Are We Trust Worthy To God?

[Guest linssue55]

Hello everyone not sure if this is proper place for this thread or not but here goes.

I was a reading and responding to a thread in the apologetic area entitled "Personal Savior" and I happened to read elder brother Ovedya's comment that happened to follow one on mine.

And as I was a reading what Ovedya said they was something he said that got me a thinking about something.

This is only a part quote of what he said,--- "If you don't believe that Jesus has the ability to meet you exactly where you are you're trying to do something in order to earn His trust"

Now I want it plain here that I am not picking on Ovedya here. I just got a thought from his quote and am going with it. What if we turned it around instead of us trusting in God for a moment and looked at it and asked.---- What can God trust us with in our relationship with Him?

Are we trust worthy to God? These are the thoughts I introducing into this thread. As I'm just curious.

A few scriptures to ponder so you can see my train of thought.

James 2:23--Abraham is referred to a Friend of God.

John 15:14-15--a distinction is being made between a servant relationship vs a friendship relationship with God.

Any thoughts, ideas, scriptures are all welcome

OC

This is the ONLY way in which to be friends with the Lord. Remember we are sinners, and God is no fool. Even He said......"Cursed in MAN that trusteth in MAN, and make FLESH His arm.' Would you trust us. Always remember (because we are sinners) it is NEVER what WE do, ......"IT is ALWAYS what HE does for us.".......

Here is how we obtain and friendship with the Lord in the blue, and this does not happen over night. It takes YEARS of learnig, and study, then study some more, again and again and aigain. EVERYDAY!!! NOT just on Sunday's. (Remember He has ALways loved us).....

{Note: Salvation + doctrine heard + doctrine accepted as truth = divine norms and standards in the soul. Filling of the Holy Spirit + doctrine in the soul = applying doctrine to experiences in life = divine production.}

23~~ And the scripture said,

{Genesis 15-6; II Chronicles 20-7 ; Isaiah 41-8} was fulfilled which "Abraham had believed in 'the manifest God' ,

and it was credited to his account for righteousness"

and he was called the 'Friend {philos} of God.'

{Note: Jehovah usually refers to God the father. But when it refers to the 'manifest God', it is referring to Jesus.}

{Note: 'Philos' is very strong in the Greek. The LOVED ONE of

God . . . occupation with Christ}."

[Openly Curious]

Hello everyone not sure if this is proper place for this thread or not but here goes.

I was a reading and responding to a thread in the apologetic area entitled "Personal Savior" and I happened to read elder brother Ovedya's comment that happened to follow one on mine.

And as I was a reading what Ovedya said they was something he said that got me a thinking about something.

This is only a part quote of what he said,--- "If you don't believe that Jesus has the ability to meet you exactly where you are you're trying to do something in order to earn His trust"

Now I want it plain here that I am not picking on Ovedya here. I just got a thought from his quote and am going with it. What if we turned it around instead of us trusting in God for a moment and looked at it and asked.---- What can God trust us with in our relationship with Him?

Are we trust worthy to God? These are the thoughts I introducing into this thread. As I'm just curious.

A few scriptures to ponder so you can see my train of thought.

James 2:23--Abraham is referred to a Friend of God.

John 15:14-15--a distinction is being made between a servant relationship vs a friendship relationship with God.

Any thoughts, ideas, scriptures are all welcome

OC

This is the ONLY way in which to be friends with the Lord. Remember we are sinners, and God is no fool. Even He said......"Cursed in MAN that trusteth in MAN, and make FLESH His arm.' Would you trust us. Always remember (because we are sinners) it is NEVER what WE do, ......"IT is ALWAYS what HE does for us.".......

Here is how we obtain and friendship with the Lord in the blue, and this does not happen over night. It takes YEARS of learnig, and study, then study some more, again and again and aigain. EVERYDAY!!! NOT just on Sunday's. (Remember He has ALways loved us).....

{Note: Salvation + doctrine heard + doctrine accepted as truth = divine norms and standards in the soul. Filling of the Holy Spirit + doctrine in the soul = applying doctrine to experiences in life = divine production.}

23~~ And the scripture said,

{Genesis 15-6; II Chronicles 20-7 ; Isaiah 41-8} was fulfilled which "Abraham had believed in 'the manifest God' ,

and it was credited to his account for righteousness"

and he was called the 'Friend {philos} of God.'

