Can believers be un-converted?

[~~ angelique ~~]

I saw this response in the Atheist thread:

See, what you don't know about me and the majority of atheists and agnostics is we've already been down the christianity road. It's not that we've never "opened our hearts to jesus" or "asked God for guidance." Nothing has ever revealed itself to me and I lived most of my life as a christian. To me, it's very hard to continue to have faith in something that I believe now is just a myth. If it works for you, great. I wouldn't disbelieve either if there had been any proof whatsover. To me, praying to god has the same effect as praying to a brick.

I discovered a very old thread with this topic but would like to revisit it.

When the above poster stated, "the majority of atheists and agnostics is we've already been down the christianity road," I thought of several friends of mine. Many of which were raised in Christian homes, said they were believers, got baptised, went to church, and are now pagans, atheists, or witches.

Some actually went to Christian schools and know the bible pretty good yet are now unbelievers and sceptics.

Once a believer, is it possible to be un-converted from Christianity? This topic has been stuck in my head for some time. Thanks for responding

[mead]

I feel a great deal of sorrow for the person, who knows the truth, who would seek out God only to ultimately deny him. People who REALLY long for Christ, continue the race, not back down and cower when the world around them gets hard. These people should spend more time seeking God, instead of ALWAYS asking themselves why, constantly waiting for someone else to come along and validate them in their walk, especially when they know better. I am glad that my Father's love is a choice, but yet is freely given to all.

[Guest LadyC]

the answer is YES. it's called apostasy, and you can read about it throughout scripture.

[~~ angelique ~~]

the answer is YES. it's called apostasy, and you can read about it throughout scripture.

I searched for that word in the bible. Where is it?

[Guest LadyC]

the answer is YES. it's called apostasy, and you can read about it throughout scripture.

I searched for that word in the bible. Where is it?

look for "apostate". it may only be used in the KJV.

[OneLight]

I find it very hard to believe that when someone has come to know the Love of God, accepts Jesus as their Savior, been sealed by the Holy Spirit and have walked with the Lord with all their heart, to even entertain the thought of turning Him away and come against Him. Those who have stated that they know the Lord, but turn away, I question if they had really known them with all their heart, or just known Him with their mind? Yet, we are told that there will be a falling away in the last days. Were they talking about those who had only know Him mentally but not Spiritually?

[OneLight]

the answer is YES. it's called apostasy, and you can read about it throughout scripture.

I searched for that word in the bible. Where is it?

look for "apostate". it may only be used in the KJV.

2 Thessalonians 2

The Great Apostasy

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Stand Fast

But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth, to which He called you by our gospel, for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.

Now may our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and our God and Father, who has loved us and given us everlasting consolation and good hope by grace, comfort your hearts and establish you in every good word and work.

Be Blessed!

Alan

[BFP]

Well, I, for one, went down that very road. I was a preachers kid, raised in a very strict home with a very controling father with a temper:>) My father expected nothing less than perfection...to be seen and not heard...and weilded a belt to ensure that his kids were well behaved...and to excess. I will say that as a child I was saved, and of my own accord, perhaps more out of fear than anything else though...I'm not sure.

What ended up happening is that my siblings and I all see God as a harsh discplinarian who expects far more than we can give. Every aspect of our lives was guilt ridden, and we all suffer greatly from huge guilt complexes So we all became agnostics/athiests in our own way. I was saved as a child however, and knew my Bible very well.

At 14 I decided that I wasn't having it anymore. I started to rebel and openly tell my father that I did not believe in God. I was trying to escape the discipline, the guilt that was forever hung over my head...and I figured at that point that I would never make it to heaven anyway...after all if your father, who is a preacher can't love you then how can you ever expect to be loved by something so much bigger than your human father. It is difficult to explain and even harder for me to understand this logic myself, but it is there. Even to this day, and I have come back to the Lord.

I lived the "athiest" life for about ten years, vowing to prove to myself and everyone else that there was no God. After all, GOd had never spoken to me. Funniest thing was however, that my Christianity was so engrained in me that I remember calling out to God to 'prove' to me that he was real. And eventually He did, but that wasn't pretty. I had to go a real long ways away before it happened, and almost lost myself forever ( story I will not get into because it was very occultic and I really don't like to remember. )

But one day when I was 24 I got on my knees and claimed the blood, asked God to come inot my life once again. It was a miraculous event, and event that told me in no uncertain terms that God did exist. I'll never forget it!

Today I truly believe that God exists, I still have a difficult time with the idea that He can love me, but at the same time I have seen too many things that tell me he was always there in my life even when I was denying Him.

I believe that these athiests and agnostics are saved, but are going through denial, they are rebelling. I also believe that God is waiting for the day that they come back, and He will see that they do eventually. During this time in there lives He is protecting them in many ways like he did me. They have to hit thier rock bottom. Once we are born a child of God we are always a child of God, we are like a rebelling teenager. He still shows you that He is there in many ways however, but you can't see it at that time:>)

Take my daughter for instance. She is 18 and claims that she doesn't believe in God. She is going through a rebellion herself, denying that God exists. But He still is protecting her, she just can't see it. Take what happened to her last summer, for instance. She was on a drug called 'biscuit' (I'm not sure what that is to be honest, but she was taking it) It was the middle of the night and for some reason she alone and was walking across and intersetion of the highway that goes through town. A transport truck with two men in it pulled over to the side of the road and got out and chased her until they actually caught her. There was no one to see this happen. They were dragging her back to thier truck. She was helpless and knew she would probably never be seen alive again.

