Proof there is, or is not a spirit?

[Guest Timbo]

Hi kjn,

Many Bibles can be confusing because of their inconsistent rendering of certain Hebrew and Greek words. At Mark 8:36, the Greek word used there for "life" is psy

[kjn]

Thanks Timbo, for the insightful explanations, and for taking the time to explain carefully. And thanks for the referencing too. Gonna print that so I can read again.

[Guest Timbo]

Thanks Timbo, for the insightful explanations, and for taking the time to explain carefully. And thanks for the referencing too. Gonna print that so I can read again.

Hi kjn,

You are welcome for the information on the meaning of soul and spirit. Here is some more information, with supporting Scriptures, that show the soul to be the whole person, with all their desires. The churches continue to teach their "flock" that the soul is immortal or deathless, fostering it, despite that the Bible does not. The religious leaders are unwilling to delve deeply into the Bible, doing their "homework" in order to know accurately the truth about the soul and spirit, or accept the Scriptures when shown that the soul is mortal.

Many religious leaders will say that the soul is immortal and turn to Matthew 10:28 and then read the first part, which says: "And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul:" However, Jesus continues, saying: "but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell."(King James Bible) Thus, the soul can be destroyed and the King James Bible uses the word "hell" as where it is destroyed, not tormented. Only by having an open mind, can one begin to discern the real meaning of the soul, spirit, and the Bible "hell". For example, at Jeremiah 2:34, it says that the soul has blood, for it reads: "Also in thy skirts is found the blood of the souls of the poor innocents." (King James Bible) At Genesis 2:7, it says that God "breathed into his (Adam's ) nostrils the breath of life; and the man came to be a living soul". This makes sense, for as Jeremiah 2:34 said that the soul has blood, that Adam became a "living soul" with blood flowing through his veins. Hence, as has been shown, the soul is the complete person, his life, with all his desires. For instance, Abraham was fearful of losing his life or soul, when entering Egypt because of a famine, for he told Sarah his wife: "Say, I pray thee, thou art my sister : that it may be well with me for thy sake; and my soul shall live because of thee". (Gen 12:13, King James Bible )

Later Abraham was told by God concerning the covenant he made with him, an "everlasting covenant", that "the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant". (Gen 17:14, King James Bible ) Thus, the soul can live or it can die, be "cut off ". Abraham's nephew Lot, in responding to the angels warning to flee the city of Sodom, told them: "Behold now, this city is near to flee unto, and it is a little one: Oh, let me escape thither, (is it not a little one? ) and my soul shall live". (Gen 19:20, King James Bible ) Hence, Lot was requesting of the angels to flee to a nearby city in order for his soul or him as person with life, to continue living. And those of the nation of Israel that disregarded the Sabbath, were told: "Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you : every one that defileth it shall be put to death : for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. " (Exodus 31:14, King James Bible ) Likewise of the Passover, for God said that "the man that is clean, and is not in a journey, and forbeareth to keep the passover, even the same soul shall be cut off from among his people."(Numbers 9:13, King James Bible ) When the nation of Israel were traveling in the wilderness, after having left the land of Egypt, they complainingly said of the manna: "But now our soul has dried away : there is nothing at all , beside this manna, before our eyes". (Numbers 11:6, King James Bible ) Thus, the soul can be "dried away" or have a feeling of contempt.

Even animals are souls, for God told Moses concerning taxing the "booty of war: "And levy a tribute unto the LORD of the men of war which went out battle : one soul of five hundred, both of the persons, and of the beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep". (Numbers 31:28, King James Bible )Therefore, the soul is not immortal, for it has blood, can "be put to death"or can be "dried out". It eats, for Leviticus 7:20 says: "But the soul that eateth of the flesh of the sacrifice of peace offerings, that pertain unto the LORD, having his uncleanness upon him, even that soul shall be cut off from among his people". (King James Bible ) And just before the nation of Israel entered the land of Canaan, Moses told the nation: "When the LORD thy God shall enlarge thy border, as he hath promised thee, and thou shalt say, I will eat flesh, because thy soul longeth to eat flesh : thou mayest eat flesh, whatsoever thy soul lusteth after". (Deut 12:20, King James Bible ) Therefore, the soul or a person with life and desires, longs to eat, and when someone dies, it can rightly be said that one's soul has died. For as Jesus said on the night before he died: "My soul is exceedingly sorrowful, even unto death." (Matt 26:38, King James Bible ) Simeon, a righteous man, told Mary: "(Yea, a sword shall pierce through thy soul also )" (Luke 2:35, King James Bible ) Thus, Mary would feel as if a sword pierced her "soul", her feelings as a person, when she saw her son Jesus hung on a torture stake.

Where did the churches get their view that the soul is something separate from the body ? Early in the third century B.C.E., the first translation of the Hebrew Scriptures (commonly called the Old Testament) into Greek, called the Septuagint, was begun. Through it many Gentiles came to have respect for and familiarity with the Jewish religion, some even converting. Jews, on the other hand, were becoming conversant with Greek thought, and some became philosophers, something entirely new to them. Philo of Alexandria, of the first century C.E., was one such Jewish philosopher.

Philo revered Plato and endeavored to explain Judaism in terms of Greek philosophy.

[WarMonkeyMan]

Can anyone provide evidence there is, or is not a spirit.

Do you mean scientific evidence?

Science can only prove, and even then, only support, what is testable.

There is no known test for spirits.

The answer, Josh, is no.

[reconditioned]

Well, if you knock your head hard enough you'll notice that you're a spirit being. But I wouldn't recomend it. It often results in death or permanent alter states of reality if you do survive.

That'll prove it to you and you alone. If you believe that its not a trick of the imagination that is to see one's physical body from the 3rd person surrounded by other people who weren't there before.

I know this has happened to someone out there. I can't remember who.

EDIT: I'm full of nonsense aren't I ? Well, whatever.

Edited February 21, 2007 by reconditioned

[Floatingaxe]

Well, if you knock your head hard enough you'll notice that you're a spirit being. But I wouldn't recomend it. It often results in death or permanent alter states of reality if you do survive.

That'll prove it to you and you alone. If you believe that its not a trick of the imagination that is to see one's physical body from the 3rd person surrounded by other people who weren't there before.

I know this has happened to someone out there. I can't remember who.

You've got amnesia, too?

[reconditioned]

I can't rightly say but I don't think I have any memory problems at all. Actually, I have no idea if I do.

[Joshua-777]

I can't rightly say but I don't think I have any memory problems at all. Actually, I have no idea if I do.

I cant remember if I do or not.

[radames422]

I thought that the Hebrew phonetic spelling of the word "spirit" was nesh-aw-maw' (N@shamah)

[radames422]

Ok, I see that it is ruwach (spirit)