Christian theology and the the modern world.

[AnOrangeCat]

13 hours ago, Cyoder said:

 Does Jesus ever say if you just believe in him that you will have eternal life?  Jesus, not Paul or Timothy or anyone else.  He expects us to pick up our cross daily and follow him.  Not just believe and do what we please.  Of course, we will fail. I know we can never earn our way to heaven, but he expects us to do the best we can and to repent when we can't, asking for his help the entire time. When I read John 3:16 I don't think it sounds like what Jesus would say. It almost seems out of context.  Yes, we must believe but it's more than that.  If not, why was Jesus so adamant about warning us about hell? 

This is an interesting post, and if people respond you're bound to get some opposing viewpoints because of the longstanding debates about whether or not we can lose our salvation. IMO? You hit on an important point. Namely that we're expected to try. I see a connection to what James said about faith without works being dead. I really get a sense of someone who walked with Jesus when I read the book of James because of his emphasis on action. Like he said, "Demons believe and tremble." Acting as God would have us act, especially when our circumstances/flesh want to go the other way, is evidence of our faith. When we avoid taking the easy way of sin and don't gratify our flesh it's a very real demonstration of our love for God (Jesus said if we love Him we'll keep His commandments). There's just little to no reason to deny the flesh without that.

[enoob57]

31 minutes ago, AnOrangeCat said:

Yes, we must believe but it's more than that.

It seems you have overlooked this statement by God
John 1:12 (KJV)

[12] But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

And we see that reality in the thief on the cross... 

[D. Adrien]

21 hours ago, enoob57 said:

It seems you have overlooked this statement by God
John 1:12 (KJV)

[12] But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

And we see that reality in the thief on the cross... 

 

Yes but, the thief on the cross wasn't going anywhere to practice Christianity. Jesus tests the heart and mind of His followers to see if they are sincere. Jer. 17:9,10. Micah 6 also illustrates what He wants to see in His people. ( My sentiments anyway).

[AnOrangeCat]

1 hour ago, D. Adrien said:

Yes but, the thief on the cross wasn't going anywhere to practice Christianity. Jesus tests the heart and mind of His followers to see if they are sincere.

Not only that but the thief in the cross still did more than only believe. It was just a little thing, but according to Luke he both rebuked his fellow thief for mocking Jesus and asked Jesus to remember him. The Bible most certainly doesn't say "The thief believed in Jesus, kept his silence, and went to Heaven."

If the thief had believed only and hadn't taken what little action he did would he have warranted mention in the Bible? It's because of the action he took, however small and limited in scope that it might seem, that this thief has served as a powerful demonstration of God's mercy for over two thousand years.

22 hours ago, enoob57 said:

It seems you have overlooked this statement by God
John 1:12 (KJV)

[12] But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

You're quoting part of a larger body of text I quoted and the forum is attributing it to me. I agree with Cyoder, but I'd still prefer it that people make it a point to quote the person who actually said it and not me. With that out of the way Cyoder also quoted scripture by way of slight paraphrase to support his position, too. Matthew 16:24 has Jesus Himself saying “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me."

My position isn't born of overlooking anything, but out of looking at multiple scriptures that have shaped my viewpoint on this topic. I suspect this is also true of Cyoder. When I look at statements like Jesus telling us to deny ourselves and take up our cross, His parable of the unprofitable servant, His telling people to go their way and sin no more, Paul's instructions to crucify the flesh, James telling us to be not only hearers of the Word but also doers, and other things found in the Bible I very much see a call to action.

By no means am I suggesting a works based salvation model, but I do believe that our actions (or inaction, as evidenced by the unfaithful servant) and the fruit we bear can effectively affirm or deny Christ. We can repent as Peter did after denying Him, which was another of Cyoder's points, but we still have to take the step of repenting.

