women to keep silent

[BlindSeeker]

Paul's exhortation to the pastor of Ephesus -

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for

instruction in righteousness

:

17 That the

man

of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

it seems though that Paul at times goes out of his way to let us know what is his opinion and what is strict doctrine, would you not agree.

and if that is the case, why does he do that? why does he make a distinction if we are not supposed to?

I only know of two places where Paul expressed his opinion, and that was concerning men remaining single to be free to serve the Lord in I Co 7:6 and believers remaining with willing unbelievers I Co 7:12

But as soon as he finished with his opinion, he stated "unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord . . . " Paul was very careful to state what was merely his opinion . . . because he knew as an apostle all his words would be authoritative.

1Co 7:6 But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment.

7 For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that.

8 I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I.

9 But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

10 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband:

11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.

14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

16 For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save thy husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save thy wife?

17 But as God hath distributed to every man, as the Lord hath called every one, so let him walk. And so ordain I in all churches.

I do not see where Paul "went out of his way yo let us know."

[EricH]

I only know of two places where Paul expressed his opinion, and that was concerning men remaining single to be free to serve the Lord in I Co 7:6 and believers remaining with willing unbelievers I Co 7:12

Actually I don't think 1 Cor 7:12 was Paul simply stating an opinion. In 1 Cor 7:12 he says this:

But to the rest I, not the Lord, say: If any brother has an unbelieving wife, and she is willing to live with him, he must not leave her.

1 Cor 7:12 HCSB

This statement does not reflect that it is simply his opinion. It is meant to communicate that everything he had taught on the subject so far could be found in Jesus' teachings in the gospels, but that this was a new command

[BlindSeeker]

I do not see where Paul "went out of his way yo let us know."

it seems to me that the phrase "Here is a trustworthy saying" also lets us know that it is not a command

also, two verses after he says,"yet not I, but the Lord", he goes back to....But to the rest speak I, not the Lord

So why don't you clearly cut and paste the verses (I assume you wouldn't call them scriptures) which you feel this learned, anointed, divinely called and illuminated servant of the Lord which labored more than all the other apostles was just giving an opinion to be embraced or rejected according to person preference.

[BlindSeeker]

I do not see where Paul "went out of his way yo let us know."

it seems to me that the phrase "Here is a trustworthy saying" also lets us know that it is not a command

also, two verses after he says,"yet not I, but the Lord", he goes back to....But to the rest speak I, not the Lord

So why don't you clearly cut and paste the verses (I assume you wouldn't call them scriptures) which you feel this learned, anointed, divinely called and illuminated servant of the Lord which labored more than all the other apostles was just giving an opinion to be embraced or rejected according to person preference.

why would I not call them scriptures? that is a heck of a leap you just took.

As for the verses in question...

I cor 7:

6 I say this as a concession, not as a command. 7I wish that all men were as I am. But each man has his own gift from God; one has this gift, another has that.

8 Now to the unmarried and the widows I say: It is good for them to stay unmarried, as I am. 9 But if they cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.

10 To the married I give this command (not I, but the Lord): A wife must not separate from her husband. 11 But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.

12 To the rest I say this (I, not the Lord): If any brother has a wife who is not a believer and she is willing to live with him, he must not divorce her

now, it seems to me that for one reason or another Paul has tried to make it very clear what was a command and what was not, that he has tried to make it very clear what he sees as personal opinion and what he sees as coming from God.

Why do you think that he did this?

3 times in I Tim Paul uses the statement....Here is a trustworthy saying.

Why do you think that he did this?

Do you think that everything written in the Bible is a command for all to follow?

Is this from Matt 18 meant to be a command for all followers of Christ....22 When Jesus heard this, he said to him, "You still lack one thing. Sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me." ?

Paul was addressing the church and laying the foundation for the church . . . is Apostle Paul trustworthy or not?

Matthew 18 Jesus was speaking directly to an individual.

[irishcowboy]

1 Timothy 2:8-15 The Message

8-10 Since prayer is at the bottom of all this, what I want mostly is for men to pray

[givennewname]

Yes, Eve was the first to be deceived, but Adam was with her, and he chose not to stop her..... and to beat all, when God asked Adam what he had done, rather then own up to the deed and take ownership of the task, he passed the buck......

It was that woman that YOU gave me.

He not only transfered the guilt towards the woman, but also towards God, and not even really touching on the issue at hand or answering the question that was originally asked.

not only did Adam do it, but this showed Eve, and she did the same thing with the serpent.

mike

I think it should also be pointed out that in a way Eve had a better defense that Adam did. she was tricked by the serpent, Adam made a choice between Eve and God.

Rubbish! Eve was offered the option of being like God and she took it. Pure and simple temptation whether she was tricked doesn'ttake away tha fact that she wanted to be like God. Hence the punishment

[givennewname]

Paul was addressing the church and laying the foundation for the church . . . is Apostle Paul trustworthy or not?

Yes, I think that Paul is trustworthy, I don

[BlindSeeker]

Paul was addressing the church and laying the foundation for the church . . . is Apostle Paul trustworthy or not?

Yes, I think that Paul is trustworthy, I don

[givennewname]

Paul's exhortation to the pastor of Ephesus -

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for

instruction in righteousness

:

17 That the

man

of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

it seems though that Paul at times goes out of his way to let us know what is his opinion and what is strict doctrine, would you not agree.

and if that is the case, why does he do that? why does he make a distinction if we are not supposed to?

It never said that PAul gave an opinion or his own opinion. Paul usually quotes from the OT, which he is well versed in... so it is scripture.

[BlindSeeker]

1. I would parallel the distinction of what Paul/God said to what Moses wrote (5 books) and God wrote with His finger. One was delegate authority, the other absolute authority. Simple chain of command scenario. The command was established written law, where Paul