Why Are There So Many Denominations In The Church

[Charlie1988]

1 hour ago, Michael37 said:

By your own frame of reference you are being naughty by associating with us, @Charlie1988

I never claimed that anyone here is not a true believer or that their Church is not faithful. That's not for m to judge, God is the One who judges everyone. 

I treat everyone who professes to have faith in Jesus as genuine believer. Everyone is at a different stages of their journey and we're all works in progress, so we can't really make assumptions or draw to conclusions about these tings.    

[Michael37]

3 hours ago, Charlie1988 said:

So the truth is they can't posses anyone, unless they get a special permit to leave the prison and posses someone, that permit can only be given by the Lord Himself. 

Demonic Activity Identified: One of Satan's angels was buffeting Paul

Remedial Action Sought: Paul speaks to the Lord Jesus Christ

Divine Response Received: The Lord Jesus Christ speaks to Paul

2Co 12:7-10  And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.  (8)  For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.  (9)  And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.  (10)  Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.
 

1Co 12:1  Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
 

[Michael37]

2 minutes ago, Charlie1988 said:

I never claimed that anyone here is not a true believer or that their Church is not faithful. That's not for m to judge, God is the One who judges everyone. 

I treat everyone who professes to have faith in Jesus as genuine believer. Everyone is at a different stages of their journey and we're all works in progress, so we can't really make assumptions or draw to conclusions about these tings.    

Any group claiming to be the "true church" sets themselves up for criticism.

We have a major cult in NZ called the Gloriavale Christian Community.

According to former member Lilia Tarawa, who has written a book called "My Life In A Religious Cult", Founder Neville Cooper claimed that Gloriavale was the pure virgin bride of Jesus Christ and that other religions and churches were "false religions."

[Charlie1988]

1 hour ago, other one said:

I am not allowed to discuss specifics, but I do want to be one in the background saying this is not true.  I would doubt I could change your mind about it, but readers need to know there are people who have different experiences than what you believe.

I don't deny the fact that people have all kinds of experiences. I'm sure people have seen Demons manifest in our material/physical realm. My concern has to do with their power, I don't believe they are autonomous entities who can target people and poses them. 

The Bible makes it clear that the Devil is Gods Devil and so are Demons. Every single one of them needs to ask God for permission do anything at all. I believe God allows them to torment or poses certain individuals, for His own reasons and purpose. 

I believe those accounts in the Bible were people were possessed Demons, were all caused by God so He could show His power over the powers of darkness. I believe God preordained everything that happens, so if someone is experiencing Demonic oppression it is because God has allowed it. 

I believe God hands people over to the Devil, when they reject Him. We don't find a single case where a Christian was ever possessed by a Demon, it's simply not possible. And it's impossible to bring a person to repentance who God has handed over to the Devil. 

 

[Charlie1988]

1 hour ago, Neighbor said:

The Old Christian Hymn Book? The one Paul used?

Personally I like the older than that music book and most all of it's lyrics.

Your group allows a musical instrument, a piano?  Oh my, Church of hrist has you beat on that issue.  It was always funny to me to hear the C o C congregation singing start out with a blow on a pitch pipe.

The piano is a relatively new instrument not known until about 1690 ish. Sure it's okay?

Music is the number one cause of church splits, has been since Luther, Martin Luther. And yet  there is such joy when a local body gathered together sings praises without shame of any kind; and if someone is caught up in the joyful noise I can learn to tolerate it, as I cry in the presence of the Holy Spirit as He swirls amongst the gathered and we prepare for the reading of the word with exposition and prayer and thought while seeking application for our own lives in this world today.

Praise God it is not all can't and don't and shall not, but instead there is great opportunity to love love God and love one another. Makes me want to jump sing and shout it. Ain't no Grave going to hold my body down!

The singing Hymns is an act of worship, so all the Hymns must reflect the Gospel message. It our response of praise for what Jesus did for us. I've heard some of the modern Hymns and the gospel message is not the central theme, so my Church would never have them. 

We wouldn't have drums or guitars in our Church either, as they are used by rock bands and we don't want anything to do with worldly things.   

[Charlie1988]

40 minutes ago, Michael37 said:

Demonic Activity Identified: One of Satan's angels was buffeting Paul

Remedial Action Sought: Paul speaks to the Lord Jesus Christ

Divine Response Received: The Lord Jesus Christ speaks to Paul

2Co 12:7-10  And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.  (8)  For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.  (9)  And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.  (10)  Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.
 

1Co 12:1  Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
 

It's unclear what Paul's infirmity was, but we can conclude that it was a physical ailment of some sort. He mentions a thorn in his flesh, this could easily be an illness caused by Satan. We know that God uses Satan to bring about His will. We get to comfortable when everything is going well, and we forget about God.

What are Spiritual gifts, some believe they are given as special powers to cast out Demons or haling powers. I believe them to be those gifts which are peculiar to each individual. God has given everyone special talents, just as the members of the body have specific uses, so the Body of Christ has many different members with different talents and functions.  

