at the time this was written the Church of God was populated by Jewish Christians and distinct from unsaved Gentiles and unsaved Jews.

[JohnD]

On 10/19/2023 at 1:12 PM, other one said:

That's a good way to start a fight.

A fight for a worthy cause should never be avoided,

how much moreso when it is the truth.

[other one]

5 minutes ago, JohnD said:

A fight for a worthy cause should never be avoided,

how much moreso when it is the truth.

but people will be more likely to listen to you if you are not offending them.   What good is the truth when people stop listening.

Stop to ponder...

[jeremiah1five]

On 10/19/2023 at 1:48 PM, Michael37 said:

This is true, and very well put, @AdHoc

Strange you would think the above, given this below

Eph 2:11-13 Therefore remember that formerly you who are Gentiles in the flesh and called uncircumcised by the so-called circumcision (that done in the body by human hands)— (12) remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. (13) But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.

Mentioning Gentiles in his letter to Ephesus does not mean it was addressed to them.

The Ephesian church was founded by Jewish Christians and populated by Jewish Christians until soon after the destruction of their Temple. So, the early Church Christ was building was founded by Jews and everything about this founding was Jewish for about 4 decades after the Feast of Harvests. The Times of the Gentiles did not begin until the Destruction of the Temple and soon after.

[jeremiah1five]

On 10/19/2023 at 3:16 PM, AdHoc said:

Thank you for your comprehensive reply. I have read it through twice. You have built an argument without giving any scriptures, which I understand because the subject is big and the scriptures are many. Books have been written on the subject. If you will allow, I will let my reply stand, without further comment, next to yours and the other interested readers can judge. We are so far apart that any discussion on one or more points will be lost in the total.

Nevertheless, I wish you Godspeed - and, thanks for the exchange.

Here's a Scripture from the lips of the Savior:

24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Mt 15:24.

There is no evidence in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets of God ever making covenant with Gentiles.

And the mere discussion by the New Covenant writers (Saul, Peter, James, John, etc.) of Gentiles and their relationship to Christ does not make them part of the covenants of God with Israel. Jesus is a Jewish Messiah. He was Promised to Israel. He came to Israel and taught them for 3 years. He died on a cross for Israel as per prophecies and covenant. God sent Christ to His covenant people ONLY and Christ says so a couple of times. The disciples were sent to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. Christ sent His disciples into Gentile lands to herald to the twelve tribes scattered that their Messiah had come and that God has kept His Promises. God spends 4000 years of covenant with a certain Hebrew and his seed, then to his seed directly, sends them prophets, establishes a Jewish nation and kings to rule that nation. God gives this nation of people His Law and progressively reveals more and more of Himself to this nation of Jews, and after 4000 years of dealing intimately with the Jews, Messiah dies for their sins, is buried and resurrected, ascends into heaven has promised the Jews a future nation with their Messiah, Redeemer, and King sitting on David's throne, and once Messiah ascends the first message He sends to the early Jewish Church He promised Israel He was to build and 4000 years of establishing His Bride and Church who are Israel, His first message and letters are to Gentiles???

There's a disconnect there my post answers.

I'll leave it at that.

[jeremiah1five]

The New Covenant:

      31       Behold, the days come, saith the LORD,
      That I will make a new covenant
      With the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
      32       Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers
      In the day that I took them by the hand
      To bring them out of the land of Egypt;
      Which my covenant they brake,
      Although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
      33       But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel;
      After those days, saith the LORD,
      I will put my law in their inward parts,
      And write it in their hearts;
      And will be their God,
      And they shall be my people.
      34       And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying,
      Know the LORD:
      For they shall all know me,
      From the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD:
      For I will forgive their iniquity,
      And I will remember their sin no more.

      Jer. 31:31–34.

There are no Gentiles mentioned here, or anywhere in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets of God making Covenant with Gentiles. None.

God is saving Gentiles without a covenant. 

