Women pastors

[MorningGlory]

Oh for goodness sakes, evidently firehill and oops need to rewrite the whole Bible with a commentary, because for over 2000 years nobody has actually understood anything in it correctly. Theres also another verse in Galatians that says if anybody trys to bring you another other gospel than the one first delivered, even if it is an angel let him be eternally condemned..........................Ya'll better hope your right, cause if your not.

[Floatingaxe]

He died for those "sore thumbs", but He wants to hear from them, loudly! Personality traits have a tendency to allow us to fall into the false belief that it is okay if we worship quietly according to our "nature". It isn't okay.

Our born nature is to worship God with all we've got, in obedience, no matter what our "nature" argues. We will have to stand before Him one day and answer why we didn't praise Him with our all. What will we say? We were shy? That means embarrassed. What will God think of that? It is equal to shame. What does God's Word say about being ashamed? It could also be fear...fear of what? Fear of man? What does God say about fearing man?

Shalom FA,

We are to worship G-d "in Spirit and in truth" and for some that means sans the screaming, yelling, jumping, flouncing or anything else that glorifies the flesh. We are not commanded to praise Him loudly, but we can with all our hearts, albeit quietly.

Worshipping gently and quietly has nothing to do with fear or shame! That is a guilt trip that does not come from G-d.

It IS OK to worship G-d in quietness and skip all the outward displays that some find so distracting. We are to worship Him "in Spirit and in truth/" and NO ONE can dictate to another what that is.

Also, Ruth, if that were MY church, we'd be long gone. I find those displays you describe to be flesh and NOT glorifying G-d in any way shape or form.

Yes we are commanded to shout to the Lord.

[firehill]

Oh for goodness sakes, evidently firehill and oops need to rewrite the whole Bible with a commentary, because for over 2000 years nobody has actually understood anything in it correctly. Theres also another verse in Galatians that says if anybody trys to bring you another other gospel than the one first delivered, even if it is an angel let him be eternally condemned..........................Ya'll better hope your right, cause if your not.

Don't push it glory....

[Scarletprayers]

However the passage in Galatians is about salvation and our standing before God,

No it's not. Please read carefully what Paul is saying.

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you belong to Christ then you are Abraham's descendants, heirs according to promise."

Do you see that the "if" and "then" relationship? "If" they all belong to Christ "then" they are all heirs according to the promise. Scripture never once rejected any of these groups regarding salvation if they came into the nation of Israel, but the right of "heir" never belonged to the slaves, the women or the Gentiles in practice.

http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/07/09/ar...ust-like-males/

Oh for goodness sakes, evidently firehill and oops need to rewrite the whole Bible with a commentary, because for over 2000 years nobody has actually understood anything in it correctly. Theres also another verse in Galatians that says if anybody trys to bring you another other gospel than the one first delivered, even if it is an angel let him be eternally condemned..........................Ya'll better hope your right, cause if your not.

By your standard, if you and your church do not follow I Cor 14:34-35 you are doing what you contend we are doing.

How???? By God's standards women aren't allowed to preach in my church..........................so whats your point?

[firehill]

Regarding Galatians don't forget more of the context:

Paul is talking about all of us being joint heirs together - something that was not thought possible in the Old Covenant. Salvation was available in the Old Testament to all who joined themselves with Israel but the foreigner and the women were not allowed to be heirs. This was reserved for Jewish men. There was a tremendous separation between each group where one group had all the privileges and the other group had none. At least this is the way that the Jews understood it at the time. It was not made known yet that the Gentiles were to be fellow heirs with them. Ephesians 3:5-6 says:

[Floatingaxe]

It is our new nature in Christ to be demonstrative beofre the Lord in Worship. It is a command.

Shalom FA,

It is NOT our new nature to be demonstrative. That is man's theology. Please, prove that by Scripture.

The commands to rejoice and show adoration do not have to be done in the corporate worship, NOR are they commands.

We can worship quietly and please G-d. We are to worship in "spirit and in truth."

If a shy person can go to a football game and hoot and holler for his or her team, that same shy person needs to hoot and holler for Jesus. He loves it and revels in it.

Again, that is man's theology.

Man's theology? No, it is scriptural and there are many commands given to instruct us in worship. You cannot get by them.

[Floatingaxe]

Even if you don't accept my connection there, the very least the verse teaches is that a woman cannot teach a man because the first woman was deceived. Either way, a woman is not permitted to teach a man..

I don't see the sense in that at all. Neither is it ever stated anywhere else in Scripture.

What kind of spiritual law is this......