[Charlie1988]

34 minutes ago, Michael37 said:

Any group claiming to be the "true church" sets themselves up for criticism.

We have a major cult in NZ called the Gloriavale Christian Community.

According to former member Lilia Tarawa, who has written a book called "My Life In A Religious Cult", Founder Neville Cooper claimed that Gloriavale was the pure virgin bride of Jesus Christ and that other religions and churches were "false religions."

A false Church is very easy to identify, all we need to do is find out who the head of the Church is and if t's anyone other than the Lord Jesus Christ, then it's false. 

I realize everyone claims Jesus as their head, but you only need to scratch the surface to expose unbiblical practices which do not bring honor and glory to Jesus. 

[other one]

2 hours ago, Charlie1988 said:

I don't deny the fact that people have all kinds of experiences. I'm sure people have seen Demons manifest in our material/physical realm. My concern has to do with their power, I don't believe they are autonomous entities who can target people and poses them. 

I would disagree.  Without the Holy Spirit, we have no authority or power in the spiritual world.   Just look at the world, and you should see who is really in control in the world today.  And it will remain that way until Jesus comes back and violently rids us of them.

People who are totally possessed today are almost always in agreement with the dark ones.

[RdJ]

12 hours ago, Charlie1988 said:

Jesus rebuked people for asking Him to perform miracles for them. He said, a wicked and perverse generations seeks after signs and wonders. But no sign will be given apart from the sign of Jonah, He was referring to Himself being dead for three days, just as Jonah spent 3 days in the belly of the fish.

Sickness and disease came into the world when Adam sinned and it has always been with us and it always will until Jesus comes back and destroys this world with fire and creates a new world and new heavens. There will be no more disease or tears, until then we have to accept that it's not always Gods will to perform a miraculous healing of our bodies. 

God is all wise, so we must trust Him in all things. If He decides to take a loved one from us, then we still have to praise Him for it. I know some people who lost their faith in God after they lost a loved one. 

The so called healing ministries and deliverance ministries, give people the impression those Ministers have something special to offer, when in reality they have nothing but false hope and false doctrine to offer. We should be concerned with the eternal things of God, but most are only concerned with the temporal things of this world.

I found the Pentecostal Denomination is preoccupied with all the temporal things of this world, such as prosperity. Jesus didn't come to shows us how to get rich quickly and how to stay younger looking for longer. He came to sav his people from hell and give them eternal life in paradise, which is much better than what the riches of this world offer for a short time.        

The pentecostal and evangelical church in Holland want no money. I went to one here. They acted and dressed like the reformed. Very calm music. It depends. T.L. Osborn came to Holland in 1958. A lot of people got saved. His translator started pentecostal churches and he went to an American Bible school, so he always asked for money. We would joke about it. He had a really good magazine for evangelization, thanks to one of his churches I got saved and they weren't insane rich and had houses for orphans in other countries, but they did want an income and they did want money to do all that and buy church buildings. He had in that magazine: if you have old jewels laying around give them to us. But nobody complains about reformed reverends who get a university income and some of these churches have so much money, they all bought church buildings. 

If it is someone's time you just have to stop praying. You can't pray against God's will. Some gypsies in our church, their grandma died, they just demanded she came back and she said: Let me go. I was just walking with Jesus. That is how much authority the believer has been given.

 

The pharisees knew He did miracles. They refused to believe and got no miracle. They were wicked.

But:

‭John 4:46-53 NKJV‬
[46] So Jesus came again to Cana of Galilee where He had made the water wine. And there was a certain nobleman whose son was sick at Capernaum. [47] When he heard that Jesus had come out of Judea into Galilee, he went to Him and implored Him to come down and heal his son, for he was at the point of death. [48] Then Jesus said to him, “Unless you people see signs and wonders, you will by no means believe.” [49] The nobleman said to Him, “Sir, come down before my child dies!” [50] Jesus said to him, “Go your way; your son lives.” So the man believed the word that Jesus spoke to him, and he went his way. [51] And as he was now going down, his servants met him and told him, saying, “Your son lives!” [52] Then he inquired of them the hour when he got better. And they said to him, “Yesterday at the seventh hour the fever left him.” [53] So the father knew that it was at the same hour in which Jesus said to him, “Your son lives.” And he himself believed, and his whole household.

https://bible.com/bible/114/jhn.4.46-53.NKJV

 

 

 

 

Edited June 25, 2024 by RdJ

[Neighbor]

5 hours ago, Charlie1988 said:

We wouldn't have drums or guitars in our Church either, as they are used by rock bands and we don't want anything to do with worldly things.   

We, eh? Got a lot of we don'ts going on there.  Question: Do you know, were drums and or guitars allowed  at "your church" prior to Rock music bands using them?  

I suppose a saxaphone would be out of the question.