If God meant to include Gentiles, there would be a record in the Scripture when the covenants were made of God's intention to include Gentiles but there is none.

Israel is the Bride of Christ. Israel is the Church of the Living God. 

At the Marriage Supper Israel is there through Covenant.

Gentiles are there through invitation.

Matt. 22.

[AdHoc]

24 minutes ago, jeremiah1five said:

Here's a Scripture from the lips of the Savior:

24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Mt 15:24.

There is no evidence in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets of God ever making covenant with Gentiles.

And the mere discussion by the New Covenant writers (Saul, Peter, James, John, etc.) of Gentiles and their relationship to Christ does not make them part of the covenants of God with Israel. Jesus is a Jewish Messiah. He was Promised to Israel. He came to Israel and taught them for 3 years. He died on a cross for Israel as per prophecies and covenant. God sent Christ to His covenant people ONLY and Christ says so a couple of times. The disciples were sent to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. Christ sent His disciples into Gentile lands to herald to the twelve tribes scattered that their Messiah had come and that God has kept His Promises. God spends 4000 years of covenant with a certain Hebrew and his seed, then to his seed directly, sends them prophets, establishes a Jewish nation and kings to rule that nation. God gives this nation of people His Law and progressively reveals more and more of Himself to this nation of Jews, and after 4000 years of dealing intimately with the Jews, Messiah dies for their sins, is buried and resurrected, ascends into heaven has promised the Jews a future nation with their Messiah, Redeemer, and King sitting on David's throne, and once Messiah ascends the first message He sends to the early Jewish Church He promised Israel He was to build and 4000 years of establishing His Bride and Church who are Israel, His first message and letters are to Gentiles???

There's a disconnect there my post answers.

I'll leave it at that.

I will address this posting as you have quoted a verse. In your OP and in your answer to my post on page 1, you made statements but gave no scriptures. This is your right, but it gives us no basis to discuss. The verse above, if taken out of the full story, seems to says what you say. But the full story is that a Gentile woman appealed to Jesus as "Son of David" (v.22). David, and the Davidic Covenant are made ONLY for Israel. So, Jesus was saying, if you approach me based on David, I am for Israel ONLY. When you approached Jesus as "Lord"(v.25), he commended her great faith and healed her. Why? Because as God He is the one who Isaiah - a Jewish prophet - predicted that the Gentiles would trust in Him while Israel would reject Him (Matt.12:17-21).

So, it is always good to read the context as well.

But there is more. You are correct. Jesus was sent to Israel. He was promised by the prophets, and even confirmed by Zachariah in Luke Chapter 1 as a redeemer of Israel. But by Matthew Chapter 12 Israel had fully rejected Jesus the Son of David and so Jesus rejects them. In 21:43 He tells them that the kingdom of Heaven is taken from them and given to another "ethnos", and in 23:38 he advised them that God had vacated their Temple.

This does not mean that God cancelled their Covenants. On the contrary, a Covenant, or CONTRACT, really comes into force when one party breaks it. All the penalties come into effect. The Covenant made with Abraham - a Gentile Syrian by the way - promised Israel a LAND. But the Covenant was EXPANDED when Abraham refused the spoils from Gentile hands. He even paid for his burial ground and did not accept the offered gift. So in Romans 4:13 we see that the LAND was EXTENDED to the "Whole Earth". And so TWO SEEDS were promised to Abraham - once as "sand of the sea shore" and another as "stars of heaven". Those of the LAND would inherit Canaan, and those of HEAVEN would rule the world. One would be born of women and one would be born of the Holy Spirit. One would be resurrected with TERRESTRIAL glory and one would be resurrected  with CELESTIAL glory (1st Cor.15).

Now, this other "ETHNOS", or People, or Nation is described by Jesus would be taken OUT OF Israel and OUT OF the Nations (Ephesians 2:15). And they would be a New Creature and a New Man (2nd Cor.5:17). This New Creature would have no past, for ALL THINGS are new and the old passed away. This is seen by it birth from the Holy Spirit and not the womb.

