RFID.

[Knight of Christ]

lol noooo i have both hands i am just left handed lol

and even if i where going to be on the earth during that time i would die first anyway

[Qun Mang]

Okay, maybe it's because I'm not completely right with Christ right now, but I'm not seeing the concern here. The Bible tells us that this mark will happen and there is nothing we can do about it. Furthermore, this will only happen after several other things come to pass. So in short, the mark is not happening now, and when it does happen there is nothing we can do about it anyway since it is part of prophecy. So again, why get all bothered about what the mark might be? The only thing that this whole discussion should push us to do is get out and bring people to Christ while we still can. We do not know the hour, day, or year of Christ's return after all (though a friend of mine believes it to be 2011 ).

[Fiosh]

Quote from QM:

"The only thing that this whole discussion should push us to do is get out and bring people to Christ while we still can. "

Amen!

[SpiritLedEd]

I study business and economics in college and the other day we had a guest lecturer in to give us a talk on this.

The week beofre, during one of my many question and answer sessions from my non-Christian friends about various aspects of Christianity, Revelation came up. I began to tell them about the mark and how in the final days, we'll be forced to make a choice about accepting it or not. I told them it will more than likely be a microchip inserted under the skin of your hand, and if you accpet it you are turning your back on God.

The usual scepticism and scoffs of disbelief came, and I said that I can guarantee that in the next few years they will begin introducing technolody which will bear the hallmarks of this, explaining how it eliminates human error and has all these benefits.

Then to yesterday, were sitting down, and the guest lecturer starts talking about RFID. I started to feel nauseous at the way he was explaining this and how utterly spellbound everyone in the class was during it. He was saying how every good in a shop would be implanted with a chip, and patients in a hospital would have one "on their person" to save doctors from having to write their prescriptions and what not, and then he said "and maybe in the future it could be used day to day to eliminate cash and produce cashless transactions".

I was feeling very uneasy and my concience was telling me to get out of there, so I texted one of the people I had told about this the other week saying "remember what I told you about last week about microchips in the future, this is the beginning of it", to which she replied sarchastically and about the world ending and what not.

I obviously sound like a nutcase telling my firneds about this, and I have no doubts that behind my back Im being called a lunatic, but when this stuff is put in front of their eyes exactly as I had said it a week before, I cant believe people still refuse to take it seriously!!

Anyone have similar experience??

I personally find the chips "creepy" even without the prophetic element. It's way too much of an invasion of privacy for me.

Even those GPS "locators" available in cars are not something I would have in mine.

As for the "mark", I'm not sure how this fits together with the chip. If, for example (as one poster mentioned), your bank asks you to accept some sort of "scan-able" chip, how is that a cooperation with the beast? Not saying I like the chip idea....it creeps me out. But, for the sake of argument, shouldn't there be a clear choice being made by the individual against God?

Can anyone give their thoughts on what ties it together?

Thanks,

Fiosh

I don't think the business of the hand scan had anything to do with microchips being implanted on our bodies. Handprints are like fingerprints; each of us has a unique handprint. No human that has ever lived, lives now, or will live in the future can have a handprint that is exactly like ours.

Therefore, hand scanning is a very effective tool to protect us against forgery and identity theft. I recommend taking advantage of it.

[SpiritLedEd]

Actuly in a way yes.

You see i have a friend who clames to be anostic he dosent deny God's excestence but dosent see why he should belive in Him or become saved for that matter.

I have told him time and time again about the mark and the if he is left behind that it will be do or die that he will eather have to deny God completely and take the mark or go homless and hunted for not dooing so.

Well one day he was telling everybody of this thing he read online about mircochips that credit compinies want to use to implant them inthere comusters illmateing the need for the cards.

I tell him. "well there goes our right to privicey not to mention the fact that with these chips a person can be tracked by satelite annywhere they go." "so you can't even go camping by youreselfd any more."

More that one of us in fact every beliver that i hang with has tried to tell him time and again on how closely this stuff comes to prophcey, but he refuses to listen sasying "I don't care i am still going to be one of the first ppl to get one"

We have all tried what seems like hundreds of times about the Lord and the scripture and he dose listen to a point but only with the view that it is nothing more that mytholigy or theryitcal at best.

Most of us have all but given up on trying to convince him. There no use in trying to convince a brick wall to move if you know what i mean.

Funny thing is even he refuses to take it completely seroisely he still refuses to watch The Passion, all but admiting that he is afraid that it all might be true lol

Knight of Christ: I would advise you to stop badgering this fellow. He's just not ready to hear the Gospel and he's probably mocking you and your well-meaning friends behind your backs.

Remember the words of Jesus: "Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet and then turn and tear you to pieces." (Mt 7:6)

SLE

[Knight of Christ]

Spirt

I more or less have stoped saying anything unless he or someonels brings it up frist.

As for talking behind my back well, ppl have been doing that to me ever sence i can rember so i am not excalty worried about that.

But I do get youre point

[Knight of Christ]

Sorry but i fopr got to mention one thing.

that the bible mentions that the mark what ever it my end up being will be visable for all to see.

[Avidan]

United States to Require RFID Chips in Passports

State Department says controversial chips enhance security.

Grant Gross, IDG News Service

Wednesday, October 26, 2005

source http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,123246,00.asp

WASHINGTON -- By October 2006, the U.S. government will require nearly all of the passports it issues to include a computer chip containing the passport holder's personal information, according to regulations published this week.

