The Toronto Blessing, and Benny Hinn, etc

[st. Worm]

I don't know if it's too Christian to heap humiliation on anyone.

In this case, I'd say it is. Better we make fun of them lest unbelievers think the greed, excess and bad doctrine of TBN is what Christianity is all about.

sw

I thought we were to speak th truth in love.

At least I am speaking the truth. And I am more concerned about the victims of TBN than the false ministers on there who plunder them.

sw

I guess some is better than none, huh?

Jesus and his Apostles (especially Peter and Paul) used some very rough language to describe the false teachers of their time. If you want to be the Nice Police that's fine, but there is ample scriptural precedent for dealing harshly with wolves in sheep's clothing.

sw

[billie]

I don't know if it's too Christian to heap humiliation on anyone.

In this case, I'd say it is. Better we make fun of them lest unbelievers think the greed, excess and bad doctrine of TBN is what Christianity is all about.

sw

I thought we were to speak th truth in love.

At least I am speaking the truth. And I am more concerned about the victims of TBN than the false ministers on there who plunder them.

sw

I guess some is better than none, huh?

Jesus and his Apostles (especially Peter and Paul) used some very rough language to describe the false teachers of their time. If you want to be the Nice Police that's fine, but there is ample scriptural precedent for dealing harshly with wolves in sheep's clothing.

sw

That's "Love Police" to you, mister! Seems you've taken offense. I apologize if I stepped on your toes. That last comment of mine wasn't sarcastic. I was serious.

[st. Worm]

I don't know if it's too Christian to heap humiliation on anyone.

In this case, I'd say it is. Better we make fun of them lest unbelievers think the greed, excess and bad doctrine of TBN is what Christianity is all about.

sw

I thought we were to speak th truth in love.

At least I am speaking the truth. And I am more concerned about the victims of TBN than the false ministers on there who plunder them.

sw

I guess some is better than none, huh?

Jesus and his Apostles (especially Peter and Paul) used some very rough language to describe the false teachers of their time. If you want to be the Nice Police that's fine, but there is ample scriptural precedent for dealing harshly with wolves in sheep's clothing.

sw

That's "Love Police" to you, mister! Seems you've taken offense. I apologize if I stepped on your toes. That last comment of mine wasn't sarcastic. I was serious.

Love Police? Darrin is a lucky man!

sw

[RGR]

[cjrose]

I was wondering what the other users of this forum thought regarding the supposed 'toronto blessing' and also the seemingly selfish and get rich quick ministries of Benny Hinn.

To set out my own position from the outset: I am highly suspicious of the Toronto Blessing, and, maybe just a little bit less suspicious of Benny Hinn.

I try to be very cautious regarding the truth of God's Word, and how it is preached. If a 'red flag' is raised regarding the preaching of God's word, I am very reluctant to be drawn in by the 'new' way of thinking. There is not much that I hate more than the polluting of His Word.

I believe in 'spiritual blessings' in these days, but maybe some churches are going too far?

I just don't know all the answers myself. Some I know are in favour of it, some against. What is the truth?

I do not know what the Toronto blessing is but I would like to say I went to see Benny Hinn's brother who also preaches in much the same way and was totally turned off. I was really hoping for an ephiany or feel the Holy Spirit move me but what I witnessed turned me off so badly that I was nearly sick to my stomach. They drive mercedes, wear diamonds and gold and the way the sevants placed their tithings in a velvet lined basket looked like something out of the Stepford Wives. Now don't get me wrong, tithing is a good thing but where is it going when it's put in those velvet lined baskets. Does it go in the Hinn's pockets because the day I was there he made a huge issue of his sons birthday and gave him a set of car keys and a diamond ring with some intinials on it. All done before the congregation and they were sucked in by his generosity. Do they even realize that it's their money that may have paid for those gifts.