Now, all that remained was to make this New "ETHNOS" eligible for Abraham's INHERITANCE. That is, how was God to make the New Man HEIR to the Covenant made with Abraham. For God this was easy. God decided that the New Man would be IN Jesus, so that when Jesus died as a grain of Wheat, the New Man would come forth out of Jesus like Eve did from Adam (Jn.12:24). That is, if you are IN Christ, and/or you belong to Christ, you are "seed of Abraham" because Jesus was seed of Abraham (Gal.3:29). And Galatians 3:28, the previous verse, confirms that the New Ethnos, the New Man, did not have Jew or Gentile in it. SO, GOD HAD CREATED AN ETHNOS OF PEOPLE WHO WERE NOT ISRAELITES, AND SO NOT UNDER LAW, BUT WHO WERE THE SEED OF ABRAHAM.

Thus, if you are a Jew you are still under BOTH the Covenant of Promise made with Abraham, AND you are under the Covenant of Law made with Moses. Your inheritance will be Canaan. If you are IN Christ you are New Man and HEIR to Christ's Kingdom of Heaven.

The New Covenant, as you correctly say, is made with Israel (Jer.31:31-33). But according to Jeremiah 31 it is NOT IN EFFECT YET. It will become effective "IN THAT DAY" when the House of Israel and the house of Judah ARE ONE NATION AGAIN. In Jeremiah 31:31 it is made with BOTH Houses, but by verse 33 it is ONE HOUSE. This has not happened yet. Israel is still divided and dispersed. What has been done is that it has been RATIFIED. This was done by the blood of Jesus on Golgotha.

Thus, on earth there are THREE Peoples; (i) the Nations, (ii) the Nation of Israel (Paul's brethren according to the flesh - Rom.9), and the New Man (Christ's brethren according to the Spirit). All three are under the Covenant made with Noah (Gen.9:17). Israel is under BOTH the Covenant of Promise made with Abraham AND the Covenant of Law. The New Man is under the Covenant of Promise made with Abraham. Israel will inherit Canaan. The New Man will inherit the earth. David will rule Israel under Christ (Jer.30:9). The Twelve Apostles will rule the 12 Tribes. To be in the Kingdom of Heaven you need to be born again (Jn.3:3-6) so David and the 12 apostles have the New Birth. Israel do not. Israel SERVE Emmanuel (Lk.1:74-75) but forfeit the Kingdom of Heaven.

[jeremiah1five]

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

I will address this posting as you have quoted a verse. In your OP and in your answer to my post on page 1, you made statements but gave no scriptures. This is your right, but it gives us no basis to discuss. The verse above, if taken out of the full story, seems to says what you say. But the full story is that a Gentile woman appealed to Jesus as "Son of David" (v.22). David, and the Davidic Covenant are made ONLY for Israel. So, Jesus was saying, if you approach me based on David, I am for Israel ONLY. When you approached Jesus as "Lord"(v.25), he commended her great faith and healed her. Why? Because as God He is the one who Isaiah - a Jewish prophet - predicted that the Gentiles would trust in Him while Israel would reject Him (Matt.12:17-21).

Israel didn't reject Him. Sure, at His crucifixion the crowd did call out for his crucifixion but the crowd around the cross is not Israel. Not all. The religious leaders were the ones who rejected him but not all there either. Nicodemus and Josep of Arimathaea received him. Weeks/months later in Acts 6 it says a "great company of priests were obedient to the faith." At the Feast of Harvests 3000 Jews were saved. So, God was keeping His covenant promises despite the sin of His people, and He did come to die for the sins of His people.

That's not what Jesus was saying. It has nothing to do with Him, it has to do with her. The same thing can be understood with regard to the Roman centurion who asked Jesus for healing his servant. It has to do with knowledge. And faith rests on knowledge.