[steve morrow]

HAS  GOD  SPOKEN  TO  US  THEOLOGY  THROUGH  THEOLOGIANS 

OR  RIGHTEOUSNESS  AND  TRUTH  THROUGH  JESUS  CHRIST

 

HEBREWS 1:1  GOD  who at sundry times and in diverse manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets 

--1:2--  hath in these last days spoken unto us by  HIS  SON  whom  HE  hath appointed heir of all things by whom also  HE  made the worlds 

 

1 CORINTHIANS 15:34  awake to righteousness and sin not for some have not the knowledge of  GOD  I speak this to your shame 

 

PROVERBS 8:7  for  MY  mouth shall speak truth and wickedness is an abomination to  MY  lips 

--8:8--  all the words of  MY  mouth are in righteousness there is nothing froward or perverse in them

 

*******    1 JOHN 5:10  he that believeth on  THE  SON  OF  GOD  hath the witness in himself he that believeth not  GOD  hath made  HIM  a liar because he believeth not the record that  GOD  gave of  HIS  SON    *******

 

REVELATION 21:22  and I saw no temple therein for  THE  LORD  GOD  ALMIGHTY  and  THE  LAMB  are the temple of it 

--21:27--  and there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth neither whatsoever worketh abomination or maketh a lie but they which are written in the lambs book of life 

PSALM 69:28  let them be blotted out of the book of the living and not be written with the righteous 

 

JAMES 1:17  every good gift and every perfect gift is from above and cometh down from  THE  FATHER  of lights with whom there is no variableness neither shadow of turning

--1:18--  of  HIS  own will begat  HE  us with the word of truth that we should be a kind of first fruits of  HIS  creatures 

 

               SO  MANY  MANY  WOLVES  WITH  LYING  TONGUES 

 

--- CORRECTIONS ---

 

JOHN 17:17  sanctify them through thy truth thy word is truth    --a work--

 

PSLAM 33:4  FOR  THE  WORD  OF  THE  LORD  IS  RIGHT  AND  ALL  HIS  WORKS  ARE  DONE  IN  TRUTH 

 

1 CORINTHIANS 4:19  but I will come to you shortly if  THE  LORD  will and will know not the speech of them which are puffed up 

 

1 JOHN 2:27  but the anointing which you have received of  HIM  abideth in you and you need not that any man teach you but as the same anointing teacheth you all things and is truth and is no lie and even as it hath taught you you shall abide in  HIM

 

PROVERBS 18:21  death and life are in the power of the tongue and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof 

 

PROVERBS 4:19  the way of the wicked is as darkness they know not at what they stumble 

 

YES  GOOD  WORKS  SAYS  THE  LORD

 

EPHESIANS 5:8  for you were sometimes darkness but now are you light in  THE  LORD  --WALK--  as children of light 

--5:9--  for the fruit of the spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth 

--5:10--  proving what is acceptable unto  THE  LORD 

--5:11--  and have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness

--5:12--  for it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret 

--5:13--  but all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light for whatsoever doth make manifest is light

 

2 TIMOTHY 2:15  --STUDY--  to show thyself approved unto  GOD  a workman that needeth not to be ashamed  --rightly dividing--  the word of truth

2 JOHN 1:4  I rejoiced greatly that I found of thy children walking in truth as we have received a commandment from  THE  FATHER

EPHESIANS 2:10  for we are  HIS  workmanship created in  CHRIST  JESUS  UNTO  GOOD  WORKS  which  GOD  hath before ordained that we should walk in them 

 

1 JOHN 2:9  he that saith he is in the light and hateth his brother is in darkness even until now 

--2:10--  he that loveth his brother abideth in the light and there is none occasion of stumbling in him

PSALM 119:130  the entrance of thy words giveth light it giveth understanding unto the simple

 

2 TIMOTHY 3:16  all scripture is given by inspiration of  GOD  and is profitable for doctrine for reproof for correction for instruction in righteousness 

--3:17--  that the man of  GOD  may be perfect thoroughly furnished unto all good works 

 

PROVERBS 6:23  FOR  THE  COMMANDMENT  IS  A  LAMP  AND  THE  LAW  IS  LIGHT  AND  REPROOFS  OF  INSTRUCTION  ARE  THE  WAY  OF  LIFE

 

ACTS 5:20  go stand and speak in the temple to the people all the words of this life 

 

MANY  MANY  MANY  MORE  WORKS  COMMANDS  THE  LORD

 

JOHN 14:15  IF  YOU  LOVE  ME  KEEP  MY  COMMANDMENTS 

 

 

LOVING  THE  LORD  JESUS  CHRIST