{Note: Jehovah usually refers to God the father. But when it refers to the 'manifest God', it is referring to Jesus.}

{Note: 'Philos' is very strong in the Greek. The LOVED ONE of

God . . . occupation with Christ}."

KOOL

oc

[Guest linssue55]

{Note: Salvation + doctrine heard + doctrine accepted as truth = divine norms and standards in the soul. Filling of the Holy Spirit + doctrine in the soul = applying doctrine to experiences in life = divine production.}

Salvation + doctrine heard + doctrine accepted as truth = divine norms and standards in the soul.

Filling of the Holy Spirit + doctrine in the soul + applying doctrine to experiences in life = divine production.

No, two seperate sentences, see the period, no typo. You got it right. It sure does make sense for application in fulfilling God's mandates for our lives.

Edited June 22, 2006 by linssue55

[redeemed098]

Psalm 23.

"He leads US along paths of righteousness for HIS NAMES SAKE." It is not our name that is on the Line. It's God's. You see if God is not faithful to his own word, then he shows himself to be untrustworthy. That is why HE leads US. Because he IS Trustworthy and we clearly are NOT. It is not any effort of our own that makes us any MORE trustworthy. It is the power and infilling of Gods Holy Spirit that gives us boldness and courage in the midst of persecution to continue to do the will of God. It is the power of prayer that releases Gods manifest power in the life of the true believer to proclaim the message of Christ and be as witnesses UNTO HIM. It isnt about US. It has never been about US. You can never be trustworthy enough to earn Gods trust. You think he doesnt already know who you are..??

He died for us WHILE we were sinners. Were we trustworthy BEFORE WE WERE SAVED....???? No...!!!! Yet clearly he still died for us so that we could be saved.

Doing Gods will is not about being trustworthy. Its about being prayerful and available so that HE can do HIS will THROUGH you. He simply wants you to be available. You are not filled with the Holy Spirit so you can merely experience peace and feeling good. You are not in agreement with God when you pray to be filled with the spirit so you can live in peace. You are in agreement with God when you pray to filled with the Holy Spirit in order to be empowered to speak the word of God with boldness and be a witness unto HIM. In the midst of persecution, the Holy Spirit will give you the words to speak to those who are opposing you. The Holy Spirit will fill you with power when you are all of one accord praying according to the will of God and not according to your own will. The Holy Spirit is not interested in ANYTHING but the WILL of God... He IS God....!! Sure God will give you the desires of your own heart, but what IS that desire if it is not HIM. Its YOU...!!!

"If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear their prayer and I will heal their land."

People........I DONT see too much healing of peoples lands going on and I most certainly am not seeing answer to many prayers. I will say this though. The prayers that I HAVE seen answered are always prayers according to Gods will involving the salvation of the Lost. You have a duty as a believer to pray RIGHT prayers, that is why the disciples asked the Lord to teach them how to pray. The disciples could clearly see the power of prayer at work in the Life of Jesus. They WANTED to know about this power. They wanted to know about this prayer.

Please note that in the book of Acts when they all met together of ONE accord and prayed for the power to speak boldly the truths of Gods word in the midst of persecution, they did not pray for God to lessen the struggle. The went into battle knowing that what they truly needed was Boldness and courage to continue in "the midst of battle." Their focus was on the gospel, not themselves. Please also note that when people gathered together in one accord pray according to the will of God, there is a shaking that occurs that leaves such an impression on the hearts of those who experienced it that they can even remember the day it happened. I guess when we pray according to Gods will he says amen with an earthquake. The Holy Spirit infilling is an experience, it is something to be remembered, and remembered well. That is why you cannot shake the faith of a true born again believer. Whether you were on your own sitting on your couch at home or in a gathering of like minded people of one accord, this infilling is absolutely essential to the life of the believer. It is the Power to Walk with Christ and be HIS hands and HIS feet and HIS voice.

If you are a real and true disciple of Jesus Christ you WILL go through the valley of the shadow of death and you WILL just as Shadrach Meshach and Abednego be thrown into the furnace. However you have the comfort of knowing because of the truth of Gods Word, that HE will be with you in the valley and also in the fire. Our Lord said this to Peter....."Peter, satan has asked to sift you." If you are a real and true follower of Christ, you can be certain that wherever you go and whatever you do, you WILL be sifted. Your faith WILL be tested, just as Jesus was.