All of a sudden a car came down the highway and two guys got out. They rushed the truckdrivers, fought them and took my daughter back to thier car. It just so happens that those two young men were Christians and they witnessed to her at the same time. She thinks they were angels:>) But she still doesn't believe in God...but He is watching out for her all the same. She's as hard headed as her mother.

I believe that the Lord will bring her back to Him eventually.

I believe this...God treats those who are rebelling the same way a loving parent treats a child while they are rebelling. They don't lose thier place in the family, and the parents love them and hope that they come out the other side. God knows the when, how and where of the other side:>) His word does not come back to Him void. I don't believe that you can lose your salvation.

Those agnostics and athiests are hanging around worthy boards for a reason. Something in them wants to believe, is waiting for that right thing to be said to convice them. Something has happened to cause them doubt, but they still want to believe, or else they wouldn't be here.

[~~ angelique ~~]

the answer is YES. it's called apostasy, and you can read about it throughout scripture.

I searched for that word in the bible. Where is it?

look for "apostate". it may only be used in the KJV.

2 Thessalonians 2

The Great Apostasy

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Stand Fast

But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth, to which He called you by our gospel, for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.

Now may our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and our God and Father, who has loved us and given us everlasting consolation and good hope by grace, comfort your hearts and establish you in every good word and work.

Be Blessed!

Alan

Okay... I went and looked it up.... Another question then:

we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come.

I looked up what it meant to not be soon shaken in mind or troubled in mind.... Why are people that are shaken or troubled in mind the ones who fall away? Does this have something to do with being grounded or going to church? Why does it say "as if from us"? Does that mean that some things will be said from leaders of the church that could shake people's mind????

[~~ angelique ~~]

Well, I, for one, went down that very road. I was a preachers kid, raised in a very strict home with a very controling father with a temper:>) My father expected nothing less than perfection...to be seen and not heard...and weilded a belt to ensure that his kids were well behaved...and to excess. I will say that as a child I was saved, and of my own accord, perhaps more out of fear than anything else though...I'm not sure.

What ended up happening is that my siblings and I all see God as a harsh discplinarian who expects far more than we can give. Every aspect of our lives was guilt ridden, and we all suffer greatly from huge guilt complexes So we all became agnostics/athiests in our own way. I was saved as a child however, and knew my Bible very well.

At 14 I decided that I wasn't having it anymore. I started to rebel and openly tell my father that I did not believe in God. I was trying to escape the discipline, the guilt that was forever hung over my head...and I figured at that point that I would never make it to heaven anyway...after all if your father, who is a preacher can't love you then how can you ever expect to be loved by something so much bigger than your human father. It is difficult to explain and even harder for me to understand this logic myself, but it is there. Even to this day, and I have come back to the Lord.

I lived the "athiest" life for about ten years, vowing to prove to myself and everyone else that there was no God. After all, GOd had never spoken to me. Funniest thing was however, that my Christianity was so engrained in me that I remember calling out to God to 'prove' to me that he was real. And eventually He did, but that wasn't pretty. I had to go a real long ways away before it happened, and almost lost myself forever ( story I will not get into because it was very occultic and I really don't like to remember. )

But one day when I was 24 I got on my knees and claimed the blood, asked God to come inot my life once again. It was a miraculous event, and event that told me in no uncertain terms that God did exist. I'll never forget it!

Today I truly believe that God exists, I still have a difficult time with the idea that He can love me, but at the same time I have seen too many things that tell me he was always there in my life even when I was denying Him.

I believe that these athiests and agnostics are saved, but are going through denial, they are rebelling. I also believe that God is waiting for the day that they come back, and He will see that they do eventually. During this time in there lives He is protecting them in many ways like he did me. They have to hit thier rock bottom. Once we are born a child of God we are always a child of God, we are like a rebelling teenager. He still shows you that He is there in many ways however, but you can't see it at that time:>)

Take my daughter for instance. She is 18 and claims that she doesn't believe in God. She is going through a rebellion herself, denying that God exists. But He still is protecting her, she just can't see it. Take what happened to her last summer, for instance. She was on a drug called 'biscuit' (I'm not sure what that is to be honest, but she was taking it) It was the middle of the night and for some reason she alone and was walking across and intersetion of the highway that goes through town. A transport truck with two men in it pulled over to the side of the road and got out and chased her until they actually caught her. There was no one to see this happen. They were dragging her back to thier truck. She was helpless and knew she would probably never be seen alive again.

All of a sudden a car came down the highway and two guys got out. They rushed the truckdrivers, fought them and took my daughter back to thier car. It just so happens that those two young men were Christians and they witnessed to her at the same time. She thinks they were angels:>) But she still doesn't believe in God...but He is watching out for her all the same. She's as hard headed as her mother.

I believe that the Lord will bring her back to Him eventually.

I believe this...God treats those who are rebelling the same way a loving parent treats a child while they are rebelling. They don't lose thier place in the family, and the parents love them and hope that they come out the other side. God knows the when, how and where of the other side:>) His word does not come back to Him void. I don't believe that you can lose your salvation.

Those agnostics and athiests are hanging around worthy boards for a reason. Something in them wants to believe, is waiting for that right thing to be said to convice them. Something has happened to cause them doubt, but they still want to believe, or else they wouldn't be here.

You know... I could feel a loving understanding in your response. So, is it like the prodical son? He believed but left and the father allowed him back?