I don't mean to imply that we can't have comforts of our own but live within our means and live honestly. Tithe where you know your hard earn dollars are going to go for something that matters. I wanted to scream at all these people look at what you are doing? You are following a leader who wears silk designer suits and dresses himself with idolilitries. How can I or anyone respect the word coming out of his mouth about Jesus... it seems very hypocritical to me.

[redeemed098]

You want to be very careful people...Pride can go BOTH ways you know...You can be just as proud of having NOTHING as you can of having EVERYTHING.

The issue is still Pride.

The manna in the desert is all the lesson we need. God specifically said NOT to take more than you need. Whatever was taken in excess, turned to mould and maggots and perished. This is the lesson we need to learn.

What we WANT and what we NEED are two different things.

"Two things I ask of you O Lord; do not refuse me before I die: Keep falsehood and Lies far from me; give me neither poverty nor riches, but give me ONLY my daily bread. Otherwise I may have too much and disown you and say, "who is the Lord..? or I may become poor and steal and so dishonour the name of my God."

(Proverbs 30:7-9)

Jesus himself claimed to be the bread from heaven. What the people ate in the desert was manna that gave life to their mortal physical bodies. The bread from heaven which is Jesus gives life to both our physical bodies and our spirits. Those who ate manna in the desert still died...Those who eat the bread that Jesus gives shall NEVER die.

If Jesus isnt enough for you then you will never HAVE enough. That is why we pray, "give us this day our daily bread". Just enough to get us through the day.

Not our weekly or monthly or yearly bread...Our "daily" bread. EVERTHING else that we have apart from Christ, just as the excess of manna perished, is only something that moth and rust will destroy. They have NO eternal value whatsoever. They are all going to pass away.

If the television ministries are causing you to rise up in a critical spirit, then maybe God is wanting to do something ABOUT that critical spirit.

Maybe, just maybe God is using these ministries to grow YOU....Dont forget people, I hear you quote it ALL the time...

"In ALL things God works for the good of those who love him and have been called according to HIS purpose."

According to that scripture alone, there is nothing that would suggest that God is NOT using Benny Hinn in some way....

Maybe hes teaching you how to discern....How else are you supposed to learn discernment unless he places you in a position where you MUST discern...?

Fruit GROWS people, it doesnt just appear one day by magic...It must be pruned and go through all the right processes and be placed in exactly the right enviromnent so it CAN grow. God is ALWAYS teaching us something...What is sad though is that we are usually the Last ones to see that, until he brings us through and we are able to look back.

Regards,

Ben.

[st. Worm]

You want to be very careful people...Pride can go BOTH ways you know...You can be just as proud of having NOTHING as you can of having EVERYTHING.

The issue is still Pride.

The manna in the desert is all the lesson we need. God specifically said NOT to take more than you need. Whatever was taken in excess, turned to mould and maggots and perished. This is the lesson we need to learn.

What we WANT and what we NEED are two different things.

"Two things I ask of you O Lord; do not refuse me before I die: Keep falsehood and Lies far from me; give me neither poverty nor riches, but give me ONLY my daily bread. Otherwise I may have too much and disown you and say, "who is the Lord..? or I may become poor and steal and so dishonour the name of my God."

(Proverbs 30:7-9)

Jesus himself claimed to be the bread from heaven. What the people ate in the desert was manna that gave life to their mortal physical bodies. The bread from heaven which is Jesus gives life to both our physical bodies and our spirits. Those who ate manna in the desert still died...Those who eat the bread that Jesus gives shall NEVER die.

If Jesus isnt enough for you then you will never HAVE enough. That is why we pray, "give us this day our daily bread". Just enough to get us through the day.

Not our weekly or monthly or yearly bread...Our "daily" bread. EVERTHING else that we have apart from Christ, just as the excess of manna perished, is only something that moth and rust will destroy. They have NO eternal value whatsoever. They are all going to pass away.

If the television ministries are causing you to rise up in a critical spirit, then maybe God is wanting to do something ABOUT that critical spirit.

Maybe, just maybe God is using these ministries to grow YOU....Dont forget people, I hear you quote it ALL the time...

