Some Who Call Themselves 'Christian' Will Not Inherit the Kingdom of God?

[Marathoner]

I caution against judgment that uses "true" or "genuine" as a means of separating one from the other. This invariably involves one's concept of true or genuine and is best described as a lens of belief. If something runs afoul of someone's lens of belief, then this dictates the judgment that follows.

The example of wheat and tares is an important lesson for us. The species called "tares" is indistinguishable from wheat until the mature stage arrives; that time is the harvest. I have witnessed unrighteousness judgment where some were denounced as false when in truth, time proved that was error. 

It underscores the teaching of the Lord to examine our own selves. 

[BornAgain490]

22 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

I caution against judgment that uses "true" or "genuine" as a means of separating one from the other. This invariably involves one's concept of true or genuine and is best described as a lens of belief. If something runs afoul of someone's lens of belief, then this dictates the judgment that follows.

The example of wheat and tares is an important lesson for us. The species called "tares" is indistinguishable from wheat until the mature stage arrives; that time is the harvest. I have witnessed unrighteousness judgment where some were denounced as false when in truth, time proved that was error. 

It underscores the teaching of the Lord to examine our own selves. 

Can we not discern by their fruit those that are in Christ from those who simply profess to be so, but aren't? 

You can easily mistake a tare for wheat in its early stages, but eventually you'll know by its fruit that it is a tare.  And the difference is noticeable long before the wheat is fully matured and ready for harvest. 

[Vine Abider]

54 minutes ago, BornAgain490 said:

Can we not discern by their fruit those that are in Christ from those who simply profess to be so, but aren't? 

You can easily mistake a tare for wheat in its early stages, but eventually you'll know by its fruit that it is a tare.  And the difference is noticeable long before the wheat is fully matured and ready for harvest. 

I don't think so. I was reborn as a youngster, regenerated with His life in me, making me a child of God.  But I went in a totally different direction for years.  If you had looked at me and my life at that time, you wouldn't have noticed much about me that IDed me as a child of God.  Yet, I was His child, since His life was in me - that life was just not growing much.

Eventually His life in me broke through all the trappings - hallelujah! 

[Marathoner]

5 minutes ago, Vine Abider said:

I don't think so. I was reborn as a youngster, regenerated with His life in me, making me a child of God.  But I went in a totally different direction for years.  If you had looked at me and my life at that time, you wouldn't have noticed much about me that IDed me as a child of God.  Yet, I was His child, since His life was in me - that life was just not growing much.

Eventually His life in me broke through all the trappings - hallelujah! 

I was the same, brother. Until the harvest comes, only the Lord knows the difference between tares and wheat. It's impossible for us to distinguish the difference until both reach maturity. 

[Vine Abider]

16 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

I was the same, brother. Until the harvest comes, only the Lord knows the difference between tares and wheat. It's impossible for us to distinguish the difference until both reach maturity. 

To me the tares are not Christians, as defined by having Christ's life in them.  Christ was the one grain of wheat, so what is produced from Him is wheat.  The tares have a different life from wheat.  Therefore I see the tares as unsaved ones who may act like Christians. 

His children, who were produced by His life, may misbehave badly and it's then hard to see Christ in them.

So to me:

Wheat = saved with His life & are children of God

Tares = unsaved who do not share God's life, but look similar

Misbehaving Christians = saved with His life in them and therefore children of God, but they are not profitable for the kingdom

[AdHoc]

2 hours ago, Marathoner said:

I caution against judgment that uses "true" or "genuine" as a means of separating one from the other. This invariably involves one's concept of true or genuine and is best described as a lens of belief. If something runs afoul of someone's lens of belief, then this dictates the judgment that follows.

The example of wheat and tares is an important lesson for us. The species called "tares" is indistinguishable from wheat until the mature stage arrives; that time is the harvest. I have witnessed unrighteousness judgment where some were denounced as false when in truth, time proved that was error. 

It underscores the teaching of the Lord to examine our own selves. 

Yes. Even the Master forbade His servants from making a distinction. It was too close to call. We must expound the Parable but not judge the man or woman next to us in the Assembly.

[BornAgain490]

2 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

Yet, I was His child, since His life was in me - that life was just not growing much.

Eventually His life in me broke through all the trappings - hallelujah!

Precisely my point: you were not growing much, yet still growing in Christ. 

My thought was aimed at those whose testimony  is more like this: "I was born again as a youngster, and because I'm made free in Christ, there's no need for me to turn from the sin that gives me so much pleasure, because in the end: Jesus paid it all.  Yahoooo!"  

When we receive the gift of God's grace, while we are made free indeed from the power of sin and death, it is not a freedom to continuing to live as we please, but to live as we ought: as children of the Most High God. 

[Neighbor]

Why mess around with so serious a topic, why not go to the exposition warning and awakening guidance by the prince of pastors Charles Hadden Spurgeon whose talk on this subject builds, much as his sermons do in a familiar pattern, to a conclusion from which comes this little excerpt: 

..."You remember those verses by John Newton, —

"Dost thou ask me who I am?
Ah, my Lord, thou know’st my name!
Yet the question gives a plea
To support my suit with thee.