"We share in his sufferings in order that we may share in his glory." Take the Words of Christ to heart when he says, "but fear NOT for I have overcome the world." Then thank God for the book of Job which reveals to us how to suffer with grace knowing that no matter what satan sets about doing to us to test our faith, our God is the God who turns Curse into Blessing and works ALL things for good. Through the sifting process you will have hope in the words of Job, "my ears had HEARD of you, but now my EYES have SEEN you, therefore I repent in sackcloth and ashes. Through every ordeal satan challenged Job with he simply drew closer and closer to God.

Jesus is the author and perfector of our faith. To ask whether WE are trustworthy is to ask Jesus whether he can really finish what he has already started, whilst knowing that he has already stated that he WILL.

No we are NOT trustworthy. It is written that Jesus entrusted the secrets of the kingdom of God with men who doubted. Its ok to be real with God. You're not surprising him with anything he doesnt already know.

Regards,

Ben.

Edited June 26, 2006 by redeemed098

[Rachel72]

I think it is a sad commentary to simply say, "I am not trustworthy," and thus be content with that. As for God, we know he is trustworthy. That goes without being said, but the question being asked by the person who started this thread appears to be one of contemplation. In other words, we should look inwardly and see where perhaps we have been failing God, and look for ways we can do better. I am not suggesting that any man or woman can be perfect in all their ways before God by his Holy standards, but again, to simply say, "I am not trustworthy," and almost make a boast in that to me is sad.

I see what you are saying, but would we be boasting if we said we were sinners? My heart wants to be trustworthy, because I want to imitate Christ, but I am a sinner, and may fall short of being trustworthy. I would rather be humble and tell people, I strive to be a trustworthy person, but keep in mind, that we are all sinners, and we all make mistakes."

Just a thought to ponder...

Rachel72

[shepherdsgrace]

In the Word of God it says that Stewards must be found faithful. It is a truth that we are tested on this earth. During testings and trials we can certainly make choices to either trust in God and obey or just follow our passions or depressions and give up. Indeed God wants to find us trustworthy! Being trustworthy and faithful does not mean by any shade of definition perfection. It means following Jesus through thick and thin. It means being an obedient child of God. And of course we understand that this is all done by grace through faith. It is God who gets the glory when we do well in Him. Yes we often fail. However the pattern of trustworthiness before the Lord is very important. It depicts our character before the Lord. Indeed you can not read the words of Paul and Peter and James without seeing the need for faithfulness and trustworthiness before the Lord.

[shepherdsgrace]

I really think there must be a differentation between the words "trustworthy" or "faithfulness" and "Perfection". No one is even hinting at perfection. We all make many mistakes. But there should be Patterns in our lives. And I think "patterns" is another noteworthy word. Patterns of behavior and response display what is inside.

[Rachel72]

I really think there must be a differentation between the words "trustworthy" or "faithfulness" and "Perfection". No one is even hinting at perfection. We all make many mistakes. But there should be Patterns in our lives. And I think "patterns" is another noteworthy word. Patterns of behavior and response display what is inside.

I so agree with what you say, that patterns of behavior and response display what is inside.

Amen to that one!!!

[Openly Curious]

Psalm 23.

"He leads US along paths of righteousness for HIS NAMES SAKE." It is not our name that is on the Line. It's God's. You see if God is not faithful to his own word, then he shows himself to be untrustworthy. That is why HE leads US. Because he IS Trustworthy and we clearly are NOT. It is not any effort of our own that makes us any MORE trustworthy. It is the power and infilling of Gods Holy Spirit that gives us boldness and courage in the midst of persecution to continue to do the will of God. It is the power of prayer that releases Gods manifest power in the life of the true believer to proclaim the message of Christ and be as witnesses UNTO HIM. It isnt about US. It has never been about US. You can never be trustworthy enough to earn Gods trust. You think he doesnt already know who you are..??

He died for us WHILE we were sinners. Were we trustworthy BEFORE WE WERE SAVED....???? No...!!!! Yet clearly he still died for us so that we could be saved.