The fact that Eve was deceived is directly connected to the fact that she engaged in conversation with the cleverest of all creature. Now if you wanted to suggest that any woman that engaged in a similar conversation with the same clever creature stands a good chance of being deceived you might have more logic behind you. But just because Eve was deceived does not mean she is predisposed to being deceived, nor does it mean that all females would be predisposed to being deceived...... anymore than it means that all men are predisposed to willfully knowingly deliberately choosing to sin.

The perhaps you could briefly explain why the serpent chose to beguile Eve and not Adam. Convenience perhaps? Because she just happened to be "in the neighborhood" of the tree?

Or perhaps: A) Because he wanted to subvert God-s divine order (Which is keeping with his character, considering the fact of his rebellion), B) Because he knew the woman was more open to deception; or even, maybe C) Both.

You are suggesting that the serpent thought Eve was weaker mentally, so that is why he approached her. ahahahaha Where in Genesis does it suggest that?

FACT: we don't know precisely why the serpent approached the woman. we can assume a lot of different reasons but we don't know. But I do think it is a travesty when good Christians paint the first woman as a mockery of a human, a sub-human weak willed, over emotional mentally inferior. What is wrong with God that He would do such a thing. What is wrong with us that we would think God would do such a thing.

Then we have this divine order business. Just because God created the male first does not make the male more divine than the female, neither does it make him superior, neither does it automatically give him special privileges. We cannot arbitrarily assign motives to God that He did not state.

However if we diligently read Genesis we will see that God did indeed had a purpose for creating the man first and it had nothing to do with any "divine order". It had to do with God deciding that there was a particular lesson that the man needed to learn right off the bat. And that lesson was that it was not good for the man to be alone. Once that lesson was learned then God finished the creation of humanity as He said He would do.

You laugh. But you cannot argue against what Paul wrote: "For the man was created first."

There was plainly a reason that the serpent chose Eve. To deny such is in contrast to the part of the verse which states that he was the most crafty of all the beasts.

Nobody is making a mockery of women, nor is it an insult to women to have the protection of the God-ordained order which He established in the creation. In creation all things are ordered and perfect. The evidence is plain just by looking at it.

What's the big deal about first? Jesus says the first shall be last and the last shall be first! The "first" mentality is a carnal attitude.

[firehill]

Yeah, Gen 3:16. That Law. An acttual command of God that pre-dated the formal delivery of the law.

God COMMANDED WHAT? That Eve shouldn't speak????? Do tell me what God commanded the woman in Gen 3:16, k.

Paul's command was plain. Women could pray and prophecy, but he then made it clear in 34 and 35 that women are not to speak in Church.

To say that is a contradiction. Plain and simple. There's no way around it.

Prophecy is a gift of the Spirit in operation. Talking is not. I think all major historical commentary will agree with me on this point. You will have to go to modern (post womens lib) commentary to agree with your opinion. 34 and 35 are a command, not a contrast for literary impact.

...2For anyone who SPEAKS in a tongue does not SPEAK to men but to God...3But everyone who prophesies SPEAKS to men for...4He who SPEAKS in a tongue edifies himself, but he whw...5I would like every one of you to SPEAK in tongues,[c] but I would rather have you prophesy...SPEAKS in tongues,[d] unless he interprets, so that the church may be edified.

6Now, brothers, if I come to you and SPEAK in tongues... Unless you SPEAK intelligible words with your tongue,...You will just be SPEAKING into the air...11If then I do not grasp the meaning of what someone is SAYING, I am a foreigner to the SPEAKER, and he is a foreigner to me. 12So it is with you...13For this reason anyone who SPEAKS in a tongue should pray...he does not know what you are SAYING?...18I thank God that I SPEAK in tongues more than all of you. 19But in the church I would rather SPEAK five intelligible words to instruct others than ten thousand words in a tongue. 20Brothers, stop thinking like children. In regard to evil be infants, but in your thinking be adults. 21In the Law it is written:

"Through men of strange tongues

and through the lips of foreigners

I will speak to this people,

but even then they will not listen to me,"[f] says the LORD.

22Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is for believers, not for unbelievers. 23So if the whole church comes together and everyone SPEAKS in tongues, and some who do not understand...27If anyone SPEAKS in a tongue, two

[firehill]

What's the big deal about first? Jesus says the first shall be last and the last shall be first! The "first" mentality is a carnal attitude.

[Scarletprayers]

What's the big deal about first? Jesus says the first shall be last and the last shall be first! The "first" mentality is a carnal attitude.

Yeah great, except that it has absolutely nothing to do with what is being discussed and is being used completely out of context.