27 And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters’ table. 28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. Mt 15:27–28.

How can that one statement cause Jesus to declare her faith as "great"? I submit that it was because she believed the First Covenant Scriptures about him. Not only that, but as Gentile she knew her place with regard to Israel holding all the covenants, the promises, the prophecies - everything with regard to salvation. Gentiles own nothing.  First, she identified Him as a son of David. She understood "my lord said to my Lord, sit here till I make your enemies your footstool." Jesus responded with a test about taking the childrens (of Israel's) bread and cast it to dogs (non-covenant - God made no covenant with Gentiles). Her response is what moved him. She agreed. Said it was [the] truth. "Yet the dogs eat of the crumbs that fall from their MASTER'S table." In other words, as Gentile she directed Jesus to the prophecies that one day that same bread (of Life) would come to Gentiles and that all she wanted were a few crumbs right now against that day. She knew Scripture. And by her knowledge of Scripture, and her faith/trust looking forward to that day Gentiles would get the whole loaf, Jesus rewarded her and healed her daughter and said, O woman, great is thy faith. It was all about her, not Him.

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

So, it is always good to read the context as well.

But there is more. You are correct. Jesus was sent to Israel. He was promised by the prophets, and even confirmed by Zachariah in Luke Chapter 1 as a redeemer of Israel. But by Matthew Chapter 12 Israel had fully rejected Jesus the Son of David and so Jesus rejects them. In 21:43 He tells them that the kingdom of Heaven is taken from them and given to another "ethnos", and in 23:38 he advised them that God had vacated their Temple.

As above, Israel did not reject their Messiah. The religious leaders did. Temporarily. God keeps His word, and He still has Promises to keep to Israel in the days ahead (post-cross) and later towards the end times. God Promised Israel a New Covenant and that day began on the Feast of Harvests with the coming of the Holy Spirit as per Joel outpouring upon the House of Israel and 3000 Jews were saved and filled with the Holy Spirit of Promise.

Jesus was speaking to the religious leaders and His words do not apply to Israel proper:

 45 And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them. Mt 21:44–45.

And He didn't say, kingdom of "heaven," He said, "kingdom of God." The kingdom of heaven will always belong to Israel. But the kingdom of God is Christ Himself. HE will be given to the "ethnos", not the kingdom of heaven. And this is happening right now as the Times of the Gentiles is towards the end of its age. And when the Times of the Gentiles is ended God turns His full attention back on Israel and as Saul said, "All Israel shall be saved." Saul doesn't say they will come to 'accept' their Messiah, but merely that "all Israel shall be saved."

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

This does not mean that God cancelled their Covenants. On the contrary, a Covenant, or CONTRACT, really comes into force when one party breaks it. All the penalties come into effect. The Covenant made with Abraham - a Gentile Syrian by the way - promised Israel a LAND. But the Covenant was EXPANDED when Abraham refused the spoils from Gentile hands. He even paid for his burial ground and did not accept the offered gift. So in Romans 4:13 we see that the LAND was EXTENDED to the "Whole Earth". And so TWO SEEDS were promised to Abraham - once as "sand of the sea shore" and another as "stars of heaven". Those of the LAND would inherit Canaan, and those of HEAVEN would rule the world. One would be born of women and one would be born of the Holy Spirit. One would be resurrected with TERRESTRIAL glory and one would be resurrected  with CELESTIAL glory (1st Cor.15).

Gentiles come from Japheth and Ham. Shem comes from Eber and Eber is the beginning of the Hebrews which went through Shem and Abraham is descendant of Shem. Thus, Abram is Hebrew:

13 And there came one that had escaped, and told Abram the Hebrew; Gen. 14:13.

In the Abrahamic Covenant faith is not a requirement in this covenant. It's not even mentioned as God made mention of obedience in the Mosaic Covenant. So, the Abrahamic Covenant is one-sided. While Abraham slept God made covenant to Himself. Abraham and his seed are the recipients of the land and the blessings. I don't know what to make of the rest of your "two-seed" comment. Maybe later.