Doing Gods will is not about being trustworthy. Its about being prayerful and available so that HE can do HIS will THROUGH you. He simply wants you to be available. You are not filled with the Holy Spirit so you can merely experience peace and feeling good. You are not in agreement with God when you pray to be filled with the spirit so you can live in peace. You are in agreement with God when you pray to filled with the Holy Spirit in order to be empowered to speak the word of God with boldness and be a witness unto HIM. In the midst of persecution, the Holy Spirit will give you the words to speak to those who are opposing you. The Holy Spirit will fill you with power when you are all of one accord praying according to the will of God and not according to your own will. The Holy Spirit is not interested in ANYTHING but the WILL of God... He IS God....!! Sure God will give you the desires of your own heart, but what IS that desire if it is not HIM. Its YOU...!!!

"If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear their prayer and I will heal their land."

People........I DONT see too much healing of peoples lands going on and I most certainly am not seeing answer to many prayers. I will say this though. The prayers that I HAVE seen answered are always prayers according to Gods will involving the salvation of the Lost. You have a duty as a believer to pray RIGHT prayers, that is why the disciples asked the Lord to teach them how to pray. The disciples could clearly see the power of prayer at work in the Life of Jesus. They WANTED to know about this power. They wanted to know about this prayer.

Please note that in the book of Acts when they all met together of ONE accord and prayed for the power to speak boldly the truths of Gods word in the midst of persecution, they did not pray for God to lessen the struggle. The went into battle knowing that what they truly needed was Boldness and courage to continue in "the midst of battle." Their focus was on the gospel, not themselves. Please also note that when people gathered together in one accord pray according to the will of God, there is a shaking that occurs that leaves such an impression on the hearts of those who experienced it that they can even remember the day it happened. I guess when we pray according to Gods will he says amen with an earthquake. The Holy Spirit infilling is an experience, it is something to be remembered, and remembered well. That is why you cannot shake the faith of a true born again believer. Whether you were on your own sitting on your couch at home or in a gathering of like minded people of one accord, this infilling is absolutely essential to the life of the believer. It is the Power to Walk with Christ and be HIS hands and HIS feet and HIS voice.

If you are a real and true disciple of Jesus Christ you WILL go through the valley of the shadow of death and you WILL just as Shadrach Meshach and Abednego be thrown into the furnace. However you have the comfort of knowing because of the truth of Gods Word, that HE will be with you in the valley and also in the fire. Our Lord said this to Peter....."Peter, satan has asked to sift you." If you are a real and true follower of Christ, you can be certain that wherever you go and whatever you do, you WILL be sifted. Your faith WILL be tested, just as Jesus was.

"We share in his sufferings in order that we may share in his glory." Take the Words of Christ to heart when he says, "but fear NOT for I have overcome the world." Then thank God for the book of Job which reveals to us how to suffer with grace knowing that no matter what satan sets about doing to us to test our faith, our God is the God who turns Curse into Blessing and works ALL things for good. Through the sifting process you will have hope in the words of Job, "my ears had HEARD of you, but now my EYES have SEEN you, therefore I repent in sackcloth and ashes. Through every ordeal satan challenged Job with he simply drew closer and closer to God.

Jesus is the author and perfector of our faith. To ask whether WE are trustworthy is to ask Jesus whether he can really finish what he has already started, whilst knowing that he has already stated that he WILL.

No we are NOT trustworthy. It is written that Jesus entrusted the secrets of the kingdom of God with men who doubted. Its ok to be real with God. You're not surprising him with anything he doesnt already know.

Regards,

Ben.

Well this kinda sounds good but I just wonder why they call our walk with God a relationship then if it is all one sided and we can't be faithfully entrusted with any thing from God.

oc

[Openly Curious]

In the Word of God it says that Stewards must be found faithful. It is a truth that we are tested on this earth. During testings and trials we can certainly make choices to either trust in God and obey or just follow our passions or depressions and give up. Indeed God wants to find us trustworthy! Being trustworthy and faithful does not mean by any shade of definition perfection. It means following Jesus through thick and thin. It means being an obedient child of God. And of course we understand that this is all done by grace through faith. It is God who gets the glory when we do well in Him. Yes we often fail. However the pattern of trustworthiness before the Lord is very important. It depicts our character before the Lord. Indeed you can not read the words of Paul and Peter and James without seeing the need for faithfulness and trustworthiness before the Lord.

oc