Sheep/Goats Judgement not same as Great White Throne?

[Vine Abider]

1 hour ago, missmuffet said:

You think that the Judgment is not in heaven?

I don't know - I was just asking for a reference that states the judgement seat of Christ (Bema) takes place in heaven.  If there's not a specific reference to it happening there, it may be in the "Saul being knocked off his horse on the way to Damascus" traditional thought category. (i.e., no mention of a horse in that passage in Acts)

[Jedi4Yahweh]

Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. - Jhn 5:28-29 

Which Judgment-seat do think this fall into (sheep and goats or white throne)?

[missmuffet]

2 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

I don't know - I was just asking for a reference that states the judgement seat of Christ (Bema) takes place in heaven.  If there's not a specific reference to it happening there, it may be in the "Saul being knocked off his horse on the way to Damascus" traditional thought category. (i.e., no mention of a horse in that passage in Acts)

A couple of the Bible scholars I like tells me that it will be in heaven. Perhaps it

is a wait and see.

[Neighbor]

4 hours ago, missmuffet said:

"will timing affect judgement(s) rendered?"

Please explain.

Any interpretation works for me. 

[Dennis1209]

I pretty much understand it the way you do. There will still be nations entering the millennium. When the Lord divides the sheep from the goats, the goats will be instantly killed off physically, then await the Great White Throne's judgment in Hades until the conclusion of the millennium. Or, more likely, having the M.O.B., they were instantly condemned and cast into the Lake of Fire, joining the Antichrist and False Prophet already there.

Those individuals of that nation who survived the Tribulation (sheep) will be physically allowed to enter the Kingdom of God based on how they treated the Lord's chosen people, the Jews.

However, Matthew 25:31-46 implies that only the redeemed that remain alive will enter the Kingdom, the Jew and Gentile alike that came to saving faith during the Tribulation.

[tatwo]

On 12/2/2024 at 7:16 PM, Vine Abider said:

I'm seeing that the ones who showed compassion to the Lord's brethren are then constituted righteous by just this act.

“Constituted righteous by just this act” really? Saved and completely formed in Christ likeness…is that what you mean by “constituted righteous”…by one act…on their own? That does not seem right Mr. Vine.

No…they are His sheep…His Body…the sons of God…clearly described as…“you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world”

The ones who showed compassion to the Lord’s "brethren…are” the “Lord’s brethren”…as identified by the words…“sheep on His right”…“blessed of My Father”…“inherit the kingdom”…spoken by the “King of kings” Himself. This is the living temple of God we are looking at here Vine Abider…

On 12/2/2024 at 7:16 PM, Vine Abider said:

As I read it, the focus of the passage is how people during the tribulation period, behaved toward believers (and maybe Jews?).

That is not there…the first thing He does to “all the nations” is “separate them”…into “two” groups...that is all that is mentioned there. You seem to be seeing a third group in there somewhere…

I can agree that He is speaking about a time of “tribulation” via His description of the circumstances at the end of the age from chapter 24 culminating with His return in chapter 25. I can see that He references “all the nations”…meaning “all the nations.” I can see that “all nations” are then “separated” via the references “sheep - right” and “goats – left.”

There are only “2 groups” of people in this picture Vine…the “sons of God” and the “sons of Satan.” It would seem that you are reading something into this that is not there…do you know what I mean?

On 12/2/2024 at 7:16 PM, Vine Abider said:

I know Jesus calls believers "sheep," but doesn't He say He has other flocks too?

Well…in John 10:16 that to which I believe you are referring…we can read this…“I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will hear My voice; and they will become one flock with one shepherd.”

There Yahshua was talking to the Jews…likely in or near Jerusalem…so there is a high probability that He is prophesying of the “gentiles” that He will be calling into the “one flock with one shepherd”…which…are not in the picture physically at that time.

On 12/2/2024 at 7:16 PM, Vine Abider said:

So it would seem that the ones that righteously showed compassion are the sheep from the nations that will populate the nations of the kingdom age, with the rewarded saints ruling over them.

 

Sorry Vine Abider…I just do not understand how you come to that using the passages we are working with. We disagree…

However the subject of who it is that is on the earth during the millennial age is very interesting in and of itself.

Tatwo...:)

[missmuffet]

20 hours ago, Dennis1209 said:

I pretty much understand it the way you do. There will still be nations entering the millennium. When the Lord divides the sheep from the goats, the goats will be instantly killed off physically, then await the Great White Throne's judgment in Hades until the conclusion of the millennium. Or, more likely, having the M.O.B., they were instantly condemned and cast into the Lake of Fire, joining the Antichrist and False Prophet already there.

Those individuals of that nation who survived the Tribulation (sheep) will be physically allowed to enter the Kingdom of God based on how they treated the Lord's chosen people, the Jews.

However, Matthew 25:31-46 implies that only the redeemed that remain alive will enter the Kingdom, the Jew and Gentile alike that came to saving faith during the Tribulation.

The sheep will be able to go into the 1000 year millennium because of their

faithfulness to Jesus Christ.

[Vine Abider]

3 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

The sheep will be able to go into the 1000 year millennium because of their

faithfulness to Jesus Christ.

That's not really what the passage says - it says they will enter in because of what they did to "one of these, the least of my brothers." It appears they are being rewarded simply for showing a minimal amount of compassion to God's people.

[Vine Abider]

10 minutes ago, tatwo said:

“Constituted righteous by just this act” really? Saved and completely formed in Christ likeness…is that what you mean by “constituted righteous”…by one act…on their own? That does not seem right Mr. Vine.

No…they are His sheep…His Body…the sons of God…clearly described as…“you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world”

Yes, there is what you quoted in red, and that does sound like believers. But He also says sheep are entering simply because they showed compassion on just one of the least of His brothers, right?

[missmuffet]

13 minutes ago, Vine Abider said:

That's not really what the passage says - it says they will enter in because of what they did to "one of these, the least of my brothers." It appears they are being rewarded simply for showing a minimal amount of compassion to God's people.

Yes, because they assisted persecuted/needy believers during the

tribulation but also because of their saving faith. The sheep are

believers where the goats are not believers.

Edited December 4, 2024 by missmuffet