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

Now, this other "ETHNOS", or People, or Nation is described by Jesus would be taken OUT OF Israel and OUT OF the Nations (Ephesians 2:15). And they would be a New Creature and a New Man (2nd Cor.5:17). This New Creature would have no past, for ALL THINGS are new and the old passed away. This is seen by it birth from the Holy Spirit and not the womb.

We (saved Gentiles and saved Jews) are still today two people. This "making into one" will occur at the end of human history. 

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

Now, all that remained was to make this New "ETHNOS" eligible for Abraham's INHERITANCE. That is, how was God to make the New Man HEIR to the Covenant made with Abraham. For God this was easy. God decided that the New Man would be IN Jesus, so that when Jesus died as a grain of Wheat, the New Man would come forth out of Jesus like Eve did from Adam (Jn.12:24). That is, if you are IN Christ, and/or you belong to Christ, you are "seed of Abraham" because Jesus was seed of Abraham (Gal.3:29). And Galatians 3:28, the previous verse, confirms that the New Ethnos, the New Man, did not have Jew or Gentile in it. SO, GOD HAD CREATED AN ETHNOS OF PEOPLE WHO WERE NOT ISRAELITES, AND SO NOT UNDER LAW, BUT WHO WERE THE SEED OF ABRAHAM.

Gentiles do not come from the seed or loins of Abraham. The covenant is with Abraham and his seed and there are no Gentiles that come from his seed. The New Covenant in Jeremiah 31:31-34 is between God and the House of Israel - No Gentiles. IF God wanted Gentiles as part of the New Covenant the time to say so is Jeremiah 31:31-34, but God says nothing of the sort, so Gentiles are not part of the New Covenant God made with the House of Israel no matter how much Saul discusses Messiah's effect upon their covenants and promises and prophecies. That's all it is: discussion and trying to understand Messiah's effect upon their religion. And since Saul writes to Jewish Christians that had this concern about Christ and the Abrahamic Covenant Saul eases their minds in saying if you are Christ's you also Abraham's son/children. And they needed to hear this because some after tasting the heavenly gift and experienced the powers of the world to come wanted to return to Judaism because of persecution for their faith in Messiah, but Saul addresses these things to as they all muddle through the beginnings of the New Covenant and having to search the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets to make sense of what God was doing in and to Israel.

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

Thus, if you are a Jew you are still under BOTH the Covenant of Promise made with Abraham, AND you are under the Covenant of Law made with Moses. Your inheritance will be Canaan. If you are IN Christ you are New Man and HEIR to Christ's Kingdom of Heaven.

Actually, if one is a seed of Abraham the whole covenant applies to them. Both land and blessings.

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

The New Covenant, as you correctly say, is made with Israel (Jer.31:31-33). But according to Jeremiah 31 it is NOT IN EFFECT YET. It will become effective "IN THAT DAY" when the House of Israel and the house of Judah ARE ONE NATION AGAIN. In Jeremiah 31:31 it is made with BOTH Houses, but by verse 33 it is ONE HOUSE. This has not happened yet. Israel is still divided and dispersed. What has been done is that it has been RATIFIED. This was done by the blood of Jesus on Golgotha.

The New Covenant began with the giving of the Holy Spirit in the first century on the day of the Feast of Harvest. The Church that Christ said He was going to build is a continuation of the Church in the desert at the time of the Tabernacle except they were called the "Great Congregation." The Law is type and shadow of the Holy Spirit and it is HE (that Law) which God promised to put in their inward parts, and He began to do that by giving the Promised Holy Spirit to Jews and in this began to lead and guide His people Israel from within (kingdom of God is within you) on fleshly tables of the 'heart' instead of from without and written on stone.

33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.              Acts 2:33.

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. Acts 2:38–39.

