Useless Organs

[Gerioke]

How do you know what kind of deseases were around at the fall of man?

I don't.

I am only evaluating the usefulness of these organs now. The fact is, the appendix and the tonsils are marginally useless now. But scientists believe that, in the past, they were more important. If these organs were never important, then presumably they would not exist in the first place. If these organs were harmful, then presumably they would be selected out of the population.

OK.

[nebula]

Actually, the tonsils and appendix are lymphoid tissues and are very necessary.

"Very" necessary? So necessary that if they were removed, you'd fall ill and/or die?

No. People live healthy lives without them. Considering their proclivity to infection, they appear to be more of a liability than a benefit.

Lorax, this does not make the "useless" organs, either.

[nebula]

How do you know what kind of deseases were around at the fall of man?

I don't.

I am only evaluating the usefulness of these organs now. The fact is, the appendix and the tonsils are marginally useless now. But scientists believe that, in the past, they were more important. If these organs were never important, then presumably they would not exist in the first place. If these organs were harmful, then presumably they would be selected out of the population.

The spleen isn't "important" either. People can function quite well without it if it needs to be removed. Are you going to argue that the spleen then is a "useless" organ and evidence for evolution?

Your argument is getting rediculous.

[nebula]

I am only evaluating the usefulness of these organs now. The fact is, the appendix and the tonsils are marginally useless now. But scientists believe that, in the past, they were more important.

By now, do you mean the whole population of Earth, or just the deveoped nations that have excelled in hygiene standards and thus are consuming less amounts of harmful organisms?

[The Lorax]

The spleen isn't "important" either. People can function quite well without it if it needs to be removed. Are you going to argue that the spleen then is a "useless" organ and evidence for evolution?

Sure it is. It has an important immune function. Splenectomy patients are urged by physicians to seek medical attention for even minor illnesses for the rest of their lives because of the handicap to their immune system. No such measures are needed for people without tonsils or appendices.

I am only evaluating the usefulness of these organs now. The fact is, the appendix and the tonsils are marginally useless now. But scientists believe that, in the past, they were more important.

By now, do you mean the whole population of Earth, or just the deveoped nations that have excelled in hygiene standards and thus are consuming less amounts of harmful organisms?

Doctors deem the organs useless. I don't know if there are regional implications.

PS: What's with the triple posting? Why don't you just use the Edit button to add to your post?

[nebula]

The spleen isn't "important" either. People can function quite well without it if it needs to be removed. Are you going to argue that the spleen then is a "useless" organ and evidence for evolution?

Sure it is. It has an important immune function. Splenectomy patients are urged by physicians to seek medical attention for even minor illnesses for the rest of their lives because of the handicap to their immune system. No such measures are needed for people without tonsils or appendices.

People can function without spleens.

People can function with a missing toe or missing finger.

The point is these organs are useful, but not necessary.

The same goes for tonsils and the vermiform appendix - they are useful but not necessary.

To call the appendix useless is a falsehood.

Doctors deem the organs useless.

Do you have a reference for this?

PS: What's with the triple posting? Why don't you just use the Edit button to add to your post?

Afterthoughts, and I was in a rush.

[nebula]

As I said before:

The vermiform appendix contains myriads of lymphoid follicles called Peyer's patches. These "are in an ideal position (1) to destroy bacteria (which are present in large numbers in the large intestine), thereby preventing these pathogens from breaching the intestinal wall, and (2) to generate many "memory" lymphocytes for long-term immunity." (Human Anatomy & Physiology, 7th ed., by Elaine N. Marieb and Katja Hoehn)

The appendix, then, has a common role as the tonsils. The appendix is not necessary for life, but neither are the tonsils. Yet no one claims the tonsils to be "useless organs."

[nebula]

The original purpose of the appendix was to assist in the digestion of cellulose, present in the sorts of foods that our ancestors ate (ie rough vegetation).

I am coming to the point of considering this a misnomer.

What you have described in the function of the caecum. Humans do have a caecum, with the vermiform appendix being an extension off of it. What little web research I have done indicates that chimpanzees (which humans are supposed to be the most closely related to, not gorillas) have an appendix as well.

[MorningGlory]

To call the appendix useless is a falsehood.

Not quite. The original purpose of the appendix was to assist in the digestion of cellulose, present in the sorts of foods that our ancestors ate (ie rough vegetation). Since we no longer eat that sort of food, the appendix is no longer useful to us, and has atrophied. There are no selection pressures in favour of it, and the selection pressure of appendicitis is against it. Any antibody capability it has is to do with itself, ie it does not protect other organs, it protects itself from infection. Complete removal has no ill-effects.

It's evidence of evolution from a leaf (cellulose)-eating ancestor. Our close cousin the gorilla, eats foods rich in cellulose, and still has a large fully-functioning appendix.

Yes, and that leaf eating ancestor was a Homo Sapiens Sapiens who was without the variety of processed food available today. God seems to 'deactivate' whatever isn't necessary at the moment but wisely leaves it in place in case of future need. Think circuit board; only the necessary circuits are complete, depending on the desired function.

[undone]

Myco

Perhaps he'll let go of it (we should be so lucky). He has brought it up countless times, and gets the same response. Slow learner I suspect.

You lower yourself to his level by insulting him. There is no need for it.

has offered nothing to an important debate.

You're kidding right?