Once a sinner near despair
Sought thy mercy-seat by prayer;
 Mercy heard and set him free;
 Lord, that mercy came to me."

     If that is true of any one of you, you can say to the Lord, "Thou knowest me, Lord, for I came to thee, and said, "God be merciful to me a sinner." But, "in that day," these pretenders will have to recollect that they never did that. David said to the Lord, “Thou hast known my soul in adversities.” Beloved, some of you know what it is to go to God with every trouble that ever comes upon you, but these pretenders did not; and they had to remember, “in that day,” that they had never resorted to God, — never had fellowship with Christ, — never, indeed, became acquainted with him. “No,” says Christ, “I never saw you come as a beggar to my door. I never saw you sit as a disciple at my feet. I never saw you as a humble follower treading in my footsteps. I never saw you as a sheep that knew my voice, and followed me. ‘I never knew you.’  "

The sermon is well worth a slow careful read along with  a serious pondering upon  the value of it.  Please, allow time to careful read think upon and pray about  this message. https://www.spurgeon.org/resource-library/sermons/the-disowned/#flipbook/

[FreeGrace]

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

First and foremost, only the born again in Christ will inherit the kingdom of God. 

I defer to what the Bible says about who will inherit the kingdom of God.  There are 3 parallel passages about inheriting the kingdom.

1 Cor 6:9 - Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men 10 - nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Gal 5:19 - The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 - idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 - and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Eph 5:5 - For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person—such a person is an idolater —has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

The first thing to notice is the list of things that result in NOT "inheriting the kingdom".  All 3 are lists of various sins.  Does this suggest that Jesus didn't die for these sins?  Of course not!  Does this suggest that even though Jesus forgives ALL sins for those who BELIEVE in Him for salvation, some sins revoke His forgiveness?  Of course not!  

In the first 2 passages, the same phrase is found;  "not inherit the kingdom", but in the 3rd passage, we find "have no inheritance IN IN IN the kingdom".  No, I was not stuttering when I typed out that phrase.  Rather, I was emphasizing the point that the issue is not about whether one will ENTER the kingdom, but about whether one will have an inheritance IN IN IN the kingdom.  

All three passages were written to believers.  Why would Paul warn believers about what unbelievers won't have?  That is irrelevant.  Warnings are meant to alter behavior, so warning believers what's coming to unbelievers isn't really a warning.

But these 3 passages ARE warnings;  to believers.  To change their behavior.  But these are not warnings about not entering the kingdom but having an inheritance IN the kingdom.

Eph 5:5 shows the clearest that the warning is to believers.  Here is the full context:

1 - Follow God’s example, therefore, as dearly loved children 2 - and walk in the way of love, just as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us as a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God.
3 - But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people. 4 - Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk or coarse joking, which are out of place, but rather thanksgiving.

Paul begins the chapter with an encouragement for how to live the Christian life (v.1,2).  Then, in v.3 he explains what Christians SHOULD NOT BE DOING (there must not be even a hint of . . .)  He didn't say that Christians CAN'T do these things, but rather, MUST NOT do them.  iow, Christians OUGHT NOT to do them.

Notice the words in v.3:  immorality, impurity, greed.  The same words in v.5:  For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person—such a person is an idolater —has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

So, Eph 5:5 clearly warns believers about what will happen if they live immoral, impure or greedy lives.  They will have no inheritance IN IN IN the kingdom.

After telling Christians the things they should not be doing, he then warns them of the consequences of doing them.  All 3 passages are parallel and have the same message.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

You either are, or you are not born again. There is no 'half-way there', no 'on the fence', no 'I think I am'.  If you are born again, you know you are born again.

This is true, but not the subject of any of the 3 passages.  It is about lifestyle and the consequences of living that way.  It is not about who is or who isn't saved, or worse, loss of salvation.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

Jesus answered and said unto Nicodemus:  "Amen, amen, I say unto you, except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."  (John 3:3).

And 2 verses later, Jesus says the same thing but uses "ENTER" to show that "seeing" is "entering".

v.5 - Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

We are born again when God the Holy Spirit moves in our spirit and brings our spirit into a right relationship with God, which is when we begin to be led by the Spirit and become children of God. (Romans 8:14).

We are born again (regenerated) at the MOMENT of faith in Christ (John 5:24) when the Holy Spirit seals the believer "in Christ" (Eph 1:13, Gal 3:2,5).

We become the children of God WHEN we believe in Christ.  John 1:12 and Gal 3:26

We are "led by the Spirit" only when we are in fellowship with the Lord (1 John 1) and are filled with the Spirit (Eph 5:18).

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

As soon as we are born again we are in Christ, and Christ is in us, which means we are no longer carnally minded and walk after the flesh or mind the things of the flesh, but we walk after the Spirit and mind the things of the Spirit. (Romans 8:1).

Rather, Paul makes clear that Christians SHOULD "set our hearts on things above" and "set our minds on things above", per Col 3:1,2, and Phil 3:19,20.  These are not automatic nor guaranteed.