"In ALL things God works for the good of those who love him and have been called according to HIS purpose."

According to that scripture alone, there is nothing that would suggest that God is NOT using Benny Hinn in some way....

Maybe hes teaching you how to discern....How else are you supposed to learn discernment unless he places you in a position where you MUST discern...?

Fruit GROWS people, it doesnt just appear one day by magic...It must be pruned and go through all the right processes and be placed in exactly the right enviromnent so it CAN grow. God is ALWAYS teaching us something...What is sad though is that we are usually the Last ones to see that, until he brings us through and we are able to look back.

Regards,

Ben.

The issue here is NOT pride. The issue is heresey and false teaching by a man who dupes his foolish followers. His preaching and teaching have absolutely NOTHING to do with Christianity. There is no Law and no Gospel. Please do not turn this into a criticism of those who call Hinn what he is -- a snake. While I understand that God uses evil people like Hinn for his own purposes that does not excuse what Hinn does nor does it mean we should not warn others about him.

sw

[RGR]

.......that does not excuse what Hinn does nor does it mean we should not warn others about him.

[RGR]

Satan will gladly give you 99% of the truth if he can take you to Hell on the 1% of heresy. Sure, I suppose it very possible that people have gotten saved under the ministry of Hinn and others like him. However, I'm reminded of the seed that fell on stony ground where it had no foundation. What happens when these folks aren't seeing the big $$$ blessings that Hinn, et. al. promises? I dare say that many possibly just give up and say that they can't make it as a Christian. I don't have hard facts and figures to back it up, but it is worth a thought.

[Gerioke]

I don't know if it's too Christian to heap humiliation on anyone.

In this case, I'd say it is. Better we make fun of them lest unbelievers think the greed, excess and bad doctrine of TBN is what Christianity is all about.

sw

I thought we were to speak th truth in love.

At least I am speaking the truth. And I am more concerned about the victims of TBN than the false ministers on there who plunder them.

sw

I guess some is better than none, huh?

Jesus and his Apostles (especially Peter and Paul) used some very rough language to describe the false teachers of their time. If you want to be the Nice Police that's fine, but there is ample scriptural precedent for dealing harshly with wolves in sheep's clothing.

sw

The question is who gave you divine authority to be the "judge?" Jesus and the Apostles were always correct in their identification of false prophets. Where does your inerancy in judgment come from? Let us look at Hinn. Jesus said a house divided against itsself will not stand. You claim Hinn is a fale prophet. Why would a false prophet preach the true message of salvation to the world? Why would a false prophet spends millions of dollars to spread the gospel, the message of salvation to Africa? Africa & India crusades are huge financial liabilites to Hinn. If he were in it for the money, he would not be doing the world wide crusades. They are a huge financial drain on the ministry. He is drawing crowds and recording professions of faith only second to Reinhardt Bonkee at the present moment. Satan is doing a real smart thing if he is sending Hinn to preach the true gospel and lead millions to salvation. The real problem is most christians can not see past the tip of their nose.

So many christians have the attitude a preacher in one of Rev. Kenneth Haggins stories had. Haggin said he was discussing a move of God with another minister. Haggin said the minister said "that is not of the Lord." Haggin said I asked "how do you know?" The minister said "because if it were of the Lord, He would have started it in my church." It is unfortunate, but many Christians can not stand to see success in another denomination. If it is not happening in their little group, they wish it failure. They can not stand to see someone outside their group show greater success than they are having.

I wish Christians would spend as much energy fighting Satan as they spend fighting each other.

Have you ever noticed that as a whole, highly successful ministers do not fight each other. Their opposition comes from significantly smaller ministers who can not stand the fact that their ministry is not as large as the "TV Preacher."

I don't think that Jesus would measure success by the amount of expensive cars or the size of their beachfront homes. I would think a successful Christian would be a servant to others driven by humility. Doesn't sound like Benny Hin to me.