And God was effectively calling out a people to Himself. The Church that Christ was building was four decades worth before the destruction of the Temple and was populated by Jews for forty years at least until the destruction of their Temple. While the Temple stood the "ism" of Judaism remained and everything happening to Israel was seen through the lens of the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets in order to make sense of these events taking place first in Jerusalem, and then throughout the then-known world.

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

Thus, on earth there are THREE Peoples; (i) the Nations, (ii) the Nation of Israel (Paul's brethren according to the flesh - Rom.9), and the New Man (Christ's brethren according to the Spirit). All three are under the Covenant made with Noah (Gen.9:17). Israel is under BOTH the Covenant of Promise made with Abraham AND the Covenant of Law. The New Man is under the Covenant of Promise made with Abraham. Israel will inherit Canaan. The New Man will inherit the earth. David will rule Israel under Christ (Jer.30:9). The Twelve Apostles will rule the 12 Tribes. To be in the Kingdom of Heaven you need to be born again (Jn.3:3-6) so David and the 12 apostles have the New Birth. Israel do not. Israel SERVE Emmanuel (Lk.1:74-75) but forfeit the Kingdom of Heaven.

The three peoples are:

32 Give none offence, neither to the [unsaved] Jews, nor to the [unsaved] Gentiles, nor to [Jewish Christians in] the church of God:  1 Cor. 10:32.

God will keep ALL His Promises He's made to and for Israel. 

ALL of them.

[ayin jade]

17 hours ago, JohnD said:

A fight for a worthy cause should never be avoided,

how much moreso when it is the truth.

1 corinthians 13:1 If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 

[AdHoc]

10 hours ago, jeremiah1five said:

As above, Israel did not reject their Messiah. The religious leaders did. Temporarily.

Who does God hold responsible for the death of Jesus? Who rejected Jesus unto death? Why did God allow their Temple to be destroyed when it is part of the Covenant (Deut.12 & 14)? I think that you should answer Galatians 3:28-29.

 

Acts 2:22-24

22 "Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a Man attested by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs which God did through Him in your midst, as you yourselves also know —

23 Him, being delivered by the determined purpose and foreknowledge of God, you have taken* by lawless hands, have crucified, and put to death;

24 whom God raised up, having loosed the pains of death, because it was not possible that He should be held by it.

 

Acts 2:36-37

36 "Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ."

37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Men and brethren, what shall we do?"

 

Acts 3:12-15

12 So when Peter saw it, he responded to the people: "Men of Israel, why do you marvel at this? Or why look so intently at us, as though by our own power or godliness we had made this man walk?

13 The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, the God of our fathers, glorified His Servant Jesus, whom you delivered up and denied in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let Him go.

14 But you denied the Holy One and the Just, and asked for a murderer to be granted to you,

15 and killed the Prince of life, whom God raised from the dead, of which we are witnesses.

 

Acts 4:8-10

8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, "Rulers of the people and elders of Israel:

9 If we this day are judged for a good deed done to a helpless man, by what means he has been made well,

10 let it be known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, by Him this man stands here before you whole.

 

Acts 5:27-31

27 And when they had brought them, they set them before the council. And the high priest asked them,

28 saying,"Did we not strictly command you not to teach in this name? And look, you have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this Man's blood on us!"

29 But Peter and the other apostles answered and said:"We ought to obey God rather than men.

30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus whom you murdered by hanging on a tree.

31 Him God has exalted to His right hand to be Prince and Savior, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins.

Acts 10:39-40

39 And we are witnesses of all things which He did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom they* killed by hanging on a tree.

40 Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly,

 

Acts 13:27-28

27 For those who dwell in Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they did not know Him, nor even the voices of the Prophets which are read every Sabbath, have fulfilled them in condemning Him.

28 And though they found no cause for death in Him, they asked Pilate that He should be put to death.

 

1 Thess 2:14-15

14 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans,

15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men,