Starting in early 2006, the U.S. Department of State will begin issuing passports with 64-kilobyte RFID (radio frequency identification) chips that will contain the name, nationality, gender, date of birth, and place of birth of the passport holder, as well as a digitized photograph of that person.

The chip's contents will match the data on the paper portion of the passport, improving passport security by making it more difficult for criminals to tamper with passports, backers say. U.S. government efforts to make passports harder to forge began in response to the terrorist attacks on the United States on September 11, 2001.

Opposition

After the State Department proposed last February to include RFID chips in passports, privacy groups such as the American Civil Liberties Union and the Electronic Frontier Foundation expressed concern. Because some RFID chips can be scanned remotely, criminals may be able to covertly scan groups of passport holders at airports, the EFF said in April. RFID passports could thus act as "terrorist beacons," as well as indiscriminately exposing U.S. residents' personal information to strangers.

In a letter commenting on the State Department proposal, the EFF argued that the agency lacked congressional authority to require RFID chips in passports.

"RFID in passports is a terrible idea, period," said EFF senior attorney Lee Tien, in a posting to the EFF's Web site. "But on top of that, the State Department is acting without the appropriate authority and without conducting any form of credible cost-benefit analysis. It's asking Americans to sacrifice their safety and privacy 'up front' for a dangerous experiment that it hasn't even bothered to justify."

The State Department received 2335 public comments on its February proposal to introduce electronic passports. More than 98 percent of the comments were negative, the State Department said, and most of them raised issues about security and privacy.

Security Precautions

In the passport rules it released Tuesday, the State Department said that it was taking several security precautions. The RFID chips will use encrypted digital signatures to prevent tampering; and they will be so-called passive RFID chips, which do not broadcast personal information unless within inches of an RFID reader machine. To protect against data leaks, the e-passports will come with an "antiskimming" material that blocks radio waves on the passport's back and spine, the State Department notice said.

The new passports would comply with an International Civil Aviation Organization specification on e-passports, the State Department said.

Though the State Department moved away from its earlier proposal of a self-powered RFID chip in favor of a passive one that relies on a reader machine's power, privacy concerns remain, said Barry Steinhardt, director of the ACLU's Technology and Liberty Program. Steinhardt called the State Department's security measures a "step forward," but he said bar codes could be used to match electronic data with paper data on passports.

"It still raises the question [of] whether or not this is an appropriate technology," Steinhardt said. "There are still some essential concerns about whether this is secure or not."

But Neville Pattinson, director of technology and Government affairs for Texas RFID card vendor Axalto, praised the State Department's changes, including the passive chips and antiskimming materials. "This is a fine example of the government listening to public opinion and adopting technology that protects citizen's privacy," he said. "With the changes, information cannot be extracted from it."

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Ya, right. If it was made by man, it will be defeated by man.

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Give this some intelligent thought.

How will a chip, enchance security?

Remember when those accused of 9-11, received there extensions on there visas, after they were identified as the "culprits "of 9-11?

If the passport already has the info, why need a chip?

The U.S. is warming the masses, as it steadily brings the day of the Mark. The U.S. will usher this in.

And those whose "allegiance" is to anthing but YHSHWH-GOD ( the masses of churchianity) will line up and say""put it here", while extending there right hand.

Watch.

_________________

But I say unto you, love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you and pray for them that despitefully use you and persecute you. (Matt. 5: 43-44)

[Knight of Christ]

well the just blows not to mention veary depressing for me.

The reasion being is that I like to travel to other countries whenever i can aford to, and to do so for at least some countrys a pass port is nessacery to enter the country not to mention the fact that i missplaced mine sometime agaio and can't seem to find it and if i can't that means I will have to get a new one issued soon.

Pluse there goes the price of the freekin things. it was ten dollars where i live it will probly be closer to a hundred after this.

Edited November 26, 2005 by Knight of Christ

[Avidan]

well the just blows not to mention veary depressing for me.

The reasion being is that I like to travel to other countries whenever i can aford to, and to do so for at least some countrys a pass port is nessacery to enter the country not to mention the fact that i missplaced mine sometime agaio and can't seem to find it and if i can't that means I will have to get a new one issued soon.

Pluse there goes the price of the freekin things. it was ten dollars where i live it will probly be closer to a hundred after this.

KNIGHT, Each time one uses the technologys that are out there to make positive I.D., or prevent I.D. theft ( cooough) then one warms them self to these things.

I quit my job. I refuse to get a "national Federal I.D. card". required of people who work in Federal positions, and or "classified", jobs. I was earning $60,000, annually. I am now a welfare recipiant. TWO years now. I will probably not renew my driver licence. It too is going R.F.I.D.

Now if asked to get the "mark" what do you suppose my answer will be?

Now those who exposed themself to the point of the "mark". What do you realisticly beleive they will say?

You are conditioning yourself for trouble.

I really never thought I would see the day of the "Mark".

I may of been seiously wrong.

I believe you can hurry and get a non R.F.I.D. passport, if you get busy. I got mine last year because I knew this was coming. Pay an extra $100 and you can get it in 10 days. I did. Total cost was $190. Plus some misc.

All this I.D. theft ( happens to less than 1% of the population, hmmmmm ) terrorism, is a lot of bla, bla, to get the masses scared. Once scared they submitt.

Very effective, very effective.

Effective against those who trust in man.

Edited November 26, 2005 by Avidan