THE MONUMENTAL ERROR OF ELLEN GOULD HARMON WHITE

[wordsower]

Word: I still like EGW's book.

Fine, but that cat looks like he's on my side ready to pounce on her!

Yod, re: Matthew 5:17 .....not one jot or tittle will be changed until all is fulfilled.

So, under your interpretation we would still be required to sacrifice goats. Since not one jot or tittle has changed.

Re: adultery....Under the law you were stoned if you were caught committing adultery.

Under the new covenant Jesus said you sin if you even think of it

Outward signs vs. a pure heart. See the difference??

If you are led by the Spirit you are not under the law. Galatians

One Accord, would you be willing to re-read Galatians and then let me know how you feel?

[BlindSeeker]

Yod, re: Matthew 5:17  .....not one jot or tittle will be changed until all is fulfilled.

This is the greatest evidence to the existing distinction between the ceremonial/Levitical law and the Ten Commandments/moral law declared here by Christ Himself.

• Heb 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the [Levitical/Mosaic law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
  12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
  

[Guest yod]

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[OneAccord]

Yod, re: Matthew 5:17  .....not one jot or tittle will be changed until all is fulfilled. 

So, under your interpretation we would still be required to sacrifice goats.  Since not one jot or tittle has changed.

Re: adultery....Under the law you were stoned if you were caught committing adultery.

Under the new covenant Jesus said you sin if you even think of it

Outward signs vs. a pure heart.  See the difference??

If you are led by the Spirit you are not under the law. Galatians

One Accord, would you be willing to re-read Galatians and then let me know how you feel?

I think we need to interpret what 'under the law' means. I think it means something like being held in bondage to the law, being justified or penalized because of it. That we would have to live our lives in accordance with it or else we are in sin, the wages of sin is death, and there's no way we can ever measure up.

Jesus freed us from this bondage, and from the penalties of sin. We are no longer under the law, we walk in the Spirit, in His Spirit, not after the flesh. We walk now in HIS righteousness. He gave us HIS righteousness because we don't have our own righteousness, we are slaves to sin.

Okay, that said, so now here we are living under grace, His grace. Does that mean it's a free for all? We can do whatever we want because we are free in Christ? No, of course not, now we are to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling.

We can look to the law for guidelines, as a roadmap, if you will, to see how God would have us live. Do we need to sacrifice goats? Of course not, Jesus paid the price already. But studying the Torah and searching out the multi-faceted meanigs behind all the required sacrfices helps us to understand what Christ did for us, and helps us to appreciate it all the more.

Should we stone adulterers? Of course not, Jesus paid the price, remember the wages of sin is death, Jesus paid the price, He died for us. Should we commit adultery? No, why would we want to break our Saviour's heart like that? Why shouldn't we commit adultery? Because it's the LAW, God's law. Why did He make it a law? Study the Torah.

Personnally, I need the rules spelled out for me pretty clear, because I lived in lawlessness for 38 years. I live in a culture of tolerance where divorce, abortion, sex outside of marriage, homosexuality and a host of other sin is normalized.

If someone told me that the only law is Love God and Love your neighbor and I didn't read the rest of the Bible, I would probably justify a lot of behaviour that is not pleasing to God.

The law is the standard that God set down for us. Nto one jot or tittle have passed away. It stands. We don't measure up against it, but we live in His grace. But we can still look to it for a standard to live by.

I know I'm kind of rambling. i hope I'm getting my point across.

[traveller]

[i know I'm kind of rambling. i hope I'm getting my point across.

You NEVER ramble OA!! As far as I'm concerned, you can keep on talking! You go girl!!

[OneAccord]

Actually I rambled for years........my road name was Ramble-On Rose......

Guess I still ramble even though I'm at the settle down easy part of the song

[Catsmeow]

Hey, have you noticed that the guy who starts these just disappears.

Real strange.

[Guest yod]

What does it mean "The Law is written on their hearts" if there is no longer any Law?

Romans 2

14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves,

15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,

16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

The early church had no New Testament yet even the gentiles kept the righteous requirements of the Law. I hope that no one is getting the idea from me that we should build a Temple and start schlepping goats up there...

However, there are none who are righteous (of ourselves)....we have all gone astray.....

astray from what?

From God's standard of righteousness.

Where is His standard found? In Yeshua!

Once that has been established I see nothing wrong with reading His very first revealed Word and attempting to understand the intent of every syllable that He breathed into the Torah.

When Yochanan said that "The Word became flesh and dwelt among us" He was talking about the Torah/Tenach because there was no New Testament scriptures for almost another 300 years.

If this is true and we really want to know Yeshua then we, like the Psalmist, love the Torah (and of course the NT) because it IS Jesus Himself.

the only problem is when the form takes precedent over the substance. This is why I keep harping on the fact that Yeshua came to show us the proper interpretation....what the Law could not do by itself because no one else could live up to it.

He showed that there is STILL a price for sin. A horrible price that an innocent Lamb has to pay.

I do not wish to throw any more sins upon His back....so I seek His wisdom in discovering what He says sin is...what He says is righteous....what He says is good.

I can't trust my own heart to figure it out completely because "the heart is deceitfully wicked..who can know it?".

And therefore I believe that in the context of this new and better covenant, much is to be gained by knowing it's very foundation through the Torah.

[Guest yod]

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[nebula]

Hey, have you noticed that the guy who starts these just disappears.

Real strange.

That's what you call a troll. People who lure others into a debate for no other reason than to stir debate. They never participate in the conversation.