When do you think an individual's life begins?

[FreeGrace]

16 hours ago, Hinds Feet said:

So, this thread doesn't concern the topic of abortion.  I would say very clearly life is present by the time a woman finds out she's pregnant.  No, this thread is about what time specifically does a person's life come into existence?  Scripturally speaking, when do you speculate it might happen?

There are actually two types of "life" that need to be defined.  First, there is physiologic life, and that is represented in Gen 2:7 - Then the LORD God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.

Red words refer to physiologic life, or what is studied as biology.  I believe it is well known that a person's soul/spirit can leave the body, but science is able to keep the body alive (biologically functioning for donor use).  But is that what we know as "human life"?  No, it isn't.  The blue words refer to the immaterial (soul/spirit).  So there is biologic life and soul/spirit life.  It is when the two are joined that the combination is called "a living being", the green words.  

So a "human being" included body and soul/spirit.  Material and immaterial.  One without the other isn't a human being.

16 hours ago, Hinds Feet said:

 At conception, the beginnings of a body take place, but there is no spirit/soul attached to it.  Then sometime after two weeks of development, God places an individual's spirit into the newly forming body.  This is when life begins.

Does the Bible identify when God places the soul/spirit into the biological life?  If there is evidence, ok, but without clear biblical evidence, it is just an opinion.  And one must be able to explain why God would place the soul/spirit into non functioning biological life?  What point would there be?

There is a point before which a biological life-form cannot survive outside the uterus.  That would indicate that the the soul/spirit hasn't been placed yet.  

And, the Bible deals with "man" as being "out from the womb".  So, if a preemie is born and survives, obviously there is a person.  

It seems more logical to me that God places the soul/spirit when the fetus is being born, or just before.  Any time before that seems illogical.

Unfortunately, the question cannot be accurately answered at this time.  I am sure in eternity these kind of questions will be answered.

[Dennis1209]

8 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Hi, to "amplify" on that question I have to answer with a question; When did God first know me?

Jeremiah 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

Question: Does this apply only to the prophet Jeremiah? 

[Dennis1209]

5 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

Does the Bible identify when God places the soul/spirit into the biological life?  If there is evidence, ok, but without clear biblical evidence, it is just an opinion.  And one must be able to explain why God would place the soul/spirit into non functioning biological life?  What point would there be?

I agree; we do not know these complex questions and are open to our worldview and theology.

I want to insert another word for consideration:

animāˈtion noun:

1.        The act of animating. “While there’s animation, there’s hope.”

2.      The state of being alive.

3.      Liveliness. (Jacob & Esau in the womb).

4.     Vigour.

Genesis 38:9 And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest that he should give seed to his brother.

Is a man’s seed an inanimate object, or does it fit the criteria of animation and alive? Is seed (sperm) nonfunctioning biological life?

 

[The_Patriot21]

Life begins at conception. Including twins. 

It's not the cells that define our life. It's our souls. Our souls are not made up of DNA. They're spirits. Our souls are basically implanted into our bodies by God. 

And only identical twins split, in which case our souls are implanted in each egg.

Non identical twins are two eggs released at once, so at that point the souls are impressed then.

You can't split a soul, but that doesn't mean our life doesn't start at conception 

[kwikphilly]

Interesting Topic for sure but one we can only speculate.....according to Gods Word we Understand that no one ever WAS before they were born only Jesus Was not Created He IS just as the Great I AM IS and yet His Physical Being was born just as ours is but the Word of God also Tells us that Adam was not Adam until He Was Given the Breath of Life.....So would we say that until breath enters our physical bodies we have no consciousness or "soul"....Physics does not consider a "soul" therefore science cannot answer this question  ... God Can ....so looking to the Scriptures that is what we find

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis 1%3A1%2CJohn 8%3A58%2CJohn 17%3A5%2CJohn 17%3A24%2C1 John 1%3A1%2CRevelation 1%3A8&version=NIV

 

Genesis 2:7

"The Lord God formed a man from the dust of the earth and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being".

 

According to "science" the earliest brain activity recorded was around a 45 day old fetus in the womb......But we Know we are more than a body and a soul,we have a spirit our spirit is Made Alive in Christ Jesus     Very hard to wrap a CHRISTIAN head around the Mysteries of God     Is Gods Breath of Life our spirit after all and not much to do with consciousness at all,the carnal mind in which we "think" with ?

 Yes ,Adam and Eve surely died Just as God Said they would if they ate of the forbidden fruit.....

 

[FreeGrace]

12 hours ago, Dennis1209 said:

Is a man’s seed an inanimate object, or does it fit the criteria of animation and alive? Is seed (sperm) nonfunctioning biological life?