In Romans 7 Paul made the point that he continued to struggle with his sinful human nature.  Also Gal 5:17 is clearly about the struggle.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

Those that call themselves "Christians", yet continue to walk after the flesh and mind the things of the flesh, are still spiritually dead. (Romans 8:6).

Even Christians are able to and do 'continue to walk after the flesh and mind things of the flesh", yet will be IN IN IN the kingdom, but have NO NO NO inheritance IN IN IN the kingdom.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

So-called "Christians" who walk after the flesh and mind the things of the flesh have a carnal mind, which is enmity against God. (Romans 8:7).

Paul warned Christians about grieving (Eph 4:30) and quenching (1 Thess 5:19) the Holy Spirit.  These are carnally minded Christians.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

  Those that are carnally minded are not regenerated by the Holy Spirit and don't have the indwelling Christ, and therefore cannot please God. (Romans 8:8).

Not true.  Paul called some of the Corinthian congregation CARNAL in 1 Cor 3:1-4

1 - And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ.

2 - I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able;

3 - for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men?

4 - For when one says, “I am of Paul,” and another, “I am of Apollos,” are you not carnal?

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

"Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these ... and they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God":

Adultery 

Fornication 

Morally corrupt

Lasciviousness

Idolatry 

Witchcraft 

Hatred 

Variance

Emulations

Wrath

Strife

Seditious 

Heresies

Envyings

Murders 

Drunkenness 

Revealing (Galatians 5:19-21).

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither

Fornicatiors

Idolaters 

Adulterers

Effeminate

Abusers of themselves with mankind

Thieves 

Covetous 

Drunkards

Revilers 

Nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God."  (1 Corinthians 6:9-10).

As shown above, the warning is to believers about the consequences of sinful lifestyles.  The warnings cannot be about loss of salvation, or not entering the kingdom, per the verses above.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

If you are born again, then the next verse is a big relief:  "And such were some of you: but you are washed, but you are sanctified, but you are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God." (1 Corinthians 6:11).

Paul's point here is that BECAUSE "you are sanctified", which means positionally holy as a believer IN Christ, ACT like it.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

If you say you are, or think you are, born again and saved, yet you are carnally minded, walking after and minding the things of the flesh as opposed to the Spirit, you need to cry out to God to save you and regenerate your spirit.

Rather, the course of action should be to confess all your sins (1 John 1:9) and repent (change your mind and direction) of your sinful lifestyle and obey the Word.

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

  Time is running out.  I pray you are saved. In Jesus's mighty holy holy holy and precious name. Amen amen. 🙏 

There is time as long as the believer is alive on this earth.  

[BornAgain490]

2 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

I defer to what the Bible says about who will inherit the kingdom of God

Which I provided. 

2 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

In the first 2 passages, the same phrase is found;  "not inherit the kingdom", but in the 3rd passage, we find "have no inheritance IN IN IN the kingdom".  No, I was not stuttering when I typed out that phrase.  Rather, I was emphasizing the point that the issue is not about whether one will ENTER the kingdom, but about whether one will have an inheritance IN IN IN the kingdom

The kingdom is the thing inherited.  For ex: if the decedent wills his estate to Heir A, but not Heir B, Heir B doesn't inherit the estate or any of the rewards that are attached to the estate, and heir B dosn't get the privilege to enter or enjoy the estate. Therefore, both statements, "will not inherit" and , refer to the unsaved who rejected the call to repent and believe, and they will not be allowed to enter into or enjoy the kingdom of God.

2 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

All three passages were written to believers

Actually, the letters are written to congregations which may or may not include unbelievers in their midst, much like today's congregations.  

Paul is exhorting those that are in Christ to live not like those that are not in Christ, with the admonishment that those that are not in Christ will not receive the inheritance of the kingdom

3 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

Not true.  Paul called some of the Corinthian congregation CARNAL in 1 Cor 3:1-4

1 - And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ.

As Paul says: they are carnal, therefore unable to hear the spiritual. If unable to hear the spiritual, they have not the indwelling spirit, therefore they're unsaved.

Every congregation has within its ranks unsaved, carnal people that are not in Christ. 

Though Paul refers to them as "babes in Christ", he is not telling that they are indeed born again in Christ, which is evident by their inability to hear spiritually. 

3 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

On 12/13/2024 at 6:22 PM, BornAgain490 said:

"And such were some of you: but you are washed, but you are sanctified, but you are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God." (1 Corinthians 6:11).

Paul's point here is that BECAUSE "you are sanctified", which means positionally holy as a believer IN Christ, ACT like it

"And such were some of you" refers to the lost condition of the saved before they were in Christ.  And by this, Paul is pointing to the lost nature of those whom Paul is referring, who won't inherit the kingdom because they are not washed, sanctified, and justified by Jesus Christ.  Clearly, they that are not referred to in the phrase "such were some of you" are they that are unsaved and will not inherit the kingdom, because they continue to live by and mind the things of the flesh. 

3 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

There is time as long as the believer is alive on this earth.  

Unless God has given them over time a reprobate mind, which means God's already rejected them.