Yes, man's seed is alive.  It is very much functioning, or it would never reach the egg for fertilization to occur.  If the seed was nonfunctioning, the human race would never have begun.  :(

[FreeGrace]

10 hours ago, The_Patriot21 said:

Life begins at conception. Including twins. 

Physiological life begins at conception.  But the Bible doesn't tell us when He places the soul/spirit in the body.

If Gen 2:7 is God's plan for humanity, it is clear that He didn't place the soul/spirit in the "dust of the groun" until AFTER it was complete and ready for the soul/spirit.

That would indicate that God places the soul/spirit in the fetus before birth.  But the fetus would be complete and ready for birth.

[The_Patriot21]

45 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Physiological life begins at conception.  But the Bible doesn't tell us when He places the soul/spirit in the body.

If Gen 2:7 is God's plan for humanity, it is clear that He didn't place the soul/spirit in the "dust of the groun" until AFTER it was complete and ready for the soul/spirit.

That would indicate that God places the soul/spirit in the fetus before birth.  But the fetus would be complete and ready for birth.

Psalms 139 indicates otherwise. Conception isnt the dust of the ground. In the case of Adam and Eve, God imprinted the souls as soon as the body was "alive"

A fertilized egg is "life" not dust. And Psalm 139 and Jeremiah 1:5 both support this. Life, begins at conception.

[FreeGrace]

25 minutes ago, The_Patriot21 said:

Psalms 139 indicates otherwise.

THe Psalm is about God's omniscience.

v.13 - For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb.

This oft quoted verse speaks to God's omniscience, but not WHEN the soul/spirit is placed in the fetus.

As I pointed out, Gen 2:7 suggests the order of how human beings come about.  God began with the physiologial body (dust of the ground refers to the various chemicals found in the ground) and after that was complete, He breathed into that physiological body the "breath of life" and THEN "man became a living being".

It seems clear enough for me.  When the soul (immaterial) is placed in the body (material) then there is a human being.  

So, there are 2 kinds of life:  physical and spiritual.  Need both to have a human being.

25 minutes ago, The_Patriot21 said:

Conception isnt the dust of the ground.

Agreed.  I never said that either.  Conception is when physiology meets (male + female), and the body begins to develop.  But that is not yet a human being.

25 minutes ago, The_Patriot21 said:

In the case of Adam and Eve, God imprinted the souls as soon as the body was "alive"

Because the body was compete, of course.  That is obvious.  

25 minutes ago, The_Patriot21 said:

A fertilized egg is "life" not dust.

Are you not aware that the physical body is composed of many chemicals?  All of which can be found in the ground.

25 minutes ago, The_Patriot21 said:

And Psalm 139 and Jeremiah 1:5 both support this. Life, begins at conception.

Only physiological life.  Again, there are 2 kind of life; physical and spiritual (or whatever you call the immaterial).

Many people have died (their soul leaves the body) yet machines have kept their physical bodies alive.  Is that human life?  No, of course not.

[The_Patriot21]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

THe Psalm is about God's omniscience.

v.13 - For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb.

This oft quoted verse speaks to God's omniscience, but not WHEN the soul/spirit is placed in the fetus.

As I pointed out, Gen 2:7 suggests the order of how human beings come about.  God began with the physiologial body (dust of the ground refers to the various chemicals found in the ground) and after that was complete, He breathed into that physiological body the "breath of life" and THEN "man became a living being".

It seems clear enough for me.  When the soul (immaterial) is placed in the body (material) then there is a human being.  

So, there are 2 kinds of life:  physical and spiritual.  Need both to have a human being.

Agreed.  I never said that either.  Conception is when physiology meets (male + female), and the body begins to develop.  But that is not yet a human being.

Because the body was compete, of course.  That is obvious.  

Are you not aware that the physical body is composed of many chemicals?  All of which can be found in the ground.

Only physiological life.  Again, there are 2 kind of life; physical and spiritual (or whatever you call the immaterial).

Many people have died (their soul leaves the body) yet machines have kept their physical bodies alive.  Is that human life?  No, of course not.

Well, you seem to be inferring a lot of your own beliefs into this, but I'm going to point out one thing. In the case of the machines "keeping people alive" argument, there have been documented cases of people being on those machines for years, with no brain activity, and then them regaining consciousness. It's not up to us to decide when our soul leaves the body or not, that's God's, and it's nothing more then human arrogance to assume otherwise.

You can of course believe what you want, I'm not going to try and talk you out of it, I've learned a long time ago not to waste my time arguing something I know to be true with those who refuse to see it. But neither am I going to change my stance on the matter. Life, both Spiritual and physical, begins at conception, and continues until such time as God decides it's